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Old 02-20-2014 | 09:16 AM
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Default Interesting Pano Piece

Interestng opinion peice in the current issue of Panorama, entitled "Shades of 1978". It is about the direction Porsche appears to be going in now with the elimination of the third pedal from its cars' line-up, and comparing that to the decision to launch the 928 back in 1978. It places p-cars and the designers into two camps -technologists and simplifiers. The basic 911 is in the latter camp with the likes of the 550, 911 carrera RS 2.7, carrera GT and 968 clubsport, and the 928 is in the company of the 959, 997 turbo and 918 spyder. The article gives the 928 its proper due, although the author lamments the loss the simplifier camp cars.
Old 02-20-2014 | 10:04 AM
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Ed, who wrote it?
Old 02-20-2014 | 11:25 AM
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Dang Jim - don't have it here with me at work. Unless someone chimes in sooner, I'll post that tonight. It is actually a rather provocative article. The author (whose name I did not recognize but you might) concluded that he will not be buying any more Porsches new. That may be the sentiment with many in the 911 crowd. Anyway, he is in the simplifier. I guess we are (under the author's definition) technologists, altho I find our cars rather simple yet still advanced enough to feel modern by today's standards.
Old 02-20-2014 | 11:40 AM
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Originally Posted by Jadz928
Ed, who wrote it?
Pete von Behrens
http://www.pca.org/panorama/panoramaphotovideogallery.aspx
Old 02-20-2014 | 11:56 AM
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The first time I read it, I thought it was going to be another hit-piece with a couple of back-handed compliments for the 928.
The second time I read it, I found it was less caustic, I could buy into what he was saying. Some points I can't deny, but still left me defensive.
I'm looking forward to Matt's RS being featured...
That will be the test for the editing staff of Pano., let's see what spin they put on our car.
Old 02-20-2014 | 12:03 PM
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The 'simplifiers' are long since out of luck.

There are plenty of hot, simple, inexpensive sportscars in the world, Porsche just doesn't make them any more - and really hasn't since the 924 moved upmarket about 30 years ago. Porsche can't compete at the low end, and a great little sportscar - like the Miata - can't justify the prices Porsche charges.
Old 02-20-2014 | 12:15 PM
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Yeah the author sides with the simplifiers and not the technologists. Believe he even said to the effect that their choice of Pcars being proven as the correct one by the current market for the simple older 911s vs the 928s etc. Although he didn't offer any 3rd party proof to his claim, I was expecting to read some current price/value comparisons or such to support his claim. Instead, a reader has to take his statement of the market as the gospel. Which is certainly shaded since he admits he is a simpleton, err..... I mean a simplifier!
Old 02-20-2014 | 12:15 PM
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Just my opinion ... the new owners (VW) are going to milk the brand for volume growth and Porsche will never be the same again. My buddy's girlfriend has a Panamera with the Audi V6 .. he calls it "Porsche's chick-car" ...
Old 02-20-2014 | 12:39 PM
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Originally Posted by Shawn Stanford
The 'simplifiers' are long since out of luck.

There are plenty of hot, simple, inexpensive sportscars in the world, Porsche just doesn't make them any more - and really hasn't since the 924 moved upmarket about 30 years ago. Porsche can't compete at the low end, and a great little sportscar - like the Miata - can't justify the prices Porsche charges.
Shawn - I think you nailed it. My dad's new 1984 944 was within a stones throw of a well optioned 300ZX at the time. Back then, someone in the market for a sports GT car had the option of saving up a few extra months and picking up an entry level Porsche for the price of Japanese car. Those days seem long since gone with the base price of a new Boxster some $10K-$15K higher than a 350Z, and $15K-$20K higher than an FRS/BRZ.

Last edited by z driver 88t; 02-20-2014 at 12:41 PM. Reason: spelling
Old 02-20-2014 | 12:53 PM
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Note on simplifiers...

When into RC planes got a new fancy computer radios and was able to do neat things to control my planes. And example was that if I used a servo for each aileron the radio would allow the ailerons to work together like flaps, but still operate as ailerons, i.e., flaperons.

