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1989 928 S4 Cabriolet - On the Road and Getting Prettier - Work In Progress

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1989 928 S4 Cabriolet - On the Road and Getting Prettier - Work In Progress

 
Old 12-19-2011, 09:32 PM
  #46  
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Default Day 4 progress

Decided to start the engine mount and oil pan gasket replacement job. I have my work cut out for me cleaning up underneath. Just lots of grime. Not my favorite job...

I got to about step 20 and stopped until I get the parts in after the new year (going on a Disney Vacation with the kids). I don't want to leave the engine held up by jacks for very long.

Got the 044 fuel pump kit in already... super fast. Probably will clean the tank tomorrow and start the reinstall.
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Old 12-19-2011, 10:16 PM
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Consider doing Fuel line replacements(formerly known as 928sRUS Fuel Line Kit). Also get the Vacuum line replacement kit. Both are inexpensive and necessary but will be a simple set of tasks while everything is disassembled.

Good luck!
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Old 12-20-2011, 01:14 AM
  #48  
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Originally Posted by NC928S4 View Post
Consider doing Fuel line replacements(formerly known as 928sRUS Fuel Line Kit). Also get the Vacuum line replacement kit. Both are inexpensive and necessary but will be a simple set of tasks while everything is disassembled.

Good luck!

I am thinking about that. The lines have all looked really good. I just knocked out a 79 two weekends ago (PITA for sure) and they really needed it. These look great. I just checked all the vacuum lines as well. I had thought about that, but remembered they looked good. And they do. I may still do it just to do it... we shall see.



Steeling this from another thread because it is such a great list:


Originally Posted by Mrmerlin View Post
... partial list ... check into the following
  • Replacement of the Timing belt (doing it)
  • Reset the timing pulleys with the Porken tool (doing it)
  • New oil pump pulley, made of steel, remove the 1mm spacer behind the aluminum pulley if this is done (is this true for the 89 S4 as well?)
  • New Laso water pump and new bolts (doing it... need to get bolts)
  • New tensioner arm bushings, the rollers are probably OK (doing it)
  • New oil pump O ring Note the main and oil pump radial seals are probably good (doing it)
  • New pan gasket slicone or cork,( I would use silicone) (doing it)
  • New tensioner boot and rear gasket (doing it)
  • New thermostat and rear seal and O ring (will do)
  • New fuel lines, (though you may find them still pliable so maybe leave them alone) Mine are good
  • Send out the injectors to be cleaned (witchunter is a good place) (will do)
  • Clean the MAF (will do)
  • Replace the AC lines from the compressor (or try twisting the hose on the metal line near the radiator if its moving then it will leak)Mine are good
  • Replace the AC system O rings with the new green O rings, its easy with the engine out of the way Mine are good
  • Replace the oil cooler lines (try the same test try twisting the hose if the line will twist on the metal portion it will leak) Mine are good
  • Remove the oil fill spout and clean and add some hondabond to the O ringed metal seal, both sides this will keep it dry till its removed. (need to look at)
  • Replace the cam cover gaskets you may be able to fit the sealing washers to the bolt heads (doing it)
  • Replace the motor mounts (doing it)
  • Replace the 2 power steering hoses to the reservoir Mine are good
  • Drain the PS system you need 4 banjo sealing washers for the bottom of the rack (need to look into this)
  • Replace the coolant 2 gallons of coolant 2 gallons of DIst. water (will do)
  • Remove the radiator and flush it out (will do)
  • Replace the ignition wires and coil wires (doing it)
  • Replace the spark plugs (doing it)
  • Replace the airfilter (doing it)
  • Replace the fuel filter (doing it)
  • Check the rear pinch bolt on the driveshaft its probably loose torque to 66ft/lb and a drop of blue loctite on the bolt (doing it)
  • Inspect the trans mounts see if they are collapsed (will do)
  • Check the shock absorbers maybe time for a new set of ???? (need to look at)
  • Bleed the brakes (I suggest to use ATE super blue fluid) (doing it)
  • Inspect the CE panel clean the fuses and relays (will do)
  • Clean the battery box and battery (doing it)
  • Smear some DC111 on the door seals at the base of the side windows let the sun bake it in (will do)

I think I need to ask Roger and Tom for a free T-Shirt
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Old 12-20-2011, 04:26 AM
  #49  
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Oh just go ahead and pull the motor. For all the inaccessable pices it is much easier to do the engine refresh on a stand and then pressure wash and refresh the engine well.
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Old 12-20-2011, 11:30 AM
  #50  
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Originally Posted by Podguy View Post
Oh just go ahead and pull the motor. For all the inaccessible pieces it is much easier to do the engine refresh on a stand and then pressure wash and refresh the engine well.
Here is what is funny. I was just thinking about that last night. By the time I have everything electrical disconnected and the supports disconnected for doing what I have listed, I think I am only short the tyranny to engine bolts (for the most part).

