Playboy car of the year 911 vs 928
01-04-2013, 05:16 AM
#31
Nordschleife Master
Thread Starter
Common Euro hybrid is as you say, but plenty of variations have been done that don't change it from basically still being a Euro hybrid.
Sharktuning or custom chips go into almost all new builds, or a complete aftermarket fuel injection. That is the new standard for all performance mods.
My first iteration will be pretty likely stock US 86 short block, welded higher lift longer duration cams, one of Gregs exhaust systems, but not likely more than 85/86 manifolds, just the back end and X or Y, with some kind of tuning via Sharktuner or Porken or both. I'm thinking 330 to 350 rwhp is a reasonable expectation.
I'm not going to drag race it likely ever due to the off the line issues, but I expect it to offer very spirited driving once moving, and I might run it through a timeslip 1/4, but only to see what the trap speed looked like.
Sharktuning or custom chips go into almost all new builds, or a complete aftermarket fuel injection. That is the new standard for all performance mods.
My first iteration will be pretty likely stock US 86 short block, welded higher lift longer duration cams, one of Gregs exhaust systems, but not likely more than 85/86 manifolds, just the back end and X or Y, with some kind of tuning via Sharktuner or Porken or both. I'm thinking 330 to 350 rwhp is a reasonable expectation.
I'm not going to drag race it likely ever due to the off the line issues, but I expect it to offer very spirited driving once moving, and I might run it through a timeslip 1/4, but only to see what the trap speed looked like.
01-04-2013, 08:13 AM
#32
Captain Obvious
Super User
Super User
350rwhp??? With a 15hp drivetrail loss, that's over 400fwhp!! About 100 more than a stock Euro with only a 300cc jump from 4.7L, a welded cam and a tune? Over the years I don't remember an example that pulled this off but maybe my memory is bad.
01-04-2013, 06:19 PM
#34
It is so hard to talk actual HP numbers given that various dynos read so differently and the engine hasn't been on an engine dyno. What I have done is try to work out actual flywheel numbers by using comparative HP numbers achieved by new cars that are unmodified and using the same dyno. I am assuming of course the factory rating of those new cars are correct. The cars I used were new v8 fords and GM cars.
That comparitive range gives a flywheel number range of 385 to 410 HP. I know that is a wide range and if someone asked me to take a guess I would say 390 HP. I am being conservative with all these numbers.
If you want to talk actual dyno rear wheel numbers and compare to other 928s tested on the same dyno (Dyno Dynamics in Shootout mode) and same day here it is;
My car did 305 rwhp and is manual has a 100 mm bore,
Another 928, manual, new engine running a Haltech with 98 mm bore sports exhaust, 228 rwhp,
Early 928s with auto did 213 rwhp, a auto late model S4 did 250 rwhp.
On a another dyno day, (different dyno and changes that didn't work were made to my 5.0 litre) it achieved 220 kw or 293 rwhp a GTS auto with a X pipe did 178 kw or 237 rwhp.
So you can see a 5.0 euro that has been reasonably sorted can put out quite high relative numbers and as I said it certainly hasn't been fully sorted, it was not tuned at all and just runs the factory tune, it could be improved by the traction and launch control and fixing the mechanical issue that causes the wheel hop. I will have a look at the new 911 time from 50 to 100 mph to see how it compares as that is out of the speed range where traction is a problem.
These engines could certainly be further improved by the 104 mm bore.
That comparitive range gives a flywheel number range of 385 to 410 HP. I know that is a wide range and if someone asked me to take a guess I would say 390 HP. I am being conservative with all these numbers.
If you want to talk actual dyno rear wheel numbers and compare to other 928s tested on the same dyno (Dyno Dynamics in Shootout mode) and same day here it is;
My car did 305 rwhp and is manual has a 100 mm bore,
Another 928, manual, new engine running a Haltech with 98 mm bore sports exhaust, 228 rwhp,
Early 928s with auto did 213 rwhp, a auto late model S4 did 250 rwhp.
On a another dyno day, (different dyno and changes that didn't work were made to my 5.0 litre) it achieved 220 kw or 293 rwhp a GTS auto with a X pipe did 178 kw or 237 rwhp.
So you can see a 5.0 euro that has been reasonably sorted can put out quite high relative numbers and as I said it certainly hasn't been fully sorted, it was not tuned at all and just runs the factory tune, it could be improved by the traction and launch control and fixing the mechanical issue that causes the wheel hop. I will have a look at the new 911 time from 50 to 100 mph to see how it compares as that is out of the speed range where traction is a problem.
These engines could certainly be further improved by the 104 mm bore.
Common Euro hybrid is as you say, but plenty of variations have been done that don't change it from basically still being a Euro hybrid.
Sharktuning or custom chips go into almost all new builds, or a complete aftermarket fuel injection. That is the new standard for all performance mods.
My first iteration will be pretty likely stock US 86 short block, welded higher lift longer duration cams, one of Gregs exhaust systems, but not likely more than 85/86 manifolds, just the back end and X or Y, with some kind of tuning via Sharktuner or Porken or both. I'm thinking 330 to 350 rwhp is a reasonable expectation.
I'm not going to drag race it likely ever due to the off the line issues, but I expect it to offer very spirited driving once moving, and I might run it through a timeslip 1/4, but only to see what the trap speed looked like.
Sharktuning or custom chips go into almost all new builds, or a complete aftermarket fuel injection. That is the new standard for all performance mods.
My first iteration will be pretty likely stock US 86 short block, welded higher lift longer duration cams, one of Gregs exhaust systems, but not likely more than 85/86 manifolds, just the back end and X or Y, with some kind of tuning via Sharktuner or Porken or both. I'm thinking 330 to 350 rwhp is a reasonable expectation.
I'm not going to drag race it likely ever due to the off the line issues, but I expect it to offer very spirited driving once moving, and I might run it through a timeslip 1/4, but only to see what the trap speed looked like.
01-04-2013, 06:46 PM
#35
Well did some quick searching, so many 991 models but according to the Rennlist forum quoting Car and Driver the time from 60 to 100 mph is 5 second dead with PDK and the smaller engined 991 as per the C&D article below, the 60 to 100 mph is 6.2 seconds with 7 speed manual.
https://rennlist.com/forums/991/6731...0-3-7-sec.html
My time from 60 to 100 is 5.5 seconds with a 5 speed manual. it is interesting that the quarter mile trap speed is within 1 mph of the smaller engined 350 HP 991 at 111 mph and a time of 12.9 seconds. It is also interesting the street time 5 to 60, which the euro beats by 03 of a second yet does this by doing a 0 to 60 with no rollout.
http://www.caranddriver.com/reviews/...ed-test-review
https://rennlist.com/forums/991/6731...0-3-7-sec.html
My time from 60 to 100 is 5.5 seconds with a 5 speed manual. it is interesting that the quarter mile trap speed is within 1 mph of the smaller engined 350 HP 991 at 111 mph and a time of 12.9 seconds. It is also interesting the street time 5 to 60, which the euro beats by 03 of a second yet does this by doing a 0 to 60 with no rollout.
http://www.caranddriver.com/reviews/...ed-test-review
01-04-2013, 07:23 PM
#37
Inventor
Rennlist Member
Rennlist Member
01-06-2013, 01:34 AM
#40
01-06-2013, 01:23 PM
#41
Three Wheelin'
01-06-2013, 02:46 PM
#43
01-06-2013, 06:54 PM
#45
Three Wheelin'
