Notices
944 Turbo and Turbo-S Forum 1982-1991
Sponsored by:
Sponsored by: Clore Automotive

Anyone experience external leakage from Cometic head gaskets ?

Thread Tools
 
Search this Thread
 
Old 12-30-2009, 09:20 AM
  #16  
Chris White
Addict
Rennlist Member

Rennlist Small
Business Sponsor

 
Chris White's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2001
Location: Marietta, NY
Posts: 7,505
Likes: 0
Received 36 Likes on 27 Posts
Default

Evans coolant - boiling point at zero PSI = 375f !!
Lots of good things about the Evans coolant, it can be a pain to switch over a used engine since all the old coolant has to be flushed out.

I have not had an oil leak on a Cometic gasket - but virtually all th egaskets I have used are on newly machined blaocks / heads. The coolant 'ear' can be a little bit of a pain - a thin film of sealant helps there.
Old 12-30-2009, 09:32 AM
  #17  
toddk911
Drive-by provocation guy
Rennlist Member
 
toddk911's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2002
Location: NAS PAX River, by way of Orlando
Posts: 10,439
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes on 0 Posts
Default

Originally Posted by Cory9584
26psi so far with arp studs.
26 psi....love it!!!!

You running E85?
Old 12-30-2009, 11:19 AM
  #18  
Willard Bridgham 3
Addict
Rennlist Member

 
Willard Bridgham 3's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2001
Location: Parral, Chihuahua, Mejico
Posts: 929
Likes: 0
Received 4 Likes on 4 Posts
Default

Just some real data. Water has higher specific heat, lower film coefficient, lower viscosity than any glycol-based coolant including Evans. Given this data, water is a better coolant.
Old 12-30-2009, 11:58 AM
  #19  
Chris White
Addict
Rennlist Member

Rennlist Small
Business Sponsor

 
Chris White's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2001
Location: Marietta, NY
Posts: 7,505
Likes: 0
Received 36 Likes on 27 Posts
Default

Originally Posted by Willard Bridgham 3
Just some real data. Water has higher specific heat, lower film coefficient, lower viscosity than any glycol-based coolant including Evans. Given this data, water is a better coolant.
True points (As always Willard knows his engineering!)...but significantly less system pressure is a benefit for ‘older’ plumbing components and the ability to avoid localized vaporization (common in 951 heads due to hot spots) as well as a reduction in cavitation issues may be more of a plus than reduction in specific heat.

I am not sure that the viscosity in an issue in the coolant system, we are not trying to get high flow rates and the mechanical pump is well up to the task. If you were converting to an electric pump I might have some concerns.
Old 12-30-2009, 12:23 PM
  #20  
Adonay
Rennlist Member
 
Adonay's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2009
Location: norway and or sweden
Posts: 844
Received 12 Likes on 9 Posts
Default

am not sure that the viscosity in an issue in the coolant system, we are not trying to get high flow rates and the mechanical pump is well up to the task. If you were converting to an electric pump I might have some concerns.
Thats a interesting point what about the turbo waterpump thats electric..
Old 12-30-2009, 12:36 PM
  #21  
Chris White
Addict
Rennlist Member

Rennlist Small
Business Sponsor

 
Chris White's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2001
Location: Marietta, NY
Posts: 7,505
Likes: 0
Received 36 Likes on 27 Posts
Default

Originally Posted by Adonay
Thats a interesting point what about the turbo waterpump thats electric..
The turbo pump does not see any significant pressure drop.
The mechanical water pump can see quite a bit of pressure differential. For example on a small block Chevy race engine it is not uncommon to see block pressures of 50psi. I would not be surprised to see similar numbers in our engines – the water passages from the block to the head are fairly small – significant restrictions. No such restrictions for the turbo coolant pump.
Old 12-30-2009, 01:00 PM
  #22  
theedge
Addict
Rennlist Member
 
theedge's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2003
Location: Canada, Eh?
Posts: 14,242
Likes: 0
Received 3 Likes on 3 Posts
Default

Originally Posted by Willard Bridgham 3
Just some real data. Water has higher specific heat, lower film coefficient, lower viscosity than any glycol-based coolant including Evans. Given this data, water is a better coolant.
In general yes, but when you include the boiling points into it.... Which reduces system pressures and avoids localized hot spots which can lead to detonation.... And Evans is a "life time coolant".