Not exactly what I had intended... but since this is as much as entertainment as need, I am going to look at this hard tonight. I had the plan of pulling the oil pan and looking at the cylinder walls. If they were good, I was just going to leave the motor alone (this was based on the plan before I found the junk internal fuel pump as the believed root cause- FYI, tested it. No function what so ever - super toasted)

Question:
Is there a good procedure out there for pulling the motor on an S4? I have pulled plenty of motors, but it is always nice to have something to help with those little items often overlooked (like all the great procedures I have seen, used, etc here).
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Old 12-20-2011, 07:39 PM
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Default Day 5

Little by little:

Fuel tank cleaned and ready to go. The B-12 helped loosen the junk up and the power wash at the car wash cleaned it all out. Now just dry and reinstall (once I get the brace from 928 Intl).

After a close look and some hard thinking, I am going to leave the motor in. I am not sure of the time savings it will give me once I add in the in and out time plus all the other removal required.

fun fun fun ... Glad i have one I can drive everyday or I would be getting the itch real bad...
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Old 12-21-2011, 05:40 AM
  #52  
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I faced the same issue on the 78. I pulled all the things down including the manifolds. By the time I started to clean everything there were just a lot of things I could not reach.

I just pulled an S4 motor from an 86. The most difficult thing is the injection wiring harness. Since you are already into pulling the injectors for cleaning it is not that much more work to pull the harness and from there you should also pull the valve covers and manifold to either paint them or powder coat.

I really think it is a wash on time. What I lost on pulling the engine from the disassembly point was about two hours and that time was more than saved in cleaning and access to other parts.

I found a Sears 17-19 mm combination box wrench with a soft offset coupled with a 3 foot piece of 2 inch conduit is perfect for getting at the two upper bell housing bolts.

One of the problems with the aluminum casting used on the engine and suspension is how porous it is. The metal is like a grease magnet. I found repeated applications of Zep floor and garage cleaner reacted enough with the aluminum to bring the grease to the surface. After that I applied some high temperature clear. Now when I get grease on the prepared part it cleans off easily with soap and water. The more I tried to make the engine look good before with in a few weeks it would get some white powder and corrosion would appear making the engine well less than attractive.
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Old 12-21-2011, 12:43 PM
  #53  
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Originally Posted by Podguy View Post
One of the problems with the aluminum casting used on the engine and suspension is how porous it is. The metal is like a grease magnet. I found repeated applications of Zep floor and garage cleaner reacted enough with the aluminum to bring the grease to the surface. After that I applied some high temperature clear. Now when I get grease on the prepared part it cleans off easily with soap and water. The more I tried to make the engine look good before within a few weeks it would get some white powder and corrosion would appear making the engine well less than attractive.
You hit my fear with that one. I think you have me sold. I was going to rethink this once I had most of the parts out. Not much room to play with to get the motor out for sure. The only think I have done on the bottom end so far I believe I had to do any way to get the motor out (I am through the unbolt on the lower motor mount).

The cleaning is what has me sold. I noticed how much there is I want to do. I have thoughts about anodizing the aluminum parts. My neighbor works for a machine shop that will make cleaning all the aluminum I take of easy and his sister company does the anodizing, so I may be able to save some money and make everything look real clean.

I think I will relook at all of this in Jan when I get back.

Thank you and have a great Christmas
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Old 12-21-2011, 02:05 PM
  #54  
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Originally Posted by Spun_Cookie View Post
...Might be up and running by the end of Jan, assuming what I do does the trick.
Originally Posted by Spun_Cookie View Post
...
The cleaning is what has me sold. I noticed how much there is I want to do. I have thoughts about anodizing the aluminum parts. ...

I think I will relook at all of this in Jan when I get back.

Thank you and have a great Christmas
FWIW, I appreciate your ambition and enthusiasm. You may want to consider adjusting your expectations into a more achievable goal of completion (or getting it running for that matter).

I appreciate your updates, and that you are going "all in". This is great!
Also, what I'm reading is continued "scope creep". This is why I suggest an adjustment, and possibly a prioritized list.

Merry Christmas to you as well!
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Old 12-21-2011, 02:59 PM
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Originally Posted by Jadz928 View Post
FWIW, I appreciate your ambition and enthusiasm. You may want to consider adjusting your expectations into a more achievable goal of completion (or getting it running for that matter).

I appreciate your updates, and that you are going "all in". This is great!
Also, what I'm reading is continued "scope creep". This is why I suggest an adjustment, and possibly a prioritized list.

