Keyless Entry Version 2.0 (preview)
#62
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I am not going to pretend to know the intricacies of how these units work as I am pretty ignorant, but my assumption has always been that each fob emits a signal which is paired to the module that you attach to the car. If that is indeed correct you would need some way to change the signal coming from the fob and I have no idea how that would be done. Smarter people than myself might have a better answer though.
#64
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Cool project.
But why not go totally keyless??
Sean has my car and a keyless system that I provided. He may try to make the system work in my car, I hope. I am sure he'll be happy to input his wisdom if he tackles this after many electrical issues I have.
This system is great. You approach the car the doors unlock automatically, get in hit the start button and go. When you walk away from the car it automatically locks the doors and raises the windows. No more key. Just a remote you carry in your pocket. You won't even need that cool key chain you have![Smilie](https://rennlist.com/forums/images/smilies/smile.gif)
I had the same system installed in my 964 and works beautifully. The installer didn't have any difficulties installing. Unfortunately, he disappeared before I could have him install it in the 928.
I have my fingers crossed.
But why not go totally keyless??
Sean has my car and a keyless system that I provided. He may try to make the system work in my car, I hope. I am sure he'll be happy to input his wisdom if he tackles this after many electrical issues I have.
This system is great. You approach the car the doors unlock automatically, get in hit the start button and go. When you walk away from the car it automatically locks the doors and raises the windows. No more key. Just a remote you carry in your pocket. You won't even need that cool key chain you have
![Smilie](https://rennlist.com/forums/images/smilies/smile.gif)
I had the same system installed in my 964 and works beautifully. The installer didn't have any difficulties installing. Unfortunately, he disappeared before I could have him install it in the 928.
I have my fingers crossed.
Personally I'd want to defeat the steering lock - so I could still have the car work either with the key (for door locks and ignition) or via keyless entry/ignition.
Keyless access and ignition systems do need to be more secure than a simple keyless entry (more is at stake) and also will lead to more parasitic current - which often trends towards an issue with our cars.
I actually think its an interesting idea - vastly prefer it on my more modern cars... but getting factory level quality is hard for an aftermarket solution and its always one more point of failure.
Tell us more when it is done
Alan
#65
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Simon, in your set-up what key blank did you use? I read Alan had originally had a material failure at the drilled hole in the Huf blank. I'm wondering if you brazed the key blank to reinforce it as Alan did or have you just had better luck at not breaking at the drilled hole?
#66
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Simon, in your set-up what key blank did you use? I read Alan had originally had a material failure at the drilled hole in the Huf blank. I'm wondering if you brazed the key blank to reinforce it as Alan did or have you just had better luck at not breaking at the drilled hole?
#67
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Simon or Alan - One follow up question on the reinforced/modified key blank: Did you cut the original end off of the key blank and weld a metal tab onto the end that you then machined? Or did you only add metal to the original key blank that you then filed and drilled?
I've never welded, but I'd be willing to pick up an $80 wire welder from Harbor Freight to do this type of project if that would do the job. Keyless entry has been on my project list for a long time. I just never liked the idea of a key-chain transmitter. But an integrated key-head is very cool. I just want to make sure I understand what method you used to modify the end of the key blank. Thanks.
I've never welded, but I'd be willing to pick up an $80 wire welder from Harbor Freight to do this type of project if that would do the job. Keyless entry has been on my project list for a long time. I just never liked the idea of a key-chain transmitter. But an integrated key-head is very cool. I just want to make sure I understand what method you used to modify the end of the key blank. Thanks.
#68
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That is what worries me the most. Some of the factory stuff is buggy. However, it is an awesome project I will be following. Actually thinking it would be fun to incorporate into my replica Cobra.
#69
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Simon or Alan - One follow up question on the reinforced/modified key blank: Did you cut the original end off of the key blank and weld a metal tab onto the end that you then machined? Or did you only add metal to the original key blank that you then filed and drilled?