Each has its strong suits.
Old 12-30-2009, 03:01 PM
  #23  
toddk911
Drive-by provocation guy
Rennlist Member
 
toddk911's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2002
Location: NAS PAX River, by way of Orlando
Posts: 10,439
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes on 0 Posts
Default

So what is actually dropping the pressures in the system by using Evans? Just the fact that there is no water to steam/pressurize?

I was going to ask the water/latent heat question also but figured worst case you only drain the Evans during the summer and re use, or treat it as a once a year $40 expense for the cooling system. Again, pretty cheap insurance as the "hot spot" issue is very prominent in our cars as Chris confirms; and he is the internals GENIUS of the 951 motor.
Old 12-30-2009, 06:14 PM
  #24  
Cory9584
Drifting
 
Cory9584's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2005
Posts: 2,571
Likes: 0
Received 2 Likes on 2 Posts
Default

Originally Posted by toddk911
26 psi....love it!!!!

You running E85?
Race gas, there is no e85 around here yet.
Old 12-31-2009, 09:36 AM
  #25  
Chris White
Addict
Rennlist Member

Rennlist Small
Business Sponsor

 
Chris White's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2001
Location: Marietta, NY
Posts: 7,505
Likes: 0
Received 36 Likes on 27 Posts
Default

Originally Posted by toddk911
So what is actually dropping the pressures in the system by using Evans? Just the fact that there is no water to steam/pressurize?
Yep, the system pressure (as measured at the ‘radiator’ cap on the expansion tank) is caused by the expansion of the coolant – as liquids approach the point of vaporization they expand, at vaporization they expand a crap load. Water based coolants are run right near the point of vaporization, in fact they rely on the sealed nature of the system to prevent vaporization – this is why you NEVER remove a cap on a hot sealed system. The Evans coolant does not vaporize until 375f unpressurized so there is very little pressure in a system running at typical temp ranges.

Originally Posted by toddk911
I was going to ask the water/latent heat question also but figured worst case you only drain the Evans during the summer and re use, or treat it as a once a year $40 expense for the cooling system.
Not sure why you would want to drain it on a regular basis…you can add the Evans coolant in the engine and just leave it ‘forever’!

Originally Posted by toddk911
pretty cheap insurance as the "hot spot" issue is very prominent in our cars as Chris confirms; and he is the internals GENIUS of the 951 motor.
Now you are going to make me blush…

One interesting note about the Evans coolant – if you spill some on the engine and it runs down into the wonderful areas that like to hold liquids (like the drives side balance shaft cover) it will stay there forever smelling like hot coolant! Because the vaporization temp is so high it will never evaporate off like normal water / coolant. The stuff will sit there and smell like coolant forever! The first time I used the Evans coolant I did this and kept wondering why the engine always smelled of coolant – I looked for leaks everywhere. Finally I wash down the engine with a lot of water and it diluted the Evans enough that it filly evaporated the next time the engine got hot…

The other word of warning is that this stuff is slicker than snot on wet concrete….!
Old 12-31-2009, 12:00 PM
  #26  
theedge
Addict
Rennlist Member
 
theedge's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2003
Location: Canada, Eh?
Posts: 14,242
Likes: 0
Received 3 Likes on 3 Posts
Default

Originally Posted by toddk911
So what is actually dropping the pressures in the system by using Evans? Just the fact that there is no water to steam/pressurize?

I was going to ask the water/latent heat question also but figured worst case you only drain the Evans during the summer and re use, or treat it as a once a year $40 expense for the cooling system. Again, pretty cheap insurance as the "hot spot" issue is very prominent in our cars as Chris confirms; and he is the internals GENIUS of the 951 motor.
You wouldnt use it as a once a year thing... It will work in all weather. Ive used it in -15-20F. Its also a lifetime coolant, it should last for over 500,000 miles. It just changed color with age and heat.
Old 12-31-2009, 01:13 PM
  #27  
adrial
Nordschleife Master
 
adrial's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2001
Location: Northern NJ
Posts: 7,426
Likes: 0
Received 1 Like on 1 Post
Default

Mine leaks from the high pressure oil passage that brings oil up to the head (exhaust side, rear of engine). This is with the 2nd gasket and increasing the torque to i think 70 ft lbs (this was a year ago) with ARP Studs. Block and head were both milled ...

Thumbs down for Cometic at this point for me.



Quick Reply: Anyone experience external leakage from Cometic head gaskets ?



All times are GMT -3. The time now is 08:46 PM.