No Start/Towing
03-06-2008, 01:04 AM
#1
Burning Brakes
Thread Starter
No Start/Towing
Hello,
Been a while since I've been on and almost as long since I've driven my car; too many reasons to list on both counts. Did some searching here on my issue, but didn't think I found THE answer. Here's what's up:
She cranks and rumbles, but won't stay running. Happened a couple of weeks back and she finally started and I drove; stalled like the key got turned off and then got her started and home. Starter sounds like it's "slipping" and won't stay engaged - and I'm worried that I'm screwing the starter or worse up by continuing to try. Unfortunately I have little time to work, so I may be forced to get it towed to a reputable shop that I've used before ~100 miles away. Need to have them work on my A/C anyway.
Questions:
Should I still try to start w/questionable starter? (I don't want to mess up the starter or more )? OR
Get it towed (I'm requesting a flatbed/demanding, if towed)?
If towed, any "do's and don'ts" for the person towing? i.e. "Don't pull it up on the truck by the _____." or "Don't lash it down by the ______."
Thanks in advance and sorry for the long post.
Regards,
David
Been a while since I've been on and almost as long since I've driven my car; too many reasons to list on both counts. Did some searching here on my issue, but didn't think I found THE answer. Here's what's up:
She cranks and rumbles, but won't stay running. Happened a couple of weeks back and she finally started and I drove; stalled like the key got turned off and then got her started and home. Starter sounds like it's "slipping" and won't stay engaged - and I'm worried that I'm screwing the starter or worse up by continuing to try. Unfortunately I have little time to work, so I may be forced to get it towed to a reputable shop that I've used before ~100 miles away. Need to have them work on my A/C anyway.
Questions:
Should I still try to start w/questionable starter? (I don't want to mess up the starter or more )? OR
Get it towed (I'm requesting a flatbed/demanding, if towed)?
If towed, any "do's and don'ts" for the person towing? i.e. "Don't pull it up on the truck by the _____." or "Don't lash it down by the ______."
Thanks in advance and sorry for the long post.
Regards,
David
03-06-2008, 01:23 AM
#2
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Sounds like the starter isn't engaging fully. Probably time for a new one. On my 81 I would have random no start problems until I figured out it was the starter. I took a 2x4 to it and it's been good ever since. It just took a little gentle persuasion.
03-06-2008, 02:09 AM
#3
If starter no engaging fully, maybe it need a bit of TLC (Tender Loving Care).
Repair by replacement is an expensive option when all that it needs is to be removed, disassembled and routine maintenance carried out..
The solenoide "throw in" coil may be faulty or the linkage may need to be greased.
The throw in spur gear may need to be dressed up ( the rough edges filed off) as they tend to get a bit of a hiding as they engage the ring gear.
The throw in/out spline needs to be cleaned up and re-lubricated, so the the spur gear moves freely along the spline.
The solonide yoke need to be checked for correct operation especially the fulcrum pin for wear.
The armature needs to be removed from the casing and cleaned and the stator field coils also need to be cleaned. First blow out with compressed air and then clean with an electrical solvent and then allow to dry out. Check for break down of insulation in the field coils and armature windings.
The armature commutator needs to be checked for wear and any foreign matter removed from between the commutator segments. The commutator may need to be machined and the insulation between the segments may need to be undercut and dressed up.
The brushers need to be checked to see whether the are worn out or the copper connectors are impinging on the commutator. You may need to renew the brushers.
In addition it may also need new bearing. The bearing fitted will be stand type that can be obtained from you local bearing suppliers.
All in all it is quite a simple maintenance procedure and if you need the commutator machined this can be done by an auto electrician. He can also under cut the insulation segments and dress up the commutator segments after this undercutting.
The new brushes need to be bedded in. This is an easy procedure by using a fine silicone sand paper with the paper side rapped around the commutator and drawn through the brushes when they are under spring tension onto the commutator.
