Sharktuner Rental
03-01-2011, 12:40 PM
#18
Rennlist Member
Alternately, buy a ST2 with two PEM's for $990, and get an Innovate LC-1 with wbO2 sensor from Amazon for $190, you're in a bit over $1200 with shipping and can check and tweak tuning whenever you want. Plus the real-time diagnostics.
I don't think Roger's rental fee is out of line at all-- he needs to provide the new-user support that normally comes along with a new box, and deal with broken parts and lost cables. That all takes resource and expertise.
My concern, which I think I posted on Andrew's old thread on this topic, is that tuning is not an "event", it is a process which takes time, and which has a learning curve-- not just for the ST2 and associated software, but also engine tuning in general. Which all makes ownership-- or group ownership-- a better option for most, in my view.
But everybody's situation is different, and if the numbers make sense then renting can make a lot of sense.
P.S. Tampa-- you need "Bosch" smoke, Lucas won't do...
03-01-2011, 01:10 PM
#20
Am I the only one to notice that it is Mike that is the contact person for sharktuning.
I didn't see Rogers name on there.
I didn't see Rogers name on there.
03-01-2011, 01:13 PM
#21
The inner workings of the 928 are magic and only truly trained 928 sorcerers are able to demystify the workings and functions of the mighty 928..... Do not under any circumstance think that one can apply standard engine techniques to the magical 928 engine.. ... LOL.. I think Marc T was the one who first started with that "Myth".....
give the folks here some credit.....there are some really amazing brains here and maybe a 928 sharktuner subforum where folks can toss around tuning ideas would work better than keeping Rog on the phone for hours on end...?
... LOL.. I think Marc T was the one who first started with that "Myth".....give the folks here some credit.....there are some really amazing brains here and maybe a 928 sharktuner subforum where folks can toss around tuning ideas would work better than keeping Rog on the phone for hours on end
...?
03-01-2011, 01:13 PM
#22
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I agree with Andrew and Jim on the learning curve issue- I TORTURED John and Jim with stupid questions about both the ST2 and the SP software while getting up to speed. And that was after having several hours watching over Greg and his tech's shoulder for the first few hours tuning on the dyno. And while there's no doubt that you can knock out a good safe tune in a couple of hours, it's a heck of a lot more than a couple of hours to RTFM, clarify in your head what you're supposed to do, and then actually be confident that the data you're collecting is accurate and reliable (or at least it was for my non-engineer brain....) And while it's probably true that 90% (80%) of the tuning map is done in the first couple of hours, what if you put together your basic maps during a week when it's 45o outside, and then expect that tune to get you through 95-degree August days in stop-start traffic?
For what people seem to spend on X-pipes, subwoofers, wheels and RMB's, I think that $1200 for a complete S4+ tuning solution is a freaking steal. I still cannot understand how John can have made a profitable return on his huge investment given the size of the 928 tuning market, but I sure am glad he's undertaken it.
For what it's worth, I have a draft of a Sharktuning for Dummies writeup that is a sort of amalgamation of the ST2 manual and SP manuals, patient explanation e-mails from John and Jim, and pictures of my own install. If it would be helpful, I can try to whip it into shape and run it by John and Jim to make sure I haven't made any egregious errors. It by no means would replace either manual, but I'm happy to post it if folks think it might be helpful.
Also FWIW, you can get a Bosch/Innovate 3737 from these guys for $59:
http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/Innov...Q5fAccessories
For what people seem to spend on X-pipes, subwoofers, wheels and RMB's, I think that $1200 for a complete S4+ tuning solution is a freaking steal. I still cannot understand how John can have made a profitable return on his huge investment given the size of the 928 tuning market, but I sure am glad he's undertaken it.
For what it's worth, I have a draft of a Sharktuning for Dummies writeup that is a sort of amalgamation of the ST2 manual and SP manuals, patient explanation e-mails from John and Jim, and pictures of my own install. If it would be helpful, I can try to whip it into shape and run it by John and Jim to make sure I haven't made any egregious errors. It by no means would replace either manual, but I'm happy to post it if folks think it might be helpful.
Also FWIW, you can get a Bosch/Innovate 3737 from these guys for $59:
http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/Innov...Q5fAccessories
03-01-2011, 01:16 PM
#23
03-01-2011, 01:18 PM
#24
Rennlist Member
I agree with Andrew and Jim on the learning curve issue- I TORTURED John and Jim with stupid questions about both the ST2 and the SP software while getting up to speed. And that was after having several hours watching over Greg and his tech's shoulder for the first few hours tuning on the dyno And while there's no doubt that you can knock out a good safe tune in a couple of hours, it's a heck of a lot more than a couple of hours to RTFM, clarify in your head what you're supposed to do, and then actually be confident that the data you're collecting is accurate and reliable (or at least it was for my non-engineer brain....) And while it's probably true that 90% (80%) of the tuning map is done in the first couple of hours, what if you put together your basic maps during a week when it's 45o outside, and then expect that tune to get you through 95-degree August days in stop-start traffic?
For what people seem to spend on X-pipes, subwoofers, wheels and RMB's, I think that $1200 for a complete S4+ tuning solution is a freaking steal. I still cannot understand how John can have made a profitable return on his huge investment given the size of the 928 tuning market, but I sure am glad he's undertaken it.
For what it's worth, I have a draft of a Sharktuning for Dummies writeup that is a sort of amalgamation of the ST2 manual and SP manuals, patient explanation e-mails from John and Jim, and pictures of my own install. If it would be helpful, I can try to whip it into shape and run it by John and Jim to make sure I haven't made any egregious errors. It by no means would replace either manual, but I'm happy to post it if folks think it might be helpful.
