JKelly

pm sent

leperboy

John's manual covers 85-86.5 and is invaluable, even if you're putting on a Porkensioner.

Matt

Gary Knox

Bump - Just because this is such an incredible write-up!!

Gary

LEADASS

This is unbelievable, what a resource! I just have one problem... My motor is out of the car. This is a used engine with no flywheel, how can I fix the crank position? The clamp or whatever has to be strong enough to loosen the pulley, harmonic balancer bolt (217 ft lbs)

Dwayne

I haven't encountered this particular situation. Sounds like you're ready to remove the crank pulleys but no flywheel to lock the crank in place while loosening the bolt. I have taken the bolt off with the engine out of the car on an engine stand. Used a prybar to hold the flywheel (levering off one of the engine stand mounts, IIRC. Seems like the simplest method would be to locate a flywheel. What flywheel were you intending to use with the motor after the repair? Is it possible to borrow a flywheel?

If I were faced with the same dilema without a flywheel, I would try to manufacture a rig that would bolt on to the flange where the flywheel would go and attach a couple of thick pins or Bolts 180 degrees across from each other on the rig. Then use a straight iron, like a crowbar, to use as a lever to hold the crank in position while you loosen the crank bolt. Assuming you have the engine on an engine stand, you could use the engine mounting bolts to the engine stand as a Stop for the rod or crowbar to lever against while taking the bolt out. Just some thoughts....let us know how it goes.

recondoc

I am a new 928 owner. I picked up a 1986 928 S less than two weeks ago. It is a automatic transmission with 135,000 miles on it. The car has some service history. I know that the timing belt was changed at 120 K service work. That was 15,000 miles or so ago. However, it was also about 10 years ago. There are a couple of receipts noting that the belt tension was checked after that. Can it wait to change the timing belt for a say another 5-10 K? There is an electrical problem I would like to get fixed. The car also intermittently "surges" runs a little rough at a stop light, I repeat intermittenly, does not do it all the time. In the two weeks that I have had the car I have put well over a thousand miles on it without incident (other than getting pulled over 3 times police and never be given a ticket).
What do you all think? Can the timing belt wait for awhile whilst I work on other matters?
Also, the left tail light goes out every time I turn the headlights on. Has anyone had this problem before and have a good fix?

Recondoc

David R. Engle

Stromius

TB is typically suggested for replacement at 45k/5 years. Belts get brittle and your better off taking this on sooner than later. Figure a few days.

Electrical/idle could be many things. Start with search feature on this forum and test the usual suspects (TPS, ISV, Temp2, O2 sensor et c.) and see FAQ sticky thread at the top.

Welcome!

jcorenman

David, Welcome!! Consider starting a thread with some details about your car, and a few photo's. (And also questions about tail-lights, which is probably a ground connection somewhere-- but will be viewed more favorably in its own thread).

Uh, No. Sorry.

I think most folks here would recommend changing the belt and refreshing the tensioner after 6 or 8 years, irrespective of mileage. Rubber gets funky (hard and brittle) over time, even if not exercised.

However, there are lots of variables, and stored correctly there are timing belts from King Tut's tomb that are perfectly serviceable.

At a minimum, pull one of the belt covers and have a good look. Turn the engine over by hand (27mm deep socket and a long 1/2"-drive ratchet-handle to reach the bolt inside the pulleys), always clockwise facing the motor from the front. Make sure all the teeth are there and look happy, and no cracking or other signs of distress. If in doubt, post some pictures. (Tools are important, a good camera is high on the list).

Cool!! Go buy a lottery ticket, quick!! And then buy a radar detector, pronto!!

pcar928fan

David,

It was GREAT meeting you today! He just showed up at our little *** GTG today! It was a GREAT surprise! Then he joined us over at the Dyno Day for the PCA and met the main 928 mechanic in town who was doing a dyno run with his son and his son's 944 (with a 968 motor).

I think he got the same advice from all of us too...suck it up and change the belt... David, if you don't have to have the car for DD purposes then take your time and follow Dwayne's very well documented procedure, if you need the car back and can't afford to have it off the road then you might let Matt at TPWS handle it this first time. Since he owns an '85 (and has for well over a decade) he will be VERY familiar w/ the procedure on your car and it should go quickly!

BTW, guys, this is quite a nice '85! I am really pretty impressed with it. I think he got lucky on this one!

mikepmcs

resurrection of this thread because i'm doing this very procedure right now. I'm running back and forth from here to the garage. LOL!

