Purists who hate the chevy conversion.... this car is legit.
#91
SC is the best way to go but if you are gong to go with a GM engine it would have to be a LSx series. Another thing the OP not considering is fuel miliage. With a 450HP Chevy 350 you might need another fuel tank. I wonder if you could break 10MPG with a 450HP 350. You might be looking more like 6 to 8.
#92
Administrator - "Tyson"
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1. Cheap
2. Reliable
3. Powerful
Pick two
This applies to Chevy motors as well.
I'm on a Corvette Racing team in NASA Midwest / Great Lakes. Our top ZO6 has an LS based engine that cost in the same ballpark as a Greg Brown Stroker for a 928. We go two full seasons between rebuilds.
Trial and error, we've had customers go the budget route, it never works unless you ***** foot around the track and don't care about winning.
The car in question took two 1st places at nationals this year and one 2nd place.
It all depends on what you are looking for.
A custom crank, set of custom rods, custom pistons etc.... do not cost any less for a Chevy motor than a 928. A good Chevy engine builder is going to cost the same per hour as Greg Brown (if not more). Dyno time to run in the engine isn't any cheaper for a Chevy motor than a 928 motor.
Someone will point out all the available cranks, rods, etc... in Jegs for the LS motor. That's fine if that is what you want. I would not put the equivalent of those parts in my 928, or my Corvette if I had one. Been there done with with more than a few Chevy motors over they years. Those parts are great for a dyno queen.........
A "budget" Chevy motor that will last, would be one from Katech (they make the engines for the LeMans team). They cost more than what most 928's are worth.
Add to that the cost of a conversion into a 928....... remind me how is this a cheap option versus a supercharger kit that costs less than $10k and bolts on over a weekend?
#93
Drifting
Like Brian said... It's an '84 Euro. If you want to do a conversion please go and get one no one will care about. You could sell it and be better funded for a conversion. This makes no sense.
#94
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What the 'purist' get that the transplant artist dont seem to get is that a powerplant is often one of the reasons the 'purist' love the cars. A ferrari or Lambo with a chevy v8 loses so much of its panache its not even funny.
If you dont know you wont know...
#95
Nordschleife Master
Putting a SC on a stock motor that hasnt been rebuilt is a bad idea IMO. Now it would be different if you were putting a sc on a brand new 928 motor. That would be great. I just dont think doing it to a motor with 75+ k miles on it and internals that are unknown is a good plan.
These aren't motors that require a rebuild until unfeasibly high mileages - one local 928 workshop tore down a 90GT's motor with 200k miles on it (330k km's) and on measuring, found bearing clearances, ring gaps etc. to still be within factory new spec, and the same mechanic who did the measuring has been working on the car since it was new (he's an ex-factory tech, now independent), so its known not to have been rebuilt previously. The motor was pulled to do a complete re-seal of all the rubber bits, gaskets and electrical sensors, and while it was out, the owner elected to replace head gaskets to save on future labour expenses. Not to say you can't break one of these motors if you really try, but for general street driving they're nigh indestructible.
There are plenty of 928's making 500+rwhp on stock internals with stock headgaskets (heads never been off). The nutter in this other thread is currently making 650 at the rear wheels from memory.. still with the stock headgasket it left the factory with.
Last edited by Hilton; 11-29-2012 at 06:09 PM.
#96
Three Wheelin'
The ONLY reason the 928 engine is expensive to make power on is economies of scale... the amount of aftermarket parts for American V8's produced en masse is encyclopedic, end of story. Leave purists alone, and they'll leave you alone.
#97
Race Car
I understand your point. I personally do not believe in putting and SC or any other kind of forced induction on non forged motor internals. The chevy motor is fully blue printed, balanced and forged. It is designed and built to be raced and driven the way a 928 should be.
Putting a SC on a stock motor that hasnt been rebuilt is a bad idea IMO. Now it would be different if you were putting a sc on a brand new 928 motor. That would be great. I just dont think doing it to a motor with 75+ k miles on it and internals that are unknown is a good plan.
Putting a SC on a stock motor that hasnt been rebuilt is a bad idea IMO. Now it would be different if you were putting a sc on a brand new 928 motor. That would be great. I just dont think doing it to a motor with 75+ k miles on it and internals that are unknown is a good plan.
Lumping every single cast-component NA engine in the entire world into one bucket and saying that it's a bad idea to add forced induction to any of them is not that intelligent IMO. At least before you go saying that, do some research on how strong the 32v 928 engine really is. Hmm... maybe that's one of the reasons why it's more expensive than a Chevy crate engine?
Dan
'91 928GT S/C 475hp/460lb.ft
#98
At least it's one still on the road and not turned into a smart car or a can...
To each his own... there will always be purists and those who will do what they want.
Gotta ask are you saying 6 to 8 out of a carbureted 350 or just any 350 including a ls..??
To each his own... there will always be purists and those who will do what they want.