I've never welded, but I'd be willing to pick up an $80 wire welder from Harbor Freight to do this type of project if that would do the job. Keyless entry has been on my project list for a long time. I just never liked the idea of a key-chain transmitter. But an integrated key-head is very cool. I just want to make sure I understand what method you used to modify the end of the key blank. Thanks.
I've never welded, but I'd be willing to pick up an $80 wire welder from Harbor Freight to do this type of project if that would do the job. Keyless entry has been on my project list for a long time. I just never liked the idea of a key-chain transmitter. But an integrated key-head is very cool. I just want to make sure I understand what method you used to modify the end of the key blank. Thanks.
#70
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Depends a little where you start. The stock Huf keys are harder than the Silca orderable replacements - so are more difficult to work (but stronger). However there is insufficient material left for a strong mating surface to the keyhead - so it needs work.
You have to thin the key head thickness, and shorten slightly. The hole was drilled for this project - stock keys don't have it. I used high temperature silver solder brazing with good fluxing to extend (width) and reinforce the head between the existing tangs. It seems very secure. I also modified the keyhead a little to get even more material in there (Xacto knife)
Alan
You have to thin the key head thickness, and shorten slightly. The hole was drilled for this project - stock keys don't have it. I used high temperature silver solder brazing with good fluxing to extend (width) and reinforce the head between the existing tangs. It seems very secure. I also modified the keyhead a little to get even more material in there (Xacto knife)
Alan
#71
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For anyone who is thinking about installing the unit that Alan referenced at the beginning of this thread (with the integrated fob and key stem) I can give it a hearty recommendation. With Alan's extensive help I have installed this unit on my 1990 S4 and I now have working keyless entry on both of my doors and also on the hatch. Great value for a $30 purchase, as keyless entry was probably the modern amenity that I missed the most on my car.
For anyone who is a noob like me and wants to install this unit on their 1990 I made up a little guide to help you along. You can see the quick notes below, but if you want a more extensive guide you can see my pdf which outlines a lot of the procedures in more detail.
Many thanks to Alan for his generous help in getting this working on my car!
Orange – Unused
White (Lock/Arm) to Additional Alarm Relay (in console) Brown/Red wire
Yellow to Ground
Orange/Black - Unused
White/Black (Unlock/Disarm) to Additional Alarm Relay (in console) Brown/Green wire
Yellow/Black to Ground
Black to Ground
Red to always on battery power
Brown1 to T22
Brown2 to T13
Green – Unused
For anyone who is a noob like me and wants to install this unit on their 1990 I made up a little guide to help you along. You can see the quick notes below, but if you want a more extensive guide you can see my pdf which outlines a lot of the procedures in more detail.
Many thanks to Alan for his generous help in getting this working on my car!
Orange – Unused
White (Lock/Arm) to Additional Alarm Relay (in console) Brown/Red wire
Yellow to Ground
Orange/Black - Unused
White/Black (Unlock/Disarm) to Additional Alarm Relay (in console) Brown/Green wire
Yellow/Black to Ground
Black to Ground
Red to always on battery power
Brown1 to T22
Brown2 to T13
Green – Unused
![bowdown](https://rennlist.com/forums/graemlins/bowdown.gif)
I got this pretty much wrapped up today, just ran into one wrinkle with the rear-hatch release:
For hatch release (this should work but didn't for me, perhaps due to a fault in module):
Red/Black wire to S11
Pink wire to U11
Instead of doing the above I bypassed the red/black wire and used a 53 relay and hooked it up as follows:
85: Connect to pink wire from KE module
30 & 86: Connect to unswitched power
87: Connect to S11
Red/Black wire to S11
Pink wire to U11
Instead of doing the above I bypassed the red/black wire and used a 53 relay and hooked it up as follows:
85: Connect to pink wire from KE module
30 & 86: Connect to unswitched power
87: Connect to S11
What I did was move one wire on connector "T9" which is the light/alarm switch for the rear hatch. On the harness side I moved the brown wire from pin-1 to pin-2, to join the other brown wire (chassis ground). This means the hatch-motor is connected directly to ground and runs any time, doors open or closed. I am sure this violates some German safety rule since triggering the hatch release at 150 mph is probably outside the design envelope, but I am also sure that the S4 spoiler will keep the hatch closed... But for the factory to connect a brown wire to brown/white also violates half a dozen DIN standards.