Heard all kinds of comments from the other, more experienced fliers how simpler was better and less things to go wrong. And that they would never trust their planes to one. As time went on these naysayers got new radios and opted for the fancy computer radios. Then all you would hear was how neat they were and all the cool things you could do with the mixing because of the more complicated computer functions.
Old 02-20-2014 | 01:14 PM
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Originally Posted by MGW-Fla
Yeah the author sides with the simplifiers and not the technologists. Believe he even said to the effect that their choice of Pcars being proven as the correct one by the current market for the simple older 911s vs the 928s etc. Although he didn't offer any 3rd party proof to his claim, I was expecting to read some current price/value comparisons or such to support his claim. Instead, a reader has to take his statement of the market as the gospel. Which is certainly shaded since he admits he is a simpleton, err..... I mean a simplifier!
True enough observation, but no 928 is even close to the value of a Carrera RS 2.7. Those things are stratospheric. Also, the routine 911 is typically $10k+ higher than the best 928, if you look at the classifieds in Pano, and the adds in Excellence, and on ebay and elsewhere. Our cars are grossly undervalued, and the 911 are overvalued.
Old 02-20-2014 | 02:05 PM
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Fun fact: The article was developed from a post by a Rennlister, PeteVB. It is in no way meant as a swipe at the 928...if anything, it states the obvious: objectively, the 928 was a better car than the one it was supposed to replace in every way—just as PDK is objectively better than the manual transmission.

And, just so you know, I've been into 928s ever since Mark Anderson tossed me the keys to a really nice red/black five-speed 1979 coupe with 44,000 miles back in 1997-98 because he could tell I was bored while he was stuck on a call. It was GREAT FUN to drive. The noises, the shifter, the handling...people who underestimate these cars just don't get it. Later exposure to Devek's 6.5-liter monster and then a bone-stock 928 S4 auto (thought it was going to be heavy and boring...until it wasn't) left me with two more lasting impressions. I've toyed with the idea of picking a 928 up from time to time, and may yet.

I'm happy to see the 928 get a little ink again in Pano. We're looking at a few leads for full features, and I hope to see them come to fruition this year.

Cheers,

pete
Old 02-20-2014 | 03:15 PM
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Originally Posted by stout

And, just so you know, I've been into 928s ever since Mark Anderson tossed me the keys to a really nice red/black five-speed 1979 coupe with 44,000 miles back in 1997-98 because he could tell I was bored while he was stuck on a call.

pete
That was a few years ago Pete. I don't remember who you were working for then. Was it kit car magazine?
Old 02-20-2014 | 03:34 PM
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Now you all got me really excited to read this! Hope my Pano comes in the mail today.

Thanks for checking in with us, Pete.
Old 02-21-2014 | 02:04 AM
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Great issue, Pete. Keep them coming...

Bob

Originally Posted by stout
Fun fact: The article was developed from a post by a Rennlister, PeteVB. It is in no way meant as a swipe at the 928...if anything, it states the obvious: objectively, the 928 was a better car than the one it was supposed to replace in every way—just as PDK is objectively better than the manual transmission.

And, just so you know, I've been into 928s ever since Mark Anderson tossed me the keys to a really nice red/black five-speed 1979 coupe with 44,000 miles back in 1997-98 because he could tell I was bored while he was stuck on a call. It was GREAT FUN to drive. The noises, the shifter, the handling...people who underestimate these cars just don't get it. Later exposure to Devek's 6.5-liter monster and then a bone-stock 928 S4 auto (thought it was going to be heavy and boring...until it wasn't) left me with two more lasting impressions. I've toyed with the idea of picking a 928 up from time to time, and may yet.

I'm happy to see the 928 get a little ink again in Pano. We're looking at a few leads for full features, and I hope to see them come to fruition this year.

Cheers,

pete
Originally Posted by mark anderson
That was a few years ago Pete. I don't remember who you were working for then. Was it kit car magazine?



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