Tails 1990 928 S4 Auto.
Repair by replacement is an expensive option when all that it needs is to be removed, disassembled and routine maintenance carried out..
The solenoide "throw in" coil may be faulty or the linkage may need to be greased.
The throw in spur gear may need to be dressed up ( the rough edges filed off) as they tend to get a bit of a hiding as they engage the ring gear.
The throw in/out spline needs to be cleaned up and re-lubricated, so the the spur gear moves freely along the spline.
The solonide yoke need to be checked for correct operation especially the fulcrum pin for wear.
The armature needs to be removed from the casing and cleaned and the stator field coils also need to be cleaned. First blow out with compressed air and then clean with an electrical solvent and then allow to dry out. Check for break down of insulation in the field coils and armature windings.
The armature commutator needs to be checked for wear and any foreign matter removed from between the commutator segments. The commutator may need to be machined and the insulation between the segments may need to be undercut and dressed up.
The brushers need to be checked to see whether the are worn out or the copper connectors are impinging on the commutator. You may need to renew the brushers.
In addition it may also need new bearing. The bearing fitted will be stand type that can be obtained from you local bearing suppliers.
All in all it is quite a simple maintenance procedure and if you need the commutator machined this can be done by an auto electrician. He can also under cut the insulation segments and dress up the commutator segments after this undercutting.
The new brushes need to be bedded in. This is an easy procedure by using a fine silicone sand paper with the paper side rapped around the commutator and drawn through the brushes when they are under spring tension onto the commutator.
Tails 1990 928 S4 Auto.
03-06-2008, 03:29 AM
#4
Team Owner
recommend to not hit the starter with hammer this can shatter the permanaet magnets inside
03-06-2008, 04:50 AM
#5
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03-06-2008, 09:50 AM
#6
Burning Brakes
Thread Starter
It almost seems as though its a fuel delivery issue, but I hear the fuel pump running.If starter no engaging fully, maybe it need a bit of TLC (Tender Loving Care).
Repair by replacement is an expensive option when all that it needs is to be removed, disassembled and routine maintenance carried out..
The solenoide "throw in" coil may be faulty or the linkage may need to be greased.
The throw in spur gear may need to be dressed up ( the rough edges filed off) as they tend to get a bit of a hiding as they engage the ring gear.
The throw in/out spline needs to be cleaned up and re-lubricated, so the the spur gear moves freely along the spline.
The solonide yoke need to be checked for correct operation especially the fulcrum pin for wear.
The armature needs to be removed from the casing and cleaned and the stator field coils also need to be cleaned. First blow out with compressed air and then clean with an electrical solvent and then allow to dry out. Check for break down of insulation in the field coils and armature windings.
The armature commutator needs to be checked for wear and any foreign matter removed from between the commutator segments. The commutator may need to be machined and the insulation between the segments may need to be undercut and dressed up.
The brushers need to be checked to see whether the are worn out or the copper connectors are impinging on the commutator. You may need to renew the brushers.
In addition it may also need new bearing. The bearing fitted will be stand type that can be obtained from you local bearing suppliers.
All in all it is quite a simple maintenance procedure and if you need the commutator machined this can be done by an auto electrician. He can also under cut the insulation segments and dress up the commutator segments after this undercutting.
The new brushes need to be bedded in. This is an easy procedure by using a fine silicone sand paper with the paper side rapped around the commutator and drawn through the brushes when they are under spring tension onto the commutator.
Tails 1990 928 S4 Auto.
Repair by replacement is an expensive option when all that it needs is to be removed, disassembled and routine maintenance carried out..
The solenoide "throw in" coil may be faulty or the linkage may need to be greased.
The throw in spur gear may need to be dressed up ( the rough edges filed off) as they tend to get a bit of a hiding as they engage the ring gear.
The throw in/out spline needs to be cleaned up and re-lubricated, so the the spur gear moves freely along the spline.