![ducking](https://rennlist.com/forums/graemlins/icon107.gif)
The one remaining issue is that opening the rear hatch with the key-fob hatch-button with the doors locked also activates the alarm. Opening the hatch with the key turns off the alarm (and I think also unlocks the doors). "Aha", says I, "All I need to do is connect the pink wire (ground on hatch release) to the brn/grn unlock wire to unlock the doors (and turn the alarm off) when the hatch is opened". Perfect!
Did that, sort of worked except cross-connecting the door-unlock and hatch-open also opened the hatch when the doors were unlocked. Not good, but an added relay isolated those functions (as would a diode) and fixed that problem.
So here's the wrinkle: Opening the hatch with the car locked worked great, doors unlock also. But when you toss the shopping in the rear, close the hatch and press the "lock" button to re-lock the car, it doesn't lock.
Here's why: When the car is locked, pressing the "lock" button doesn't re-lock, instead it blinks the turn-signals 3 times as a "car finder" function. (Nice idea but we always know where the car is... whichever back corner of the parking lot is farthest away).
So wiring the hatch trigger to also unlock the doors works great, but the little box thinks the doors are still locked. Makes sense, IT didn't unlock the doors therefore they are still locked, and pressing "lock" again is the key-finder mode.
The options I see are:
(a) Go back to the original configuration: If you want to open the hatch then unlock the doors (and turn off the alarm) first (or suffer the alarm as a reminder); or
(b) Live with the quirkiness: If you want to re-lock the car after opening the hatch, the press the unlock button first, then lock (easily forgotten)... or
(c) Disconnect the hatch switch so the alarm doesn't go off when opening the rear hatch remotely with the doors locked. But then then the hatch is not alarmed, and popping the rear hatch is a first choice for lots of bad guys.
We've opted for (a)-- unlock the doors first, dummy-- but open to other ideas.
On keys: We opted for the head-head model (below) and used a Silca key from Keys4classics -- brass key with the molded head. I whacked away the plastic, machined the thickness down to 2.4mm (from 4.0), cut it shorter and trimmed a bit of plastic from the key-head. The two holes wound up just inside the shank, fit perfectly.
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#72
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Jim,
On a GTS this functions differently, the hatch open doesn't unlock the doors - just suspends the alarm until you close the hatch. So at least one of your cars should work OK in this mode.
I didn't encounter this issue, not sure if Simon did?
You do need diodes (or a relay) to allow the hatch release to disable the alarm as you say.
On the hatch - it seemed Simon's unit was not working correctly - an external relay should not have been needed... this was a work-around.
Alan
On a GTS this functions differently, the hatch open doesn't unlock the doors - just suspends the alarm until you close the hatch. So at least one of your cars should work OK in this mode.
I didn't encounter this issue, not sure if Simon did?
You do need diodes (or a relay) to allow the hatch release to disable the alarm as you say.
On the hatch - it seemed Simon's unit was not working correctly - an external relay should not have been needed... this was a work-around.
Alan
#73
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Sorry for the late reply.. This fell of the radar..
Below is the link. Cool system and it works perfectly on my 964.
http://www.advancedkeys.com/
Below is the link. Cool system and it works perfectly on my 964.
http://www.advancedkeys.com/
#74
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Sorry for the late reply.. This fell of the radar..
Below is the link. Cool system and it works perfectly on my 964.
http://www.advancedkeys.com/
Below is the link. Cool system and it works perfectly on my 964.
http://www.advancedkeys.com/
Alan
#75