Also FWIW, you can get a Bosch/Innovate 3737 from these guys for $59:
http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/Innov...Q5fAccessories
For what people seem to spend on X-pipes, subwoofers, wheels and RMB's, I think that $1200 for a complete S4+ tuning solution is a freaking steal. I still cannot understand how John can have made a profitable return on his huge investment given the size of the 928 tuning market, but I sure am glad he's undertaken it.
For what it's worth, I have a draft of a Sharktuning for Dummies writeup that is a sort of amalgamation of the ST2 manual and SP manuals, patient explanation e-mails from John and Jim, and pictures of my own install. If it would be helpful, I can try to whip it into shape and run it by John and Jim to make sure I haven't made any egregious errors. It by no means would replace either manual, but I'm happy to post it if folks think it might be helpful.
Also FWIW, you can get a Bosch/Innovate 3737 from these guys for $59:
http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/Innov...Q5fAccessories
03-01-2011, 01:25 PM
#25
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Rick-
I've never seen an ST1 in action, not sure how much overlap there is RE: the user experience between an ST1 and an ST2. But I will work on making what I have presentable. May not be until the weekend, tho.
I've never seen an ST1 in action, not sure how much overlap there is RE: the user experience between an ST1 and an ST2. But I will work on making what I have presentable. May not be until the weekend, tho.
03-01-2011, 01:30 PM
#26
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I agree with Andrew and Jim on the learning curve issue- I TORTURED John and Jim with stupid questions about both the ST2 and the SP software while getting up to speed. And that was after having several hours watching over Greg and his tech's shoulder for the first few hours tuning on the dyno. And while there's no doubt that you can knock out a good safe tune in a couple of hours, it's a heck of a lot more than a couple of hours to RTFM, clarify in your head what you're supposed to do, and then actually be confident that the data you're collecting is accurate and reliable (or at least it was for my non-engineer brain....) And while it's probably true that 90% (80%) of the tuning map is done in the first couple of hours, what if you put together your basic maps during a week when it's 45o outside, and then expect that tune to get you through 95-degree August days in stop-start traffic?
For what people seem to spend on X-pipes, subwoofers, wheels and RMB's, I think that $1200 for a complete S4+ tuning solution is a freaking steal. I still cannot understand how John can have made a profitable return on his huge investment given the size of the 928 tuning market, but I sure am glad he's undertaken it.
For what it's worth, I have a draft of a Sharktuning for Dummies writeup that is a sort of amalgamation of the ST2 manual and SP manuals, patient explanation e-mails from John and Jim, and pictures of my own install. If it would be helpful, I can try to whip it into shape and run it by John and Jim to make sure I haven't made any egregious errors. It by no means would replace either manual, but I'm happy to post it if folks think it might be helpful.
Also FWIW, you can get a Bosch/Innovate 3737 from these guys for $59:
http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/Innov...Q5fAccessories
For what people seem to spend on X-pipes, subwoofers, wheels and RMB's, I think that $1200 for a complete S4+ tuning solution is a freaking steal. I still cannot understand how John can have made a profitable return on his huge investment given the size of the 928 tuning market, but I sure am glad he's undertaken it.
For what it's worth, I have a draft of a Sharktuning for Dummies writeup that is a sort of amalgamation of the ST2 manual and SP manuals, patient explanation e-mails from John and Jim, and pictures of my own install. If it would be helpful, I can try to whip it into shape and run it by John and Jim to make sure I haven't made any egregious errors. It by no means would replace either manual, but I'm happy to post it if folks think it might be helpful.
Also FWIW, you can get a Bosch/Innovate 3737 from these guys for $59:
http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/Innov...Q5fAccessories
Also thanks for the lead on the WBO2. Picked me up a spare.
03-01-2011, 01:33 PM
#27
I need to put this out here.
Who is in charge of this sharktuner? I've had a customer waiting 1.5 months to get his car done.
Who is in charge of this sharktuner? I've had a customer waiting 1.5 months to get his car done.
03-01-2011, 02:11 PM
#28
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The one thing I have learned from Greg is that what ever I do it is wrong. I guess I have a thick skin.
In fact what everyone else does is wrong in Greg's book. If we all listened to Greg none of us would be in business.
We are renting sharktuners - if you do not know how to use a ST or are not prepared to read the manual do not rent a ST.
The market asked for the opporunity to rent a ST we provided the product.
In fact what everyone else does is wrong in Greg's book. If we all listened to Greg none of us would be in business.
We are renting sharktuners - if you do not know how to use a ST or are not prepared to read the manual do not rent a ST.
The market asked for the opporunity to rent a ST we provided the product.
Seriously?
I thought we had a pretty good relationship, where we could freely exchange ideas.
That's pretty cold crap.
Excuse me.
__________________
greg brown
714 879 9072
GregBBRD@aol.com
Semi-retired, as of Feb 1, 2023.
The days of free technical advice are over.
Free consultations will no longer be available.
Will still be in the shop, isolated and exclusively working on project cars, developmental work and products, engines and transmissions.
Have fun with your 928's people!
greg brown
714 879 9072
GregBBRD@aol.com
Semi-retired, as of Feb 1, 2023.
The days of free technical advice are over.
Free consultations will no longer be available.
Will still be in the shop, isolated and exclusively working on project cars, developmental work and products, engines and transmissions.
Have fun with your 928's people!
03-01-2011, 06:00 PM
#29
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This kind of thing is not good for anyone......"Who is in charge of this sharktuner? I've had a customer waiting 1.5 months to get his car done. " Wow if the wait list is over 6 weeks that is nearly $1,800 in rentals assuming the tool is being used all that time by other paying customers...