The solonide yoke need to be checked for correct operation especially the fulcrum pin for wear.
The armature needs to be removed from the casing and cleaned and the stator field coils also need to be cleaned. First blow out with compressed air and then clean with an electrical solvent and then allow to dry out. Check for break down of insulation in the field coils and armature windings.
The armature commutator needs to be checked for wear and any foreign matter removed from between the commutator segments. The commutator may need to be machined and the insulation between the segments may need to be undercut and dressed up.
The brushers need to be checked to see whether the are worn out or the copper connectors are impinging on the commutator. You may need to renew the brushers.
In addition it may also need new bearing. The bearing fitted will be stand type that can be obtained from you local bearing suppliers.
All in all it is quite a simple maintenance procedure and if you need the commutator machined this can be done by an auto electrician. He can also under cut the insulation segments and dress up the commutator segments after this undercutting.
The new brushes need to be bedded in. This is an easy procedure by using a fine silicone sand paper with the paper side rapped around the commutator and drawn through the brushes when they are under spring tension onto the commutator.
Tails 1990 928 S4 Auto.
Thanks.
03-06-2008, 01:51 PM
#7
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The starter does fully engage, it just disengages sooner than it should, IMHO. For several months leading up to yesterday, it would give an intermittent sound every ~10th start. I would compare the sound to a dry-wall screw being drilled into the wall... It almost seems as though its a fuel delivery issue, but I hear the fuel pump running.
All of that is great info and I wish I had the time and know-how to do it. As complicated as what you've indicated sounds, it almost seems like a replacement would be easier. I don't see how it could be less expensive unless I did it, which I simply cannot.
Hammer - no. 2 x 4 - I thought about it yesterday, but couldn't ever hit my car...
Thanks.
It almost seems as though its a fuel delivery issue, but I hear the fuel pump running.All of that is great info and I wish I had the time and know-how to do it. As complicated as what you've indicated sounds, it almost seems like a replacement would be easier. I don't see how it could be less expensive unless I did it, which I simply cannot.
Hammer - no. 2 x 4 - I thought about it yesterday, but couldn't ever hit my car...
Thanks.
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03-06-2008, 08:24 PM
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David glad to see you back on. From what you describe, and also from the fact that you said that you haven't driven the car very much lately - you may just have a low battery on the amperage side that is. It maybe showing good on voltage, but if your amp's are down it will act just like you stated- I would pull it out and have it tested just to make shure.
Mike
Mike
03-06-2008, 10:40 PM
#9
Burning Brakes
Thread Starter
Update
David glad to see you back on. From what you describe, and also from the fact that you said that you haven't driven the car very much lately - you may just have a low battery on the amperage side that is. It maybe showing good on voltage, but if your amp's are down it will act just like you stated- I would pull it out and have it tested just to make shure.
Mike
Mike
Well, all the while she's been sitting, I've kept her hooked up to a battery-tender, so the battery's as good as it can be. I did, against what some may say is "better judgment" get some starter fluid during my lunch break - ah a small town.... A couple of shots and I got her going and she idled like a champ; I even got a few blips on the throttle after a bit. She stayed on for a minute or two and when she died, I did hear clicking on the fuse panel, which leads me to believe that it's a relay. Also, I'm wondering if the Sta-bil wasn't enough to keep the gas OK.
Ironically, while I have time to respond to this (and to hopefully hear suggestions), I didn't have the daylight to swap out the relay. I think I bought a spare a year or so ago and now to find it...
Out of town this weekend, so it'll have to be next week before I know anything definitive.Thanks.
Regards,
David,
03-10-2008, 11:00 PM
#10
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You might try jumpering the fuel pump relay I believe it's 30 to 87 (Check the wiring chart to be sure)to make the pump stay on constant. That way you atleast know the pump is running. Mine runs with the car off when jumpered so don't forget to pull the jumper when done.
Last edited by 6mil928; 03-10-2008 at 11:19 PM.