drsimon

Has anyone changed the stock A-arm for the Charlie billet A-arm? What is your experience with it especially in terms of handling and ride quality (NVH - noise, vibration, harshness)? I have read that it improves handling because of its improved strength and lightness but ride quality deteriorates with increased noise and vibration. The rubber bushings of the stock A-arms of my 1988 Silver Rose Turbo S are showing their age and disintegrating. I can take the easy, and cheaper, way out by replacing the bushings but am seriously considering upgrading to the Charlie arms before the ball joints give way. Anyone out there who has "been there, done that"?

Luke

I know they are FAR superior, and neccessary to run with a heavy roll bar. If I had $1,600 laying around I would deffinately invest in them!

Robby

Can you replace just the bushings themselves, or do you have to change the whole A-arm? I was told that you had to replace the whole arm, a long time ago. I've been toying w/the idea of Charlie arms myself, but just don't have the cash, so I'm thinking about rebuilt units- if I can replace the bushings only, then that would save another $300 or so...

jason952

I considered the charley arms since my mechanic sells 'em, but it was just too much $ right now, esp since the left side was the only one loose. Instead they had a spare M030-spec control arm that I had rebuilt for the car with an new bushing. To tell them apart, the bushing p/n will end in .31 or .30 vs .10 or .01 for the regular arms. Please correct if I am mistaken here but apparently the harder M030 bushings aren't compatible with the regular non-M030 arms; this was the impression the rebuilder gave me as to the difference in the arms.
As you may have noticed, most places that sell rebuilt units usually say: "*except M030". This seemed the only way to get around the expense of a new arm, which is comparable to the charley price and a no brainer for longevity's sake.
I thought Dynamic European did a really good job with them. After the r/r and a 4-wheel, the car drove great this morning!

jason952

This is an old thread but here's some cool news. Porsche just replaced my R control arm for free. I have a silver rose turbo S and I took it in for the fuel hose recall that never got done. There was another campaign on the car, which was to inspect the control arms. I have already had the left rebuilt, as I said in my old post. the right was original and they replaced it free! 700 dollar part. Anyhow, I think if I come up with the original on the left, they will replace that one free too. The down side, they completely etched my nice aluminum club sport wheels with cheapo wheel cleaner, not to good for bare aluminum. happy and pissed,

Jason

jason952

you can call pcna, give them your VIN and ask about recall campaign # AK02 for the a-arm and AK03 for the fuel line

Konstantin

markus Blazzak control Arm is at leats as strong as teh charie but much cheaper

Konstantin

Tom Pultz

I considered installing the Charlie Arms at the same time as my M030 spindle installation but after speaking with the manufacturer I was not very optimistic they would survive on the street without a lot of maintenance, especially in the Seattle rain.

They told me the lack of a rubber boot would allow moisture and grit to work it's way down into the ball joint and that over time it would see more wear than a normal joint. I suppose you could avoid a problem by just replacing the joints periodically since they are replacable.

Another problem is the inner spherical joints. If they react anything like the spherical joints in my Racer's Edge camber plates these will add a lot of noise and harshness.

I would love to hear comments from someone that actually has these a-arms in their car.

Sloth

Perhaps a poor comparison at best. I have them on my 86 951 track car. I notice no noises coming from the front. Can not comment on additional harshness as the car has coilovers and has been lowered, hard bushings, spherical bearings, camber plates, et al.

IMHO...
I would not bother with the upgrade unless I was tracking the car (race or DE). If the car is going to be tracked I would certainly encourage the upgrade for safety, if not your own safety then for mine (or anybody elses that shares the track at the same time).

special tool

I have them also. I orinally had them installed with m030 castor blocks and I did notice slighly more directness when I switched to Racer's Edge castor blocks.

jason952

to reiterate:

[quote] Porsche just replaced my R control arm for free. I have a silver rose turbo S and I took it in for the fuel hose recall that never got done. There was another campaign on the car, which was to inspect the control arms. I have already had the left rebuilt, as I said in my old post. the right was original and they replaced it free! 700 dollar part. <hr></blockquote>

Just a heads up,

jason

Robby

So Jason, does this mean that the part was RE-CALLED, or that if someone's parts wear out, then they will then be replaced? I'm going to check w/my dealer this week. Thanks for the post. Also, I do assume that new bushings came w/the a-arms? Also, the "fuel hose?" That sounds kind of important there Considering the rash of recent fires....

jason952

call pcna and see if those campaigns have been done to your car. Sounded like only a limited # of control arms are being replaced which includes bushings and all.

951Racer

Jason952, do you have a lowered car? I would be impressed if Porsche replaced your control arms for a car that has a user changed suspension geometry!

I would say there are 5 options now for control arm issues.
1. Replace them with stock rebuilt ones - probably the cheapest but this does not remedy the geometry problem with lowered cars. You are still placing serious pressures on what is basically a glued ball joint.
2. I have seen advertisements for performance stock control arms where they claim to have increased strength. I have no experience with these so reserve my opinion.
3. You can purchase Lindsey Racing's new suspension geometry kit. This kit basically removes the pressure on the control arm by extending the ball joint and tie rod pin. You will still need to replace the control arms if they are in need of replacement, but this should be a lot cheaper that Charlie Arms, and you get the original suspension geometry to boot.
4. The first replacement control arms were from FABCAR. I actually have no experience with these but have heard good and bad about them. Since Charlies Arms came out, I have not heard of many people using them.
5. Finally, the most expensive option is to go with Charlie Arms. They are wholesaled at $1300 for volume dealers who almost always sell them at the going price of $1600. To install them you will need to drill out your spindle in order to accept the larger ball pin. This means removing the spindle assembly and taking them to a machine shop that can do this. A good shop will be able to do this easily without having to disassemble the spindle completely. The rest is no different from removing and installing the stock control arms. You can do all this with or without replacing any of the bushings for sway bar and caster control.

One bit of interesting news that I heard just this week is that they are coming out with a "model 2" Charlie Arm to beef up the sway bar connection point. Evidently there have been some failures at that point when under severe pressures. I have never seen or heard about this, but it came from a reliable source.

Chris Bennet

My car failed inspection in December because the ball joints were loose. I got brand new ones for something like $247 each from Hendicks Porsche.
-Chris