New guy question... purists?
03-24-2002 | 03:23 PM
#1
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7th Gear
Joined: Mar 2002
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From: Muncie, IN
New guy question... purists?
this is a post I put on the general forum, but only got one response. Thought it would do better here. The one response I DID get is very frustrating 
ecrosier
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User # 6186
posted 03-22-2002 17:27
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Hello, everyone. This is my first post. I have a general question (sort of). Okay, to set this up, I'm not all that new to Porsche's because my best friend is a big porsche guy (especially 944 and 968's). I recently bought my Miata after years of pining over one. But, upon interaction at the miata forum, I found that an OEM purist isn't very well received in those circles. Not many people like to keep them in OEM. I was very disheartened. That's how I like sports cars. Feeling rejected by my group, I'm thinking about selling the Miata and converting to Porsches (thinking 944 ... or 928, or 968... ha). I've always known there to be quite a few 'Porsche Purists'. Am I right in assuming my OEM purist ways would be well-accepted in the Porsche community?
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Posts: 1 | From: Muncie, IN | Registered: Mar 2002 | IP: Logged
Tom
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posted 03-22-2002 18:00
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The most puritanical of the Porsche purists would ask why get a 944 when you could get a Porsche instead? Getting over the dogma about "proper" engine location and cooling medium (whatever works), you will find a range of discussion from factory knows best to they made so many do what you want to yours. I prefer to think of a Chevy V-8 in a 944 as a rebodied Camaro rather than a re-engined Porsche, but there is room for many opinions.
If you really want to autocross, keep the Miata. If you want to go beyond that a 944 etc. gains wonderful access to driver's education at racetracks all over the country.
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ecrosier
New User
User # 6186
posted 03-22-2002 17:27
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Hello, everyone. This is my first post. I have a general question (sort of). Okay, to set this up, I'm not all that new to Porsche's because my best friend is a big porsche guy (especially 944 and 968's). I recently bought my Miata after years of pining over one. But, upon interaction at the miata forum, I found that an OEM purist isn't very well received in those circles. Not many people like to keep them in OEM. I was very disheartened. That's how I like sports cars. Feeling rejected by my group, I'm thinking about selling the Miata and converting to Porsches (thinking 944 ... or 928, or 968... ha). I've always known there to be quite a few 'Porsche Purists'. Am I right in assuming my OEM purist ways would be well-accepted in the Porsche community?
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Posts: 1 | From: Muncie, IN | Registered: Mar 2002 | IP: Logged
Tom
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User # 566
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posted 03-22-2002 18:00
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The most puritanical of the Porsche purists would ask why get a 944 when you could get a Porsche instead? Getting over the dogma about "proper" engine location and cooling medium (whatever works), you will find a range of discussion from factory knows best to they made so many do what you want to yours. I prefer to think of a Chevy V-8 in a 944 as a rebodied Camaro rather than a re-engined Porsche, but there is room for many opinions.
If you really want to autocross, keep the Miata. If you want to go beyond that a 944 etc. gains wonderful access to driver's education at racetracks all over the country.
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03-24-2002 | 06:18 PM
#2
Chronic Tool Dropper
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From: Bend, Oregon
Fortunately there is a pretty interesting variety of owners populating the list. So long as you don't threaten to put a corvair motor in a 928, most will support almost anything you might want to do (or not do) as far as maintenance and mod's.
I keep my car original as much as possible. Not saying I'm a purist, just don't feel the urge to re-engineer stuff that seems to work fine the way it was originally thunked up and executed. In the interests of practicality though, I'm also not afraid to take advantage of updated technology when it makes sense.
So my '89 is all original or factory except for the A/C conversion that used some aftermarket bits like the drier and hoses. Later-model factory wheels look better/different from the original flat disk wheels. I added a cup holder from VW/Audi. CD player replaces the original cassette deck in the dash.
So how "purist" do you plan to be? There are some practical things that get upgraded in newer models that are, in my opinion, easily justifiable. By the same token, virtually all the original parts are available new or used from the "big three" 928 parts suppliers, or ($$gasp$$) maybe even your local dealer.
So find a car you love and that loves you, and join in the fun. You will be supported by some, maybe criticized by others, but at the end of the day you'll be driving what is arguably one of the finest practical GT cars sold in the world.
Trust me...
I keep my car original as much as possible. Not saying I'm a purist, just don't feel the urge to re-engineer stuff that seems to work fine the way it was originally thunked up and executed. In the interests of practicality though, I'm also not afraid to take advantage of updated technology when it makes sense.
