power - worth it?
Agent Orange
Rennlist Member
Rennlist Member
Joined: Jun 2006
Posts: 16,250
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Did I say it pulls like crazy!?!
Race Car
Joined: Aug 2001
Posts: 4,922
Likes: 1
From: London, UK
As many know, I sold my extensively modified 964 last year as I had purchased a GT3 Mk1 and having three cars is just ridiculous. My point though is (and this relates to comparion with GT3, I couldn't see myself owning a standard 996 tbh...sorry...) that the 996GT3 platform is stiffer and more "capable" than the 964 will ever be unless of course it becomes a trackwhore from top to toe as others have said. In my particualr case I miss the following things about the 964 that the GT3 cannot replicate (in no particular order):
1. The Sound
2. In the case of my 964, the engine was severely modded with Motec and all kinds og goodies. This made for a responsiveness in terms of free-revving etc. that the GT3 cannot match.
3. The 964 gearbox. I far prefer the precise and chunky feel of the 964 box
In terms of performance, my 964 was definitely quicker than a 3.6 911 - although I think its pretty close in relation to the GT3. The 964 felt like it had more up the top-end of the rev range...whilst sacrificing a little at the low end. The new owner sold a 360 and purchased my car. He teels me that it doesn't feel any slower than the 360.....although very different...
My take on this is that I lost a lot of money on the 964, but it was a unique car at the end of the day. Should I have sold it? No. Do I regret it? Yes, but because it was unique, I could get another 964 tomorrow. Would I spend over £30K on another 964? Probably not.
I think you should have purchased my car when it was for sale (), and I may have to buy i tback from the current owner as it is. Do I think you should spend the money? Well, if you can afford to, take into consideration that you won't get more than half of it back if you do. Mind you, if you buy a £40K 911 Carrera now, you wouldn't get half back in 3-4 years time anyway.
1. The Sound
2. In the case of my 964, the engine was severely modded with Motec and all kinds og goodies. This made for a responsiveness in terms of free-revving etc. that the GT3 cannot match.
3. The 964 gearbox. I far prefer the precise and chunky feel of the 964 box
In terms of performance, my 964 was definitely quicker than a 3.6 911 - although I think its pretty close in relation to the GT3. The 964 felt like it had more up the top-end of the rev range...whilst sacrificing a little at the low end. The new owner sold a 360 and purchased my car. He teels me that it doesn't feel any slower than the 360.....although very different...
My take on this is that I lost a lot of money on the 964, but it was a unique car at the end of the day. Should I have sold it? No. Do I regret it? Yes, but because it was unique, I could get another 964 tomorrow. Would I spend over £30K on another 964? Probably not.
I think you should have purchased my car when it was for sale (
), and I may have to buy i tback from the current owner as it is. Do I think you should spend the money? Well, if you can afford to, take into consideration that you won't get more than half of it back if you do. Mind you, if you buy a £40K 911 Carrera now, you wouldn't get half back in 3-4 years time anyway.
Rennlist Member
Joined: Dec 2001
Posts: 455
Likes: 11
From: UK
The sensible option would be to sell it and get a GT3. You wouldn't then have to spend much money on modding it. Just maintain it and you should get most of your money back come resale.
If you enjoy the modding part of ownership (like I do) then I think modding a common garden C2 would just be a money pit IMO - better off sticking with the 964.
If you enjoy the modding part of ownership (like I do) then I think modding a common garden C2 would just be a money pit IMO - better off sticking with the 964.
Pro
Joined: Nov 2004
Posts: 526
Likes: 0
From: in the Hinterland
There is no comparison.
Your 964 has the GT-1 based, dry sump engine that is only used in the GT2, GT3 and twin turbos after the 993 era. [it is the stock block for 964,993 era]
A true, proven race motor with pedigree, and a great base for almost any kind of upgrades.
The 996/ 997, Boxster, and Cayman motor is an inferior wet sump Subaru motor.
Your 964 has the GT-1 based, dry sump engine that is only used in the GT2, GT3 and twin turbos after the 993 era. [it is the stock block for 964,993 era]
A true, proven race motor with pedigree, and a great base for almost any kind of upgrades.
