Ethre

This morning brought a bright new day - a new day in which I got my car back from the shop.
(It had actually be done for a while, but I hadn't been able to get over to pick it up.)

First for some observations:
I think this qualifies as "premature failure":

http://picasaweb.google.com/lh/photo...eat=directlink

http://picasaweb.google.com/lh/photo...eat=directlink
Luckily it was on an 82 - so no damage it seems.

Somehow I doubt this is at factory spec:

http://picasaweb.google.com/lh/photo...eat=directlink

Can someone identify this exhaust? To me it looks rather like the Ansa Sport

http://picasaweb.google.com/lh/photo...eat=directlink

http://picasaweb.google.com/lh/photo...eat=directlink

Now that she's back, I've got a nice laundry list of things to do:
1) Try to figure out the reason for premature belt failure. My earlier thread - Premature Timing Belt Failure - should be a great reference resource now.
2) Search for the remedy to my lack of power (car pulls alright at low speeds, but pulls very heavily at higher speeds). I think this may also be related to the loud "popping" noise during deceleration and medium acceleration (idle sounds rough but pops rarely, and full acceleration seems to smooth things out). Misfires?
3) Alternator intermittent charging - Hopefully just a dirty ground somewhere.
4) Replace my oil pressure sender (I sheared one of the pin connections off it almost immediately after I bought the car.

Here's what I've been thinking of in terms of #2 - lack of power.
-Old/Worn Rotor and Distributor Cap: They should have been replaced a while ago anyway - so now I'm just waiting for USPS to deliver.
-Spark Plug wires: "Fireworks Test" coming in the morning
-Spark Plugs: Also getting up there in age
-Throttle cable (as shown, I think she's a little loose. )
-Exhaust/Cat ??? This was suggested by the shop. I think Roger's opinion that it wasn't likely an issue made sense. On the other hand, perhaps the aftermarket exhaust/muffler could have corroded inside and caused some sort of blockage?
-Engine harness ?? Wearing in places, possibly aggravating issues?
-Coils?

Stuff that "should" be good:
-Injectors (checked by shop, reported all good)
-Pressure (Leakdown test came back at 6%, 2%, 6%, 6%, 8%, 6%, 8%, 4%)

All suggestions/comments are welcome, as always.

Also, when I picked up my car they mentioned that the exhaust was not factory. I hadn't noticed this before, but looking at it, it doesn't seem to line up with the factory parts manual. It has the appearance of the Ansa Sport Exhaust though. Anyone care to comment?

*Photos don't seem to be linking correctly. I've fixed the embedded links but don't know if they'll last. Click links should last if they go down.

James Bailey

That is an ANSA which is a very poor system very common to rust out and the cat is quite small and aftermarket as well.

cold_beer839

Maybe this exhaust system would be better. Price seem high-ish, but it does come with a y-pipe and high-flow cat.

http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/PORSC...Q5fAccessories

Ethre

Thank you for the verification - I thought it looked rather like the ANSA diagram. From the receipts, it looks like it may have been installed in the mid 80s.
I've absolutely no problem replacing it - thank you for the suggestion David. Seeing as I'd probably want to be replacing the CAT too, that price seems fair I would guess. Is there a reason you thought it a bit high?
It looks like that Y-pipe has curved ends though - so I'm guessing I would have to replace the headers too? Mine come straight back:
http://picasaweb.google.com/lh/photo...eat=directlink


Alternatively, I assume the Y-Pipe could be cut and welded?

Replacing the exhaust might even quite things down a little! That would be a blessing.

Ethre

Oh yes, and good news - no fireworks. I can check that off the list.

Updated:
-Old/Worn Rotor and Distributor Cap: They should have been replaced a while ago anyway - so now I'm just waiting for USPS to deliver.
-Spark Plugs: Also getting up there in age
-Throttle cable (as shown, I think she's a little loose. )
-Exhaust/Cat ??? This was suggested by the shop. I think Roger's opinion that it wasn't likely an issue made sense. On the other hand, perhaps the aftermarket exhaust/muffler could have corroded inside and caused some sort of blockage?
-Engine harness ?? Wearing in places, possibly aggravating issues?
-Coils?

Good:
-Injectors (checked by shop, reported all good)
-Pressure (Leakdown test came back at 6%, 2%, 6%, 6%, 8%, 6%, 8%, 4%)
-Spark Plug wires: No fireworks

Landseer

Once you change cap and rotor, then experiment with timing a bit. You can do it by feel, loosening and moving distrib slightly.

Other possibilities:

Air/vac leaks.

Leaking fuel reg or damper that is sucking fuel into the vac system for combustion.

Vac advance / Vac retard problem ( I think 82 has both ) Need to be hooked to the correct ports on the throttle body and be operational.

My 84 auto was sputtering and missing at mid-speeds coming back from SITM 2010 because the vac advance tube had come off the throttle body.

Ethre

Tightened the throttle cable up as much as possible - though I think the cable still has a little too much slack (deflects ~1/4" under finger). I realize there is supposed to be a slight slack to allow the idle switch to engage, but I think this is a little much. I'll have to replace the cable in the future. This improved responsiveness greatly, however.

Well Landseer, I haven't tested anything with a vacuum pump (or smoke) yet, but vacuum lines are supposed to come off under gentle finger pressure, right?
So, I think I may have a leak or two around. From what I have read, the factory vacuum lines were all plastic, correct? Some of the smaller lines are still plastic, but it looks like most of mine were converted to a sort of sleeved rubber line (sleeved with a braided fiber of some sort - looks kind of like the old style hydraulic hoses). They don't seem to be in bad shape, except that the ends are all splitting where they've been on the fittings (and so leaking I will guess)

I'll have to take a copy of the service manual page with me to look at the Vac advance/retard.

I've also noticed there's a hose connection on the passenger side of the airfilter cover. I don't see it in the parts catalog diagrams, but its obviously part of the molding. What purpose is this? Does it feed a sensor?

Updated:
-Old/Worn Rotor and Distributor Cap: They should have been replaced a while ago anyway - so now I'm just waiting for USPS to deliver.
-Spark Plugs: Also getting up there in age
-Exhaust/Cat ??? This was suggested by the shop. I think Roger's opinion that it wasn't likely an issue made sense. On the other hand, perhaps the aftermarket exhaust/muffler could have corroded inside and caused some sort of blockage?
-Engine harness ?? Wearing in places, possibly aggravating issues?
-Coils?
-Vacuum Leaks - lines bad at connections

Good:
-Injectors (checked by shop, reported all good)
-Pressure (Leakdown test came back at 6%, 2%, 6%, 6%, 8%, 6%, 8%, 4%)
-Spark Plug wires: No fireworks
-Throttle cable: still loose, but better. Will need replacement

Landseer

A smoke tester isn't needed.
Look for loose hoses. Cracks/condition of the 8 boots on the intake tubes. Seating of the AFM in an O-ring in the throttle body (run finger around inside of throttle body, if the O ring has a flat edge, it needs replacement). Crankcase breather, brake power assist hoses, all need to be crack free. These are ones that will pass large amounts of unmetered air and totally screw up running.

So will improper hook-up of advance and retard.

The hose connection is for for clean air feed to air pump hose I think on some cars.

There really isn't much more to say. No simple answers. Ante-up, dig-in and enjoy rehabbing a 28/9 year old porsche. Sometimes it will even run for a while.

Ethre

My intake tube boots actually visually look alright. However, since I think I will have to remove the "spider" to replace the vacuum lines underneath, I should get a better chance to examine them. This should also uncover the advance/retard connections I believe.

It seems like the general agreement is that the silicon vacuum hoses are better quality than the originals, so I'm planning on using them. I've got to do some measuring of the hose lengths before I replace anything though. (Yes, I am aware of the kit at 928MotorSports - but I think I will be getting hoses locally).

Thank you for the clarification about the hose connection. That would make sense, seeing as it is right in line with the air pump filter (though at the other end of the engine bay).

Edit: Hmmm, apparently the cloth braided hoses are original. I'm surprised the rubber has held up as well as it did.

Ethre

(Long post = 3 parts, 1: vacuum, 2: distributor, 3: alternator)

Finally got some free time to get a little work in.

Pulled the plenum - inside was slightly oily and there was a small amount of oil sitting in the dips in the rubber connection houses (from reading threads here that appears to be normal). I discovered that these metric vacuum lines are a good deal harder to find than I expected them to be. Looks like I will have to order some online. Until then though, I managed to get enough sae tubing to replace the more urgent leaks. Since its a daily driver, I cleaned up and rotated the rubber connections for the plenum, and replaced that.

Went to replace the distributor cap and rotor. After carefully marking orientation of cables, I discovered that they were also marked on the cap itself - better safe than sorry though. These were a lot less work to replace than I expected. Simply pull off, replace. The old rotor was worn ~1/16 of an inch on the long end when compared to the new one. They appeared to be a subtly different design though (not something that seems as if it would affect usage).
The contacts on the old cap were roughly half oxidized. I am not certain if this is normal. When I placed the new ones on though, I discovered that it seems I am missing one of the tabs to hold the distributor cap down. The pin easily locks on the back side, but in the front there is no tab on the front
http://picasaweb.google.com/lh/photo...eat=directlink


It should be right at the end of the arrow in the above picture, but doesn't seem to appear in the picture. Am I imagining this part? I don't see any other way for the front pin on the distributor cap to lock on.
(By looking at the length of the screw holding the vacuum timing unit on, it also seem as if there is something missing).
Since it seems like this could potentially destroy the rotor/cap, the old pair went back on and the cap was temporarily secured on this side with a pair of zip ties. Not a great solution, but strong enough to get me back to campus.

Now for the worse news: alternator (replaced with a Bosch unit in 2003) problems it seems.
When I first got the car I had several issues with the alternator not charging. Interestingly, it always seemed to respond better with a larger load (driving at night with the lights on, for example). After cleaning some grounds, they seemed to go away, although the gauge on the dash always showed the battery dropping to worrisomely low levels before the alternator kicked in.
I wondered if the regulator might be going, but since things were working alright I left it be.
Driving around on my hunt for vacuum line though, the alternator never fully kicked in (under load, without load, revving engine, not revving engine - the most it would do was a slight twitch). Being rather worried by this point, I started making my way back home when the battery got low enough for the car to die - luckily I was out of traffic and able to coast into a parking lot.
After tinkering with the connections and wires locking for a short, I jumped it a couple of times (with my spare battery) only to have it quickly die without any alternator response. The third time I jumped it I didn't pay enough attention to terminals on my spare battery and momentarily crossed the wires.
Well, I got a pretty little spark. I'm going to guess that if the regulators on my alternator weren't shot before, they probably are now. That was enough bad news for the day, so I swapped in my spare battery and puttered the rest of the way back home.

The way I see it, I have a couple potential causes for the alternator issues:
-grounds or wire shorts
-voltage regulator
-exciter issues
-brushes/etc on the alternator

My plan:
-If its an exciter issue, I should be able to start the alternator by momentarily running a wire to the exciter post, correct? Can I just use the +wire to the alternator for this?
-If I get no go from that, the alternator's coming off. I'm leaning towards trying the CS130 Delco replacement for potentially easier service in the future. To do this I believe I would need to use a belt two sizes smaller than my current one?
-I've been collecting the parts to rebuild/replace my engine harness. If I've got a short inside the harness somewhere, this should take care of it. So, this just got more urgent.

tl;dr Some vacuum lines replaced, distributor cap precarious, alternator shot

EDIT: Separate thread created regarding the distributor cap tab.

Ethre

10/3/2010

-Pulled the alternator. It looks like I was force feeding it bugs (I had the alternator shroud on but no hose connected). Ugh. Alternator itself looks amazingly new though.
I had wondered previously if the alternator shroud pipe would suck in enough material to cause an issue, and it sure looks like it did. I should have trusted my earlier instinct to put a screen over the pipe.

-Pulled the engine ground strap. This was one of the grounds I had not known about - and it was also the dirtiest ground I have yet to see on the car.

I'm guessing both of these were partial sources of my charging problem. Since I crossed the battery cables though, I'm pretty certain that the regulator and maybe diodes are going to be shot. The alternator (after being cleaned slightly) looks to be in nice condition (as it should, since it was replaced only a couple of years ago), so I am going to give rebuilding it a shot.

Summary: Time to pay for not paying attention when jumping my car. Oh well, such is life.

danglerb

Take the alternator to one of the local parts stores that offers free testing before you jump in rebuilding, could be fine.

Ethre

Unfortunately, that's not a possibility. I was blowing/dusting it out, and found burnt plastic coming out. On closer inspection, the plastic layer with the diodes is all arced to hell. It may have been the bugs, or the cross wiring - I don't know. Either way though, I started seeing more and more fried goodies.

In the process of getting a delco right now.

Imo000

Might want to keep the longtube headers as they are big improvement over the stock cat iron lumps.

Do you have pics of the cam gears?

Ethre

Thank you for reminding me Imo000. I had almost forgotten that after my alternator issues started. It looks like the two cam gears are good, but the oil pump gear (correct name, right?) looks very far gone. I now understand these pictures a heck of a lot better. Those edges are a lot sharper than they look!
I forgot to look at the gear on the crank - I'll have to do that in the morning before class.

Pictures:

http://picasaweb.google.com/lh/photo...eat=directlink


http://picasaweb.google.com/lh/photo...eat=directlink


http://picasaweb.google.com/lh/photo...eat=directlink

Edit: Regarding the exhaust/headers - its something that I may do in the future (leaving the headers, but replacing backwards from there), but more urgent changes (gears, alternator) are taking precedence.