So my '89 is all original or factory except for the A/C conversion that used some aftermarket bits like the drier and hoses. Later-model factory wheels look better/different from the original flat disk wheels. I added a cup holder from VW/Audi. CD player replaces the original cassette deck in the dash.
So how "purist" do you plan to be? There are some practical things that get upgraded in newer models that are, in my opinion, easily justifiable. By the same token, virtually all the original parts are available new or used from the "big three" 928 parts suppliers, or ($$gasp$$) maybe even your local dealer.
So find a car you love and that loves you, and join in the fun. You will be supported by some, maybe criticized by others, but at the end of the day you'll be driving what is arguably one of the finest practical GT cars sold in the world.
Trust me...
03-24-2002 | 08:30 PM
#4
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From: Ft. Lauderdale FLORIDA
Ecro-
I've done both worlds now- the purist 928 world and the hot hatch Corrado scene, and I've enjoyed them both for various reasons.
-Yeah, that was me you saw a few years ago on a corner in downtown Orlando, baggy jeans about to fall off my butt, oversized shiny shirt, and hat on backwards. I ran with a little "gang" of car nuts who spent far more time making their cars look fast than actually making them faster. It was fun, but you know....something was missing.
So I bought the 928 and joined the Porsche Club of America. I showed up at the meeting wearing boat shoes, khaki pants [I even ironed them!], and a polo shirt. It was fun, I talked to some of the guys there, but you know....something was missing.
When I was running with "Volkswagen Racing", our car club, I had fun but I noticed that most of the boys there were unartistic, unintelligent, and easily amused. I got sick of street racing, or at least being goaded into contests of pure testosterone. And when I showed up for my one and only PCA meeting, I quickly found myself bored and what's worse...I sensed a subtle current of pretention directed toward me because my car was 14 years old, and because it was a 928. I left early and haven't been back.
-This hobby is what you make of it. Miata's are great cars- I've never owned one, but they look like fun and I'm sure they are easy on gas. But if socialization is what you want, then you need to decide just what sort of socialization you really wish for and tailor your automotive selection to that.
For what it is worth on the subject of Porsches, you will hear a different opinion from every Porsche owner. 911 guys say they are the original Porsche, and that everything else is phony. 944 guys say that 911's are overpriced and have dangerous handling traits, and 928 owners say that both are just toys with tiny engines that sound like crap. And the 911/944 guys go on to call our 928's overweight pigs. There are technical advantages to each platform- I chose a 928 because of its presence- I pull up at a stoplight and its like Darth Vader has just arrived. And 928's have equal or better handling than the other two main models of Porsche while costing less.
That and 928's have a bigger trunk.....
Anyway, cars are toys. If not, then go get a Metro or an Escort or a Neon. Buy the one that does the most for you, and good luck.
Normy!
'85 928 S2
'66 F100
'80 Jetta
'76 CB-750-4
I've done both worlds now- the purist 928 world and the hot hatch Corrado scene, and I've enjoyed them both for various reasons.
-Yeah, that was me you saw a few years ago on a corner in downtown Orlando, baggy jeans about to fall off my butt, oversized shiny shirt, and hat on backwards. I ran with a little "gang" of car nuts who spent far more time making their cars look fast than actually making them faster. It was fun, but you know....something was missing.
So I bought the 928 and joined the Porsche Club of America. I showed up at the meeting wearing boat shoes, khaki pants [I even ironed them!], and a polo shirt. It was fun, I talked to some of the guys there, but you know....something was missing.
When I was running with "Volkswagen Racing", our car club, I had fun but I noticed that most of the boys there were unartistic, unintelligent, and easily amused. I got sick of street racing, or at least being goaded into contests of pure testosterone. And when I showed up for my one and only PCA meeting, I quickly found myself bored and what's worse...I sensed a subtle current of pretention directed toward me because my car was 14 years old, and because it was a 928. I left early and haven't been back.
-This hobby is what you make of it. Miata's are great cars- I've never owned one, but they look like fun and I'm sure they are easy on gas. But if socialization is what you want, then you need to decide just what sort of socialization you really wish for and tailor your automotive selection to that.
For what it is worth on the subject of Porsches, you will hear a different opinion from every Porsche owner. 911 guys say they are the original Porsche, and that everything else is phony. 944 guys say that 911's are overpriced and have dangerous handling traits, and 928 owners say that both are just toys with tiny engines that sound like crap. And the 911/944 guys go on to call our 928's overweight pigs. There are technical advantages to each platform- I chose a 928 because of its presence- I pull up at a stoplight and its like Darth Vader has just arrived. And 928's have equal or better