928 Motorsports + Electromotive
#61
Nordschleife Master
As to the MAP, it isnt a huge issue to get a line properly to it with no delay.
If you use a massive line then you will have issues, but my vacuum line was about 1.5' and I had zero latency.
If you use a massive line then you will have issues, but my vacuum line was about 1.5' and I had zero latency.
#64
Official Bay Area Patriot
Fuse 24 Assassin
Rennlist Member
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Rennlist Member
Not sure I understand what you mean built into the case...
I was wondering what would be the best area to run a vacuum line to the MAP from the intake, i.e that 5-way splitter in the back of the engine.
I was wondering what would be the best area to run a vacuum line to the MAP from the intake, i.e that 5-way splitter in the back of the engine.
#65
Race Car
Dan
'91 928GT S/C 475hp/460lb.ft
#66
Inventor
Rennlist Member
Rennlist Member
Yes that would probably be the best place. I wouldn't worry so much about the length of the line as long as you keep the diameter stock. Remember that the early 32-valve engines have a line from there down to the EZF box in the passenger footwell because that brain actually has a built-in MAP sensor.
Speaking of which - Colin - you need to help me figure out turbo sizing for a mid turbo for my '85. I'm hot to reprogram a KLR box for it, if only so I can use the 951 tach.
#68
Inventor
Rennlist Member
Rennlist Member
'87-up has EZK ignition, which uses a processed LH load output, MAF+RPM, instead of a MAP sensor, so no vacuum line.
#69
Official Bay Area Patriot
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I thought so.... I hope Carl is seeing all this and can clarify this up.
Holy Crap! I just remembered that there is a nozzle on either the top or bottom of my throttle body that wasn't used. Why not use one of those for the MAP?
Holy Crap! I just remembered that there is a nozzle on either the top or bottom of my throttle body that wasn't used. Why not use one of those for the MAP?
#70
It would matter if it was at the top or bottom. You need manifold reference - meaning NOT before the TB.
#71
Official Bay Area Patriot
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This one was after. Now that I think about it, it was open on the bottom. That was the charcoal cannister one I believe. I used one of the top 2 nozzles for it after the intake R&R.
#72
Developer
Thread Starter
I don't see that TEC3 can be tuned through the MAF also according to Electromotive's website. If it can be tuned via MAF like the stock LH does, is it no longer necessary to even use a MAP sensor? If the MAP is necessary, where would you recommend installing it on an S4 manifold for optimum accuracy.
Where would you recommend mounting the threaded temperature sensor at, and do I need to drill and weld to adapt the sensor to the magnesium manifold (isn't welding magnesium dangerous???)
Sorry for all the questions, but I'm really interested to see how these Stand-Alones work and I would really like to adapt this to my aging 928.
Where would you recommend mounting the threaded temperature sensor at, and do I need to drill and weld to adapt the sensor to the magnesium manifold (isn't welding magnesium dangerous???)
Sorry for all the questions, but I'm really interested to see how these Stand-Alones work and I would really like to adapt this to my aging 928.
You might also be interested in this thread where you can see the Electromotive system installed on the 16v race car. This is the one that I am tuning now: https://rennlist.com/forums/928-foru...prototype.html
As to your research - read up more on the TecGT system instead of the Tec3 system. I am using the TecGT system instead of the Tec3 because I do not need the capability to run 8 EGT sensors and full sequential injector timing.
It would be nice for the race car, but not what my customers need. Too complex. So I am focusing on the TecGT system, simpler install, simpler tuning.
As to your questions: the TecGT system will allow you to continue to use your MAF sensor if you must, but most folks wont. A lotof new cars have done away with them.... it's very 90's. A MAP sensor and a TPS (throttle Position Sensor) does the trick now...
As to temp sensors: for water, we are connecting to and using the stock coolant sensors int he water bridge. As to air temp, you want your sensor in the central plenum or close to it. Your comment about welding to the magnesium alloy is valid - you dont want to do that.
You could mount the air temp sensor in the air box the way Porsche did in '85-'86 and avoid the whole problem. Or in the tubing just before the throttle body.
Or drill and tap a thick wall of the manifiold itself and seal it with JB Weld on the threads (it makes a darn good thread sealant).
#73
Developer
Thread Starter
One more thing: as to where to pull the plenum signal line for the MAP.
Avoid high-velocity areas and try to locate an air-flow "dead spot". These are more ideal for placement of the MAP signal port. Middle of a high speed air stream - not so good for measuring pressure. Dead air spot outside of any direct air stream, center of the plenum or corner of the plenum (away from the direct path of an individual runner) - better.
Avoid high-velocity areas and try to locate an air-flow "dead spot". These are more ideal for placement of the MAP signal port. Middle of a high speed air stream - not so good for measuring pressure. Dead air spot outside of any direct air stream, center of the plenum or corner of the plenum (away from the direct path of an individual runner) - better.
#74
Official Bay Area Patriot
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I didn't realize that TecGT was so much more simpler than the Tec3 setup. Impressive. That probably attracted me even more to buying this setup.
What would be a good example of where there is a low/no-velocity location on the S4/GT intake manifold, or where would you recommend the MAP line at? I would prefer to use a vacuum location already on the intake manifold and no modifications.
I am definitely taking it into consideration of mounting the IAT on the bottom side of the airbox.
What would be a good example of where there is a low/no-velocity location on the S4/GT intake manifold, or where would you recommend the MAP line at? I would prefer to use a vacuum location already on the intake manifold and no modifications.
I am definitely taking it into consideration of mounting the IAT on the bottom side of the airbox.
#75
Fleet of Foot
Rennlist Member
Rennlist Member
We have not done one with our customers yet, but maybe someone will answer who has done the upgrade themselves.
I would expect lower emissions and not troouble passing inspection. All the OEM equipment (cats, air pump, etc) could be retained to satisfy the visual inspection, and the emissions will go down with the longer duration spark and more accurate fuel metering and timing events.
I would expect lower emissions and not troouble passing inspection. All the OEM equipment (cats, air pump, etc) could be retained to satisfy the visual inspection, and the emissions will go down with the longer duration spark and more accurate fuel metering and timing events.