The 996/ 997, Boxster, and Cayman motor is an inferior wet sump Subaru motor.
Pro
Joined: Dec 2007
Posts: 586
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Nordschleife Master
Joined: Feb 2007
Posts: 5,095
Likes: 3
From: Cheshire, UK
Next time you're at a trackday park in a garage next to regular 996 and see which car gets the most attention. It won't be the silver/grey* water cooled one. And you know for a fact from our little day out at Curborough circuit, that they aren't faster than yours.
*I believe most of them are this colour.
*I believe most of them are this colour.
Rennlist Member
Joined: Jan 2009
Posts: 2,518
Likes: 0
From: Washington, DC
Next time you're at a trackday park in a garage next to regular 996 and see which car gets the most attention. It won't be the silver/grey* water cooled one. And you know for a fact from our little day out at Curborough circuit, that they aren't faster than yours.
*I believe most of them are this colour.
*I believe most of them are this colour.
A 996 OTOH looks like an Accord.
RL Technical Advisor
Joined: May 2001
Posts: 11,870
Likes: 75
From: Portland Oregon
Instructor
Joined: Jul 2008
Posts: 155
Likes: 0
From: Sydney, Australia
Rennlist Member
Joined: Nov 2006
Posts: 2,748
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demon,
My $.02:
I bought my car three years ago. What I bought (GP white C2 coupe), and what I've done to it since then (just about everything) have been about one thing: me. Like you and Stig, all it takes is to walk by it parked in the garage, lean in and smell it, or even better sit in it, and it will make my day. Sick?: hell yes. But I don't gamble, I don't do drugs (anymore
), and I don't have a mistress (at least the two-legged variety), although I DO drink!
With what I've spent in dollars, I could probably buy any (non-race) 996 on the used-car market, including GT3s and Turbos. I've seen what they can do on track. I've also seen first hand an ex-pro race driver take a basically stock 964 and shame everyone in an advanced DE group (996 GT3s included).
It doesn't really matter what I drive on a track, there will always be someone 'faster' than me (most likely in a car that's supposed to be 'slower' than mine). So I might as well drive what I WANT to drive, and learn to do the best I can with it. IMHO, our cars (and perhaps most folks' cars on Rennlist) are a reflection of us. There's nothing rational about it. The hard part, it seems to me, is to not get caught up in "the grass is always greener" mentality (BTDT!).
Please forgive the miscellaneous ramblings. Now, GO SIT IN YOUR CAR!
Regards,
Dave
My $.02:
I bought my car three years ago. What I bought (GP white C2 coupe), and what I've done to it since then (just about everything) have been about one thing: me. Like you and Stig, all it takes is to walk by it parked in the garage, lean in and smell it, or even better sit in it, and it will make my day. Sick?: hell yes. But I don't gamble, I don't do drugs (anymore
), and I don't have a mistress (at least the two-legged variety), although I DO drink! With what I've spent in dollars, I could probably buy any (non-race) 996 on the used-car market, including GT3s and Turbos. I've seen what they can do on track. I've also seen first hand an ex-pro race driver take a basically stock 964 and shame everyone in an advanced DE group (996 GT3s included).
It doesn't really matter what I drive on a track, there will always be someone 'faster' than me (most likely in a car that's supposed to be 'slower' than mine). So I might as well drive what I WANT to drive, and learn to do the best I can with it. IMHO, our cars (and perhaps most folks' cars on Rennlist) are a reflection of us. There's nothing rational about it. The hard part, it seems to me, is to not get caught up in "the grass is always greener" mentality (BTDT!).
Please forgive the miscellaneous ramblings. Now, GO SIT IN YOUR CAR!
Regards,
Dave
Instructor
Joined: May 2006
Posts: 164
Likes: 1
Viggo - Thank you,sir! BTW, were you ever able to find a good deal on Pole Positions (et. al.) on your side of the pond?
Geoffrey - I don't know if you intended it, but I literally laughed out loud at your response, given what I've heard about standard 996 motors...
Happy Hump Day, everyone!
Geoffrey - I don't know if you intended it, but I literally laughed out loud at your response, given what I've heard about standard 996 motors...
Happy Hump Day, everyone!