Merry Christmas to you as well!
All very true. I will rethink it all after Christmas. I would love to have her up and running by the end of Jan and its possible once I get teh parts in AND the fuel pump was the issue.
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Old 12-21-2011, 04:03 PM
  #56  
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I find that all too often when I fix something, I cause new problems. Sometimes it is that the new part has a problem. Sometimes it is that I bent a age hardened hose or wire too far. Sometimes it is just something like a cam cover screw that was a crappy design in the first place. Often these new/ secondary problems are a bitch to track down and resolve. Because if this I have become and incrementalist. I like to do one little job, then get the car back together, resolve any secondary problems I have caused, and assess where I am, before moving on the the next job.

So, if it were me I would really want to resolve the running problem in a minimally invasive way, get the car back together and drive it around to confirm that I had a functional motor and tranny. Then, once I knew I had a running car, I would start doing things like pulling the motor for extensive cleaning, motor mounts, pan gaskets, cam cover gaskets, etc.
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Old 12-21-2011, 04:48 PM
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Originally Posted by karl ruiter View Post
I find that all too often when I fix something, I cause new problems. Sometimes it is that the new part has a problem. Sometimes it is that I bent a age hardened hose or wire too far. Sometimes it is just something like a cam cover screw that was a crappy design in the first place. Often these new/ secondary problems are a bitch to track down and resolve. Because if this I have become and incrementalist. I like to do one little job, then get the car back together, resolve any secondary problems I have caused, and assess where I am, before moving on the the next job.

So, if it were me I would really want to resolve the running problem in a minimally invasive way, get the car back together and drive it around to confirm that I had a functional motor and tranny. Then, once I knew I had a running car, I would start doing things like pulling the motor for extensive cleaning, motor mounts, pan gaskets, cam cover gaskets, etc.

That is very good advice all around. I try not to take apart more than I can handle. Often times, I break things down into isolated projects with attainable goals.
For instance, right now we're working on a '78 Euro which had running issues. We quickly isolated the fuel delivery/FI system, and are completely focussed on that. The car needs more than that, but getting it running right is a huge step forward from where it was, both in terms of morale and value.

The complete diagnosis of a running/driving car is much more comprehensive. It also makes it easier to assess individual systems.

Last edited by Jadz928; 12-21-2011 at 06:07 PM. Reason: spelling
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Old 12-22-2011, 07:58 AM
  #58  
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I hear you on going too far. Perhaps disassmbling the upper A arms to plate the pivot bar and bolts is a bit much, but the end result is rewarding.

I will note that the last couple of engines I have refreshed on the stand started right up and ran smoothly when installed. When everything is buttoned up right there are far few gremlims to chase down. I know Erik got a little nervous on his car as each time he came to work on it I had hime remove more parts. Finally he got stubborn and refused to remove any more. Then we discovered the fuel line to the pump and upper gas tank bracket were rusted through.

With all the prep the car went back together much faster than he imagined. It was a straight forward shot one piece after the next. When we cranked the engine it started right up. Other than playing with the WUR the car has been reliable since. It is just so much easier to install things in the proper order than to do one job that requires a lot of struggling under the car and removing alot of extra parts to fix something. Just the pan and motor mounts are an ugly job. Getting at some of those bolts on the pan even with the engine on a stand requires the flexibility of a contortionist.

If you remove the four bolts on both motor mounts the engine comes out without removing the rack. with the radiator removed there is enough room to just break away the bellhousing the engine just lifts right out.

You have an excellant oppprtunity to do some exciting things with the convertible. Since it is not an original car any custom changes only enhance the desirablity of the car. I have added rose wood panels and GTS style mirrors. I am even thinking of some Lambro doors
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Old 12-22-2011, 07:59 AM
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One more note I forgot to mention if you are unsure of how things go back together. Take many pictures as you disassemble things.
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Old 12-22-2011, 10:06 AM
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Originally Posted by Podguy View Post
One more note I forgot to mention if you are unsure of how things go back together. Take many pictures as you disassemble things.
Yup. At this point, no issue, but as I go in a level, there will a lot more photos.

Originally Posted by Podguy View Post
I hear you on going too far. Perhaps disassembled the upper A arms to plate the pivot bar and bolts is a bit much, but the end result is rewarding.

You have an excellent opportunity to do some exciting things with the convertible. Since it is not an original car any custom changes only enhance the desirability of the car. I have added rose wood panels and GTS style mirrors. I am even thinking of some Lambro doors
And that is the dilemma I am in. I am going to put the Aero Mirrors for sure. Already got the GT/GTS pipes coming and if I can find a GTS rear bumper, it will be going on. All of the items are already on my Blue S4.

The odds of me tearing it down this far again, without a mechanical reason, are slim. The oxidation and age discoloration items will be far easier to do at this point than any other. I am still not sure about the motor pull, but it is still a real option.

As far as the motor mounts and oil pan gasket, I am 2 bolts away from the hardest items behind me (cross member bolts). Those will be the deciding factor for me. Either way, there are some knuckle bleeding slips and colorful language moments she before she fires up again.
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