I'm actually putting everything back together(had to change the water pump due to failure and I also installed Ken's tensioner) and when I started to put the new timing belt on and route it.... the right or driver's side(as I'm looking at it) cam gear sprung about 15 to 20* clockwise. Am I safe to just back it counter clockwise back to where my paint mark lines up or do I need to go around clockwise and then.... how many times do I need to do that...? Just one time around right to get it back to where my paint marks line up or do I need to do some funky chicken dance secret national treasure nic cage combination thingy to make sure my timing is still where it needs to be.
Thanks.

tmpusfugit

As a fairly new 928 owner (slightly over a year, 3 16 valve 928’s) I have read and paid particular attention to the work of Sharkskin, Dwayne, Wally, MrMerlin, Landseer, and several others. A very big thanks to all by the way.

Some of the recommendations make absolute sense and the procedures so well detailed by several make driving a 928 today still possible.

Sometimes the recommendations seem a bit counter intuitive, for example changing a water pump with every timing belt change, and that change being dictated by either time or miles (usually time for most of us).

To the story….I bought a 72k mile ’84 last September that had sat for nearly 10 years. A great deal of money had been spent on it during that time, work done, a lot of parts replaced, but just driven 500 miles in that length of time. The records showed a new WP and TB less than 1150 miles (but 10 years ago) previously, done, by Don McGill Porsche in Houston.

The car as purchased by me had no dash, no pod, and most of the dash wiring had been cut off at the cluster connections and the like. So, after a lot of time with the ’84 schematic, and lighting more than a few candles, the car was returned to running condition last November. I have accumulated about 2000 more miles, but in the back of my mind there was the combined recommendations all mentioned above regarding WP and TB.

An oil leak on the front of the engine yesterday prompted me to “do the right thing” and start the complete TB/WP idlers, tensioner, front seal, oil pump reseal and the like.

On teardown I discovered the following, remember, done by a “premier” Porsche Dealership;
• Water pump had 3 missing bolts, RTV in the holes instead of bolts
• Heavy application of RTV on the gasket
• Leaking at the front of the shaft slightly (and we all know they never get better, only worse)
• Broken off screw that retains the cam belt cover on the passenger side, will have to be drilled out and re-tapped
• A buildup on the impeller that is calcium like (iron impeller), the rest of the cooling system looks OK on the inside, the outsides of the radiator hose connections and the like have a fair amount of aluminum oxide formation. Appears to have had Prestone antifreeze at time of my tear down.
• Buildup of grease and dirt suggests that the idlers were not changed
• Oil in tensioner is more grease like than oil, very thick, think almost like axle grease, not 90 weight oil
• Looks like a new Porsche WP, not apparently a rebuilt unit. Failed anyhow…..in less than 3500 miles, but more than 10 years…no never sieze or similar sealant on any of the water pump bolts


So, lessons learned;
• Listen to Sharkskin, Dwayne, Wally, MrMerlin, Landseer, and several others. Their advice is near 100% correct in this case….
• Just because a big dealership did it doesn’t make it done right
• Time and chemistry prevail over miles in these things, and the chemistry is not understood by me in regard to the deposits on the impeller. Any thoughts as to what is happening to the impeller? It can be seen that the rest of the inside of the pump has no deposits at all, nor does any of the rest of the visible cooling system. It is not rust on the impeller. Very strange.

Tony

Stop leak??

Tony

FYI...John Pirtle has had a write up for eons on his website. While not as detailed as Dwyanes, its the one i have printed in a binder sitting on my fender right now.
http://members.rennlist.com/pirtle/svc.html

SeanR

I think Tony is correct, that looks like Stop leak and the reason it is forming there is due to cavitation at the impeller.

At least that is my thought. It is supposed to form where air meets the water.

mikepmcs

Thanks for the responses and the story as well. That's exactly what this one is but not to that extent. It looks like a Porsche shop rushed a quick timing belt job and neglected everything else. The water pump failed within 100 miles from the time it was delivered to me. In the PO's defense, the work was done by a Porsche dealer and not him. Who knows what transpired in conversation between owner and mechanic in regards to work done vs needed\ but I'll take the high road and consider it the shops mistake.
Regardless I've had the car for over a year and haven't even driven it but 3 times. A very very long Winter and other obligations kept me out of the garage for quite a few months. No heat in there. LOL!Maybe a little remorse and laziness thrown in.
Anyway, I'm about to put it back together, not rushing and will definitely have that handy little manual you were so kind as to put the link to.
I'm almost back to where I started 6 months ago which is halfway torn apart when I stopped to buy parts and became intrigued with Ken's tensioner. More saving up money and getting the right parts also contributed to the delay but who am I kidding....I'm the king of procrastination. Off I go.

Mike :-)