cold_beer839

Damn, I love these cars, but am I missing something here? This appears to be a run-of-the-mill S4 auto with average-ish miles and condition.

Please enlighten me.

http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/1989-...lenotsupported

Mike LaBranche

It's entirely presentation... looks expensive, lots of sales messaging (integrity, trust, etc), sold at 'Victory!! Motorcars'. And the reserve still isn't met. Good grief. Me, I'll take a dirty car with a fresh t-belt over a shiny, barely driven, garage queen.

User 4221

Do a RL search on Robert Neal and Victory......... Then see if you will do business with this guy.

Jadz928

Well then, I have just the car for you....

My guess, shill bidding.

cold_beer839

Yeah, shill bidding is very likely. He has blocked the bidder ID's so you can't see if there are different bidders, or just one (his ghost bidder ID). Probably ran the bidding up to his 'reserve' using his ghost ID so the next real bidder gets the car. I hope nobody falls for that.

RKD in OKC

Very proud of their detail guy. Ebay started blocking bidder ids.

jcorenman

Nonsense, this is one of those rare pre-owned air-cooled 928's.

cold_beer839

It's not eBay that blocks the bidder ID's. eBay just partially conceals their user names, but you can still see they are different bidders and you can see their feedback scores. Like on this listing:

http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/Porsc...lenotsupported

This guy has used the option to completely block their identities, and probably did so to conceal his shill bidding.

Sharkbody

I agree completely. The next bidder, or perhaps the first bidder, will be on the hook. That whole anonymous bidder thing, excluding the abbreviated references used recently by Ebay is a huge waving red flag. G

SeanR

Victories cars never sell on E-bay.

Do a search and you will see the game they play. There was a thread here and on Pelican this month were they came and tried to defend the way they do business. Was not pretty.

penns4

Guys and gals you better believe these cars are going to become more expensivewith each one crashed broken up etc.etc.etc. stop moaning

Leon Speed

Hello, care to introduce yourself?

penns4

Aryan,- have owned S4 for around 1.5 years so still a learning process for me but with each little fix or repair this car runs faster and better,- will be seeking advice on a couple of issues on the list shortly.We are fortunate here in S.E. PA in that we have some long term 928 owners who know these cas really well and are accessible for help, namely Earl Gilstrom and Gary Knox.My opinion , throw bigger wheels on any 928 and they look great.

Bill Ball

Au contraire, it's sellers that are moaning. A large number of excellent 928s for sale are languishing at historically low prices.

The supposed bid for this S4 is way out of line with recent sales. "Private" auctions are always seriously suspect. I like eBay and bought my 928 there 9 years ago and have bought and sold other cars and motorcycles on eBay. I'd never participate in a "private" auction. They are a haven for fraudulent "shill" bidding. The seller can too easily bid on his/her own stuff with a second account or get other employees or friends to post fake bids, hoping some gullible soul believes the bids are real and gets sucked into the auction. There is no way to detect this with private auctions. Before eBay "anonymized" the regular auctions, you could see the bid patterns, such as two people bidding up each others items. Now shill bidding is harder to detect in general, but it has always been impossible to detect in "private" auctions. I would recommend no one here bid on this car or any car offered in a "private" auction, period.

Jim Morton

I agree with all of Bill's comments but also think that many of the 928 sellers who are moaning are doing so because of poor marketing or staging of their cars.

So many hobbiests choose to tell their story of ownership when selling without thinking of how thier tale will come across to a perspective buyer, especially a "noob". As example, listing that a car has done multiple track days or listing many, overly specified new parts can make a car look questionable rather than more valuable. IMHO, those stories are best left for after someone has real interest in the car.

Also, I think that only "noob"s would pay the high prices for our cars, unless the car being sold is already desired by a potential buyer. For that case, I doubt the car would ever need to be listed on EBay. I suppose I'll find out if I decide to sell my black car...

For this white beauty on EBay, I too see a shill bidding pattern, but at the same time the staging and auction listing are done in such a way that could likely lure a novice P-Car buyer into thinking there is high value to this car.