SC is the best way to go but if you are gong to go with a GM engine it would have to be a LSx series. Another thing the OP not considering is fuel miliage. With a 450HP Chevy 350 you might need another fuel tank. I wonder if you could break 10MPG with a 450HP 350. You might be looking more like 6 to 8.
#99
Rennlist Member
SC is the best way to go but if you are gong to go with a GM engine it would have to be a LSx series. Another thing the OP not considering is fuel miliage. With a 450HP Chevy 350 you might need another fuel tank. I wonder if you could break 10MPG with a 450HP 350. You might be looking more like 6 to 8.
Last edited by 77tony; 12-10-2012 at 01:34 PM.
#100
I understand your point. I personally do not believe in putting and SC or any other kind of forced induction on non forged motor internals. The chevy motor is fully blue printed, balanced and forged. It is designed and built to be raced and driven the way a 928 should be.
Putting a SC on a stock motor that hasnt been rebuilt is a bad idea IMO. Now it would be different if you were putting a sc on a brand new 928 motor. That would be great. I just dont think doing it to a motor with 75+ k miles on it and internals that are unknown is a good plan.
Putting a SC on a stock motor that hasnt been rebuilt is a bad idea IMO. Now it would be different if you were putting a sc on a brand new 928 motor. That would be great. I just dont think doing it to a motor with 75+ k miles on it and internals that are unknown is a good plan.
#101
Rennlist Member
Your small cap dig at "purists" misses the point.
It's not about purity, it's about cheapness and laziness.
When I walk across a car show lot towards a rare and unique car and get there to find a chevy motor, it's disappointing. Not because it didn't follow a rule book of properness but because there was no effort and creativity present. It was simply done to be cheap and easy.
This age of cheap and easy is it's own kind of purism. As though everyone is supposed to be so impressed that you didn't have to spend much and or exert effort.
Whatever the stupid chevy conversion is in the link I don't care to click on is, it would actually be more "legit" in a Camaro or Vette. The idea of putting it in a car that already has a V8 with superior potetntial is silly and based on laziness and cheapness or maybe lack of skill and confidence. The whole product is based on a compromise of cheapness, like building a house on a dump because the land was cheap.
Now if someone stuffs a tank engine or V16 into a 928, that would be interesating and admireable
It's not about purity, it's about cheapness and laziness.
When I walk across a car show lot towards a rare and unique car and get there to find a chevy motor, it's disappointing. Not because it didn't follow a rule book of properness but because there was no effort and creativity present. It was simply done to be cheap and easy.
This age of cheap and easy is it's own kind of purism. As though everyone is supposed to be so impressed that you didn't have to spend much and or exert effort.
Whatever the stupid chevy conversion is in the link I don't care to click on is, it would actually be more "legit" in a Camaro or Vette. The idea of putting it in a car that already has a V8 with superior potetntial is silly and based on laziness and cheapness or maybe lack of skill and confidence. The whole product is based on a compromise of cheapness, like building a house on a dump because the land was cheap.
Now if someone stuffs a tank engine or V16 into a 928, that would be interesating and admireable
Calling GM conversion owners lazy and cheap is a lazy and cheap shot.
#102
Maybe it would be more acceptable with an aluminum block from Donovan or a Ford from Stage 3.
Personally prefer overhead cams to pushrods. I look at my old 4.5 as a museum piece and treat it accordingly. -a little off subject but WHY do folks show up at cruise nites with new Camaros and Mustangs?
If you want to see one of those you can go to a dealer showroom. yawn
Personally prefer overhead cams to pushrods. I look at my old 4.5 as a museum piece and treat it accordingly. -a little off subject but WHY do folks show up at cruise nites with new Camaros and Mustangs?
If you want to see one of those you can go to a dealer showroom. yawn
Last edited by upstate bob; 11-29-2012 at 06:46 PM. Reason: spelling
#103
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Am I incorrect? but with affordable improvements to intake & exhaust, isn't the 928s4 or GT engine able to produce 400+ HP without forced induction and still be lighter & run for 300,000 miles? And with turbos or SC the 928 motor can produce 700+ HP like Todd T's 87 car? Seems like putting a Chevy motor in would be better with a 914 Porsche or a 944 (if it would fit) I have seen 914s with it.
#104
Nordschleife Master
Another amusing thread for you on the weakness of the stock internals..
825 rear wheel horsepower with dyno sheet on a stock block with original head gasket
(more build info in this earlier thread: https://rennlist.com/forums/928-foru...-2-4-10-a.html)
825 rear wheel horsepower with dyno sheet on a stock block with original head gasket
(more build info in this earlier thread: https://rennlist.com/forums/928-foru...-2-4-10-a.html)
#105
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Am I incorrect? but with affordable improvements to intake & exhaust, isn't the 928s4 or GT engine able to produce 400+ HP without forced induction and still be lighter & run for 300,000 miles? And with turbos or SC the 928 motor can produce 700+ HP like Todd T's 87 car? Seems like putting a Chevy motor in would be better with a 914 Porsche or a 944 (if it would fit) I have seen 914s with it.