warmfuzzies

http://forums1.roadfly.org/porsche/f...4959457-1.html

courtesy of the Pistonheads forum UK.


Kevin

schlicht911

Hi Kevin,

hujujuuujuu.. this is the first time i read like this about the K&N Filters...

graham_mitchell

Someone in the 993 forum dynoed a car before and after adding a K&N and it made less power with the K&N.

Some people are spending money on making their cars slower.

There is also the problem that the rubber surround has been known to disintegrate and enter the engine.

And the story you linked to.

Not good...

investlt

Here's another K&N filter thread......

K&N notes from Pelican

I personally won't be going to a K&N any time soon.....

joey bagadonuts

I don't mean to generalize (and I hope no one takes offense) but let me tell you my experience with pre-964 or water-cooled owners--they're cheap. They hate to spend money on upgrades and will come up with any rationale to justify being cheap.

They love to pick on vendors, too, that try to squeeze money out of their cheap little hands. SmartRacing constantly comes up with new and better products for their cars but no, those new Fox shocks and adjustable sway bars are just pricey gimmicks created to make SmartRacing rich. Nevermind that they support numerous podium finishers in PCA Club Racing.

As for 964's and 993's, they aren't REAL 911's according to the cheap set. They don't have torsion bars, unassisted steering or that classic look. Give me a break! If I wanted outdated handling, according-style bumper trim, honda-like torque or crap brakes, I would've bought a pre-964 911 ... but I'm not cheap.

If you look at that Pelican thread, you'll see what I'm talking about. Lots of anecdotal commentary--zero substance. Someone made an intelligent comment, IMHO, and of course some clown started nit picking.
I hear similar comments from 964 owners because they ARE willing to "splurge" on dyno runs and like to stick to the facts.

Maybe some day I will be the guy who comes, hat in hand, and explains how his cone filter screwed up his engine. But when I do, I'll have leakdown numbers provided by my high-priced wrench to support this conclusion because I like facts and I'm not cheap.

And BTW, have you noticed what kind of filters many of the tuners slap on the latest 996's? People who make a living out of extracting more power from these cars. Yeah, those horrible cones filters. What could they be thinking?!

Doug H

Hehehe.

Jeff Curtis

Good rationale Joey, I think you covered a fair percentage of people that would respond to such a post in a negative way...they either don't know what they're talking about, or they're cheap and want to somehow justify why they don't perform a particular upgrade.

ALTHOUGH...since donning my K&N filter I have experienced bowl cramping, loss of sexual drive and poor gas mileage.

Sarcastic WARNING: LOOK OUT!! ...if I PASS you at the track, beware - bits of my K&N may fly out and block your oil cooler! (the rubber around the edge disintegrates ya know)

#64 1991 Porsche 911 C2 - K&N Airfilter x2years
#68 1996 SVC Toyota WSR - K&N Airfilter x1year

...BOTH still going strong!!

investlt

Joey and Jeff

You both make great points. Cone filters are kind of like religion; you either love them, hate them or don't care less about them. I am attempting to keep my C2 as close to stock as I can, which means a stock filter for me. I won't even be drilling holes in my filter box top. Of course, being a new 964 owner that might change when I do my first DE and want to squeeze as much hp out of my targa as possible. Only time will tell.

Arjan B.

I think that stock filter will filter better. But.... A cotton air filter is o.k. to use as long you use it the right way. The right way is just the right amount of oil on it, not too much, not to less. When I look at my Green filter [K&N competition] after 2 years, Hardly dirty, air filter box clean ahead of the filter[no dust]

When I would live in the desert, then I would worry a bit more with all the sand, but here in Europe I think it's hardly a problem.

I will start a topic about milage/Cotton or stock filter use.

Arjan B.

Oh yes, Why do all racing teams, Formula 1 teams and Rally teams use them? Because their good!

914und993

Racing and rally teams rarely (never ever?) rebuild engines because after several years of use increased dust intake has caused premature engine wear. Thats because their engines are longevity limited by more immediate factors and their engines are renewed far, far more frequently.

Rally teams may also prefer non-paper filters because as paper filters fill with dirt, they become more restrictive (though actually filtering better). That might slow the car down. Oiled media filters filter less efficiently as they absorb dust, and are probably less restrictive when filled with dirt than paper filters. That would be good for the race team, because they would probably rather keep the power than worry about whether their engine will last another 10,000 miles.

My point is that the concerns of Forumula 1 and Rally teams may not exactly match the concerns of the street car owner who hopes to hang onto his car for an extended period with a minimum of cost.

Chip

America

joey bagadonuts,

I don't respond to much on this forum as most of us just read them, but i have to agree with you that alot of Porsche guys are cheap(or at least the guy with older cars 964 included). If aftermarket products were cheap then the Porsche would be in the categorgy of a rice rocket. Yes, were getting ripped off with the high prices but you can't expect a vender to mass produce a part for a 964 and have 95% of the product left over because there are not enough cars to go around.

The reason I purchased a Porsche is because the maintenance was cheaper than a Ferrari. Ask anyone that owns one and they cough up a good $3-6K a year easily. If you can't afford a Ferari buy a Porsche and if you can't afford a Porsche buy a Mustang. I can go on forever, but bottom line is "CHEAP".

joey bagadonuts

Now THAT'S an excellent point and solid excuse for being cheap! But if they were really serious about it, they should also change their oil every three months, not every 3,000 miles, as recommend by the author of "Drive It Forever". But I'm sure there's a cheap reason not to do that, either.

And thank you, America, for your $0.02. I agree completely. These are Porsches. They're expensive to run. What did these people expect?

warmfuzzies

F 1 do use paper based systems for filtering, a very neat example of their use and adaption to differing environments was show three weeks ago in Bahrain......

kevin.

Though I still have no idea whether one is better than the other, I just wished to share some knowledge, not controversey.....ahhhhhhhh

joey bagadonuts

No, I appreciate the knowledge and testimonial from the race mechanic. Good stuff, really. And I definitely wouldn't put him in the same bucket as those "enthusiasts" passing on misinformation in their quest to save a buck.