fourside

Just trying to get an idea what this problem might be. The previous owner of my car suggested a few things that might be draining the battery but I haven't checked them out yet... I will now. But the problem has gotten a lot worse so I figured I'd post the symptoms.

The battery drains verrrry quickly. It was to the point where I'd park it and I'd be lucky if it would start several hours later, but yesterday I drove the car to Spencer (V2Rocket_aka944) to have some work done and I had to:
-Jump it to drive it to him
-He had to jump it as soon as we left
-I think he had to jump it a few other times
-We jumped it to leave his house
-Pulled over for gas and needed to jump it

I was merging onto a highway and as soon as I got on I realized I suddenly had no power. I looked at the dash and it said the battery level was in the red. I pulled over and waited a minute to try starting it up again and it buzzed like usual when it's out of juice.

Then I get it home by tow truck and try to jump it to get it to the driveway, and it won't jump start - at the very most it runs for a second and then stumbles and dies.

Any ideas? It was suggested that it may be the alternator brushes so I imagine I'll check out those first.

V2Rocket

for some clarity when i jumped the car to move it from the street into my driveway (<----) i let it run for a little bit (battery gauge read about 12v) and then shut it off so i could put it on jacks. out of curiosity i put my multimeter across the battery and less than 30 seconds after shutting the car off it was down to 10.5 volts and dropping fast, like a tenth of a volt every 3 seconds.

KuHL 951

You have a direct short somewhere on an unfused circuit if you can watch the battery drop 100mv every 3 seconds. The only way you are going to find an intermittent current drain is measuring it with an ammeter across the battery negative. If pulling 1 fuse at a time doesn't change the drain then it's an unfused circuit like the alarm, alternator, starter, or a high resistance contact to ground on a always hot circuit like battery positive, starter to alternator, or under the fuse box. I never had the problems you are having so something has changed since last month. Have you used the alarm or has it ever triggered on you for no reason? Try this. When the battery is fully charged close all the doors and hood and set the alarm with the remote; if it sounds an alarm within a minute or so you have a bad switch somewhere (doors, hood, hatch) I can't believe you haven't replaced that door switch yet Joe. That was the first thing I said you needed to do. With so many circuits and switches that can drain the battery you have to start at the ones you already know are bad.

It should be charging above 13V if the alternator is working right. It sounds to me like the battery is not charging so the alternator is the top suspect especially if you are only seeing 12V at idle.

fourside

Steve, I know you told me to replace the door switch but I've only just now started being not so busy since we're done with the move (which is the main reason I'm essentially working on all of the problems I know about now - motor mounts (done), fuel smell, battery drainage, exhaust leak, A/C, etc). At almost the same time I started noticing the battery drainage problem I noticed the fuel smell I posted about. The shop that looked at the car was told to look for the fuel smell and what was causing the battery drainage, and I did mention the door switch but they didn't seem to think that was the problem. I'll try to replace it this weekend for good measure. The shop I think suspected the alternator more than anything. And yes, I only see 12V at idle.

KuHL 951

You usually don't need to replace the entire alternator unless a bearing has failed or it's screeching. Just replacing the voltage regulator module/brushes will restore it to full charging 95% of the time. It's also a lot cheaper. You have a 951 now so time to buy a decent voltmeter...it should come with these cars like spare fuses I'm not sure how difficult it is to replace the VR on a turbo; my 83 was pretty easy though. There's definitely more plumbing on a 951.

V2Rocket

steve, did you wire in that beast of a fuse next to the battery which is labeled 150 Amps? what the hell is that for lol

on the alarm on the car now is the immobilizer (second keyhole) disabled?

and i do agree with the "pull one fuse at a time", although that could take a while. (constantly rejumping lol)

its going to be a major bitch and a half to get to the alternator so although it costs more for the parts it will save alot of time to replace the whole alternator with VR included, and then you dont have to worry about a bearing failing for quite some time.

KuHL 951

Actually from what you describe it does sound more like a under-charging alternator. When the car is driven it is probably drawing more current than the alternator can replace thereby drawing on the battery rather than charging it. I didn't drive at night very often but headlights/stereo will suck a good battery down if the alt isn't doing it's job. Before Joe picked up the car I replaced the ignition switch and charged the battery. It held perfect for 10 days and I drove it a couple times in that period. The car sat with a fully charged battery and the voltage stayed above 12.6V the whole time. Having the battery drain down now after driving a lot sure sounds like an alternator problem. Another thing to check is does the overhead light work as it's supposed to? Does it come on when switched in either direction with the doors closed? If so, there's a bad door switch. The DS door switch is really iffy as I said. Good luck and give me a call if you want, Joe's got my number.

fourside

I'll check out pricing on a rebuilt alternator, that does seem to make some sense price-wise. Obviously wouldn't want a bearing failing soon after getting to the alternator to replace the VR.

Also going to order those switches tomorrow, Steve. Just to be sure: it was the PS window switch and the DS door light switch?

By the way, Spencer does good work - the car idled much smoother after I had him put the new mounts in and he saved me quite a bit of money. I'd definitely use him again.

KuHL 951

It was the DS door switch and the PS window switch on the drivers side panel. I don't think the window switch is bad since I've swapped them around several times and the same switch position doesn't operate the PS window...it's probably in the socket at that switch on the DS or where it connects on the PS window switch. It's always been that way I just never got around to sorting it out.


PS: Did you ever get any film shots transferred to digital? You need some new photos. Watching your dad pump gas in your avatar isn't that exciting

V2Rocket

the dying alternator i could understand causing the drawdown on the battery, but as joe said he was driving it and it got to the point where the car ran out of electricity and couldnt run anymore. i think if the battery got to the point that it was run down that much, it might affect its ability to recharge and/or hold a charge.

however if it was something relatively power-hungry (maybe all the interior lights and stuff associated with the door switch) it would cause it to draw but even those lights and whatnot should only be in the milliamps draw...
$209 at pelican
http://www.pelicanparts.com/catalog/..._pg1.htm#item0

fourside

I know As soon as I've got the car sorted out I'll definitely do a day of shooting. I can't believe that was the only one I got...

$209 for the alternator isn't too bad, I'd probably opt to replace the whole alternator rather than just the VR. Makes sense to me.

KuHL 951

If the battery was already low and he drove it without any charging taking place it can drain a battery past the point where it can operate the DME. It takes more than a few milliamps to run, supply ignition, power the fuel pump, cooling fans, etc. If you had a draw or short that took that much juice you would either have a fire, smoke, or blow some electrical component.

V2Rocket

not being an expert in the DME wiring (still exploring that), the key in the ignition at "on" position (not cranking) the gauges all come on, the battery gauge is in the red etc. so its got enough power at least immediately after shutoff to power a few lightbulbs, but you get nothing, not even a whimper from the starter if you try to crank it without it being hooked up to another car.

maybe just remove the door switch and see if that fixes it

fourside

For the heck of it I hooked the battery up to a charger for several hours and just let it try to charge. Never went past 0%, but I did get it to start. The same charger was used a couple weeks ago and it charged it fully, at least according to the dial on the charger itself. One of the lines connecting to the intake had come out of its socket, I didn't feel any way to reconnect it other than to push it in as hard as I could back in. Obviously that could be wrong...

By the way, I noticed a sound the other day that was unfamiliar to me. The car was idling and every 15 seconds or so (maybe longer) I'd hear what sounded like a quick release of air, and then the idle would sound like it changed ever so slightly. What might that be?

V2Rocket

i noticed that sound too. i noticed it disappeared (at least for as long as i paid attention) after i put that vacuum port back in.