FS: 16v Euro cams & Heads (UPDATE on OP)
03-20-2012, 06:48 PM
#32
Race Director
I have seen well running CIS Euros with cats dyno 260ish whp.....an LH euro with cats was 265whp.....
I plan on testing my new racer soon.....I think its a 4.7 Euro S with Euro S cams + ported heads, port matched headers and intake....feels real strong.... my guess is 250+ baseline and maybe near 270 with tuning
03-21-2012, 04:29 AM
#36
Three Wheelin'
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Mike,
You are no less confused than I am and I am not so new to 928s. In 1978 Porsche made the first 928 with a 4.5 liter engine and CIS injection. The engine was used in both the US models and the ROW or EURO models. There was no difference between the cars other than the US model had a CAT and the ROW model did not. Per specs the difference was very little with the US model at 219 HP and the ROW model about 5 HP more.
In 1980 due to US federal regulations Porsche changed the US model to an electronic injection and slightly detuned the engine. However, Porsche kept the 1978 engine in the ROW cars until 1983. At the same time for the ROW Porsche introduced a S model with a 4.7 engine and some tunning enhancements.
The EURO S model with CIS injection was made for four years - 80-83. The S model had a larger displacement 4.7 vs. 4.5, higher compression pistons, taller cams, ported heads with larger valves and bigger intake runners or tubes. The difference in HP was 220 to 300 or about 80 HO. The engine did not have better headers.
One of the limits on making horsepower on the 928 is air flow. Porsche was conservative in feeding the engine air. If you bolt the S runners on a 4.5 engine you will get the best bang for the buck as increasing the air flow creates HP. To get the full 80 HP boost you will have to do all the upgrades. You will need to increase displacement, increase cam lift and valve size and boost conpression. When you do all this there is a good chance you will not pass smog. The Euro engines needed to have a cat added and they generally added some additional engine management. The bigest thing against you is the increased compression. Genearlly a O2 sensor was added and some control was made to the WUR (warm up regulator) .
You can get more by finding a 85-86 - US 5.0 block and bolting the heads to the bigger block. This is commonly called a hybrid. You can also get exhaust headers from a US 85-86 engine and get a little boost. But you are not going to get much above the 300 HP level without some serious work.
There were no S engines made before 1980. All 78-79 cars - US or Euro are the same. There is nothing special between the cars.
You are no less confused than I am and I am not so new to 928s. In 1978 Porsche made the first 928 with a 4.5 liter engine and CIS injection. The engine was used in both the US models and the ROW or EURO models. There was no difference between the cars other than the US model had a CAT and the ROW model did not. Per specs the difference was very little with the US model at 219 HP and the ROW model about 5 HP more.
In 1980 due to US federal regulations Porsche changed the US model to an electronic injection and slightly detuned the engine. However, Porsche kept the 1978 engine in the ROW cars until 1983. At the same time for the ROW Porsche introduced a S model with a 4.7 engine and some tunning enhancements.
The EURO S model with CIS injection was made for four years - 80-83. The S model had a larger displacement 4.7 vs. 4.5, higher compression pistons, taller cams, ported heads with larger valves and bigger intake runners or tubes. The difference in HP was 220 to 300 or about 80 HO. The engine did not have better headers.
One of the limits on making horsepower on the 928 is air flow. Porsche was conservative in feeding the engine air. If you bolt the S runners on a 4.5 engine you will get the best bang for the buck as increasing the air flow creates HP. To get the full 80 HP boost you will have to do all the upgrades. You will need to increase displacement, increase cam lift and valve size and boost conpression. When you do all this there is a good chance you will not pass smog. The Euro engines needed to have a cat added and they generally added some additional engine management. The bigest thing against you is the increased compression. Genearlly a O2 sensor was added and some control was made to the WUR (warm up regulator) .
You can get more by finding a 85-86 - US 5.0 block and bolting the heads to the bigger block. This is commonly called a hybrid. You can also get exhaust headers from a US 85-86 engine and get a little boost. But you are not going to get much above the 300 HP level without some serious work.
There were no S engines made before 1980. All 78-79 cars - US or Euro are the same. There is nothing special between the cars.
03-21-2012, 05:59 AM
#37
Addict
Rennlist Member
Rennlist Member
ROW 4.5L '78-79 and '80-82 are not all one and same. '80-82 has higher 9.0:1 compression engine IIRR. Also heads are different since valve position was moved etc.
03-21-2012, 10:23 AM
#38
Drifting
I would disagree here. I put the heads/cams on, but did not change to the Euro intake. I'm sure I'd pick up a little more with it, but not much.
03-21-2012, 10:58 AM
#40
Burning Brakes
Guys, great info as usual. Just a note, with NJ antique plates, no worries about smog (or really emissions). Although I'm pretty sure if I get caught without cats I could be in trouble. But with no inspection, that is highly unlikely.
GLWS. Audi123 has a good point. In addition to not having the resources to pull the engine, I have to hunt down why the car is running slightly rich (slight popping noises) and having hard hot starts (related to running rich I think) first. Next up is the FPR and dampers.
Thanks again.
GLWS. Audi123 has a good point. In addition to not having the resources to pull the engine, I have to hunt down why the car is running slightly rich (slight popping noises) and having hard hot starts (related to running rich I think) first. Next up is the FPR and dampers.
Thanks again.
03-21-2012, 11:10 AM
#42
Burning Brakes
ducman82, that's what I think too. One of my dampers was disconnected from the vacuum hoses for who knows how long (didn't notice until this recently when I was re-doing the vac lines). I reconnected it, but now I'm thinking that since the car doesn't run any different without it, it's gone.