DDP

Thanks for sharing, Chris. Post up the next dyno with the higher boost pressure when you get there!

AL951

Chris, is the cylinder head lift more common on 8v head that the 16v?............It seems to be.

Regards,
AL

333pg333

It's possibly the opposite due to greater CFM of the 16v head but there aren't many 3L 16v turbos to check up on. Also, most 16v turbos would be running standalone ECU where the tuner has much greater control.

Be interested to know what other supporting parts are on that motor Chris?

FT_Factorytuned

Chris, you're funny! Trying to get the Porsche guys into superleggra! Only MCT can do that. I'm guessing you got that GIANT 5 AXIS/w trunion and your tool and die guy worked out!

I have other ideas for the cylinder head. Not listed here! But, Wills rings are nice and one of the only true fixes, ur, if there is one in conjunction with..... Engineering.. Integrating an asymmetric lab seal would work as well with the wide fire ring gasket. top and bottom end studs as well as fully pinned head and crank ladder and balance shaft housings would shore it up pretty well. I think it was one of the newer Cosi motors that coupled the bottom end and top end with the same studs using a pin and sleeve system. May have been some other dedicated race motor manu.. What none of these solutions can thwart cylinder wall elastic deformation, bulging, and other elastic issues that are caused by too much heat, boost, and pressure. That requires a fully closed deck. The 951 block was never intended for 500hp and +20psi, and will not give reliable perf for extended periods under those constant conditions. There will always be some mystery issue crop up.

I have crank ladder pins and studs on the website, these are super alloy. Use requires block and crank ladder machining obviously. I'm not really "offering" these they were designed for the CNO B&BP build, I'm, ur, working on. If I can ever stop designing S%!T and start putting some of these cool parts together..

I'd like to see a Bugatti style billet block for the 951 roll out of someone’s mill indeed! It's not going to be mine however... A head maybe.

blown 944

Update:

So far the widefire is holding. I made about 10 3 gear pulls tonight and no coolant to be seen. I was worried because I saw smoke but found that my last re-use of the cam tower gasket didn't work out. Nice little leak at the rear. Fortunately, that is and easy fix. I can also do a re-torque to check it out. So far holding 18-19 psi well.

I hope it holds as I have a new cam I want to try out soon.

Tom M'Guinn

ARP studs at 100 ft. lbs. and less timing?

Duke

Sorry but wrong. Cylinder pressure is nothing without RPM. You can have a million PSI of cylinder pressure at 10 rpm and it won't make you fast.
If you want a fast car you need as high average POWER as possible under the curve.
But let's not turn this into a hp vs torque thread. That horse is by far too beaten!!

reno808

Thats not true what about Diesel engines?!?!

dnovak

I was under the impression from all of my diesel buddies and my own engines that all of the power in a diesel comes from the serious amount of rotating mass and stroke and that is one more reason for a very low red line.

Chris White

Its real more of a left brain function than a right brain function….so yeah, its mostly not in my right mind….

The funny thing is that the president of the club that I know of that came up with the ‘Porsche engine only” DE rule has a Ruf….which is not technically a Porsche. Sometimes being a snob can bite you in the ***!

Chris White

I wish I had the machining power to do it in house…I am using a shop that specializes in billet block work. We are cloud point scanning an original block to get all the attachment point data and then CAD designing the internals to suit the task. Forged billet made of a job specific alloy, heat treated after machining. They really know their stuff, they supply parts for top fuel, F1, Nascar and Off road teams

Damn it man – this is racing, we don’t have time for any stinking engineering!

[quote=FT_Factorytuned;9303608]
What none of these solutions can thwart cylinder wall elastic deformation, bulging, and other elastic issues that are caused by too much heat, boost, and pressure. That requires a fully closed deck. /QUOTE]

The Darton MID sleeves have successfully dealt with those specific cylinder issues….but more things start to pop up when you get around 600hp!
Ok, I do the block you do the head….its a deal!
Instead of a Cosworth it could be a whitmond or a LeWhite…..

Chris White

Diesel has a slower combustion rate than gasoline – combine that with larger bores of most diesels and the combustion rate limits max RPM.

You can tell your diesel buddies that their slower deflargartion rates inhibit their maximum reciprocating potential. Then and a yehaw and a good spit!

Chris White

There are a couple of things that the 16v has going for it –
More detonation ‘friendly’ – any detonation will cause a big spike in combustion chamber pressures – if you survive the initial detonation the pressures will cause head lift. 8V engines are almost always right on the edge of detonation if you push the timing for peak power.
Shorter head studs – because of the raised floor of the 16v block the studs are shorter. With the same amount of clamping force the shorter head studs will stretch less given the same combustion chamber pressure (this is a really small difference…but it is a difference)

To start with the block is being designed to work with all stock part attachment points. But unlike a cast product it does not take much to modify the Cad/Cam file to support anything. That is one of the really nice things about the Cad/Cam billet block process – options can be implemented without retooling!

m73m95

So, what you're trying to explain here is that the new block will be inexpensive?

Duke

A billet block would be very cool but without a billet head to allow for a new clamping design with more head studs per cylinder I don't really see how it would do much to reduce head lift issues.

I like the sealing setup the UK firm (JMG/9xx IIRC) made for their 3.2 liters:
https://rennlist.com/forums/944-turb...-the-road.html