New Product: High-Performance Intake Runners for the 32v 928
07-09-2010, 02:45 PM
#31
Rennlist Member
How did you get near 11" for runners that seemed to be 3" tall? are you adding in the distance to the inlet?
also, why do you want Max HP to be at redline,not before?
also, what is "LSR"?
thanks,
m
Kibort: the final total runner length of these runners for this application came out to 10.85". Its not as short as you think. And it was not left to chance. To have a shot at the LSR, I need max HP at redline, not before it. So I would agree, my configuration would be different than someone elses.... but then thats the whole reason for seperating the intake runners from the plenums. Now you are free to finish your manifold as you need for your application.
also, why do you want Max HP to be at redline,not before?
also, what is "LSR"?
thanks,
m
Kibort: the final total runner length of these runners for this application came out to 10.85". Its not as short as you think. And it was not left to chance. To have a shot at the LSR, I need max HP at redline, not before it. So I would agree, my configuration would be different than someone elses.... but then thats the whole reason for seperating the intake runners from the plenums. Now you are free to finish your manifold as you need for your application.
07-09-2010, 02:48 PM
#32
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Just shows the payoff of having a passion for your work. You get to have fun, and end up with great products. Congratulations, Carl. I wish I lived some place where I could put a 800hp 928 to use.
07-09-2010, 03:26 PM
#33
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I have had these manifolds in my hands and all I can say is that they are very nice and very high quality.
I don't know much about plastic but it seems that Carl has done his homework with this.
Very cool product!
I don't know much about plastic but it seems that Carl has done his homework with this.
Very cool product!
07-09-2010, 03:32 PM
#34
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Next time you have a set in your hands.... RUN.... and ship them to me PLEASE :-)
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07-09-2010, 04:08 PM
#35
Very nice set up. Impressive.
07-09-2010, 04:20 PM
#36
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MK, since you had the Holbert LSR car, how can you not know what LSR means? !!
11" is from the back of the valve, measured as it should be. Carl wants max power near redline so he doesn't have to have a set of 1.8 rear gears made....
The single-length inlet will make max power at a one particular rpm- this is what Carl wants. For a road-racer, a variable-length or multi-resonance-tuned intake system makes better power at all other rpm ranges. The flappy and unequal-length runners make the S4 a 2-stage system. I believe the GT3 is 3-stage system. Variable-length trumpets provide for a wide range of tuning, but are $$$ to make and tune correctly.
Louie and Mike Simard can probably give you more specific info on how their ITB's are tuned...
11" is from the back of the valve, measured as it should be. Carl wants max power near redline so he doesn't have to have a set of 1.8 rear gears made....
The single-length inlet will make max power at a one particular rpm- this is what Carl wants. For a road-racer, a variable-length or multi-resonance-tuned intake system makes better power at all other rpm ranges. The flappy and unequal-length runners make the S4 a 2-stage system. I believe the GT3 is 3-stage system. Variable-length trumpets provide for a wide range of tuning, but are $$$ to make and tune correctly.
Louie and Mike Simard can probably give you more specific info on how their ITB's are tuned...
07-09-2010, 04:21 PM
#37
Developer
Thread Starter
Thanks guys. Thanks very much. Somewhere between 2 and 3 years ago I set out on the general project that I wanted you guys to be able to hop-up a 928 just like a SBC, with readilly available parts right off the shelf.
A look at the new Products I have posted shows I have been methodically chewing through the engine from induction thorugh exhaust.
Its nearly all there now.
A look at the new Products I have posted shows I have been methodically chewing through the engine from induction thorugh exhaust.
Its nearly all there now.
07-09-2010, 04:25 PM
#38
Developer
Thread Starter
11" is from the back of the valve, measured as it should be. Carl wants max power near redline so he doesn't have to have a set of 1.8 rear gears made....
The single-length inlet will make max power at a one particular rpm- this is what Carl wants. For a road-racer, a variable-length or multi-resonance-tuned intake system makes better power at all other rpm ranges. The flappy and unequal-length runners make the S4 a 2-stage system.
The single-length inlet will make max power at a one particular rpm- this is what Carl wants. For a road-racer, a variable-length or multi-resonance-tuned intake system makes better power at all other rpm ranges. The flappy and unequal-length runners make the S4 a 2-stage system.
FYI, there is 3.47" from the back of the valve to the intake manifold flange surface. That is included in all intake runner length calculations.
Or buy my wife a S4 auto!
07-09-2010, 06:42 PM
#42
Developer
Thread Starter
Kibort:
Not at all. Simple, yes (flow-testing an intake runner is pretty simple) but not meaningless.
The formula for a Sprint Car engine is fairly well defined, and we know that in order to make 800 HP from a 400 ci SBC engine with 4-valve heads we have to move 360 CFM through the heads. I wouldn't say its cook-book engineering, but it is a pretty good yardstick, and it tells me that I also need to flow 360 CFM through my heads if I want to produce 800 HP with my 6.57L 928 motor (401ci)
So we flow-benched our heads, cams, and big valve package to make sure they would flow at least 360 CFM, and we got it.
And we tested our intake runners to make sure they would not be a restiction.... they have to flow 360 CFM also to support those heads. We worked them until they DID flow our numbers, and then we stopped.
Its a matched system: intake, intake valves, heads, cams.
In order for me to hit the HP number I want, they all have to flow their numbers.
Thats what we were testing for. Certainly not meaningless!
that flow test is pretty meaningless, right?
The formula for a Sprint Car engine is fairly well defined, and we know that in order to make 800 HP from a 400 ci SBC engine with 4-valve heads we have to move 360 CFM through the heads. I wouldn't say its cook-book engineering, but it is a pretty good yardstick, and it tells me that I also need to flow 360 CFM through my heads if I want to produce 800 HP with my 6.57L 928 motor (401ci)
So we flow-benched our heads, cams, and big valve package to make sure they would flow at least 360 CFM, and we got it.
And we tested our intake runners to make sure they would not be a restiction.... they have to flow 360 CFM also to support those heads. We worked them until they DID flow our numbers, and then we stopped.
Its a matched system: intake, intake valves, heads, cams.
In order for me to hit the HP number I want, they all have to flow their numbers.
Thats what we were testing for. Certainly not meaningless!
Last edited by Carl Fausett; 07-11-2010 at 07:02 PM.
07-09-2010, 07:02 PM
#43
Rennlist Member
So, It does make sense. I get it now. 
Hey, in thinking about it, I have actually run the S4 without the covers and with the 2 throttlebody set up. no gains were found, so it stands to reason, even if the rest of the intake is bad, the runners are worse.
Sounds like you got it all figured out. again, it would be interesting to see what that set up does just bolted on a stock NA S4. any plans?
Steve: LSR...............oh, I get it now, never heard that abreviation.
Hey, in thinking about it, I have actually run the S4 without the covers and with the 2 throttlebody set up. no gains were found, so it stands to reason, even if the rest of the intake is bad, the runners are worse.
Sounds like you got it all figured out. again, it would be interesting to see what that set up does just bolted on a stock NA S4. any plans?
Steve: LSR...............oh, I get it now, never heard that abreviation.
Kibort:
Not at all. Simple, yes (flow-testing and intake runner is pretty simple) but not meaningless.
The formula for a Sprint Car engine is fairly well defined, and we know that in order to make 800 HP from a SBC engine with 4-valve heads we have to move 360 CFM through the heads of the 400 cubic inch V8. I wouldn't say its cook-book engineering, but it is a pretty good yardstick, and it tells me that I need to flow 360 CFM through the heads if I want to produce 800 HP as well with my 6.57L 928 motor (also 401ci)
So we flow-benched our heads, cams, and big valve package to make sure they would flow at least 360 CFM, and we got it.
And we tested our intake runners to make sure they would not be a restiction.... they have to flow 360 CFM also to support those heads. We worked them until they DID flow our numbers, and then we stopped.
Its a matched system: intake, intake valves, heads, cams.
In order for me to hit the HP number I want, they all have to flow their numbers.
Thats what we were testing for. Certainly not meaningless!
Not at all. Simple, yes (flow-testing and intake runner is pretty simple) but not meaningless.
The formula for a Sprint Car engine is fairly well defined, and we know that in order to make 800 HP from a SBC engine with 4-valve heads we have to move 360 CFM through the heads of the 400 cubic inch V8. I wouldn't say its cook-book engineering, but it is a pretty good yardstick, and it tells me that I need to flow 360 CFM through the heads if I want to produce 800 HP as well with my 6.57L 928 motor (also 401ci)
So we flow-benched our heads, cams, and big valve package to make sure they would flow at least 360 CFM, and we got it.
And we tested our intake runners to make sure they would not be a restiction.... they have to flow 360 CFM also to support those heads. We worked them until they DID flow our numbers, and then we stopped.
Its a matched system: intake, intake valves, heads, cams.
In order for me to hit the HP number I want, they all have to flow their numbers.
Thats what we were testing for. Certainly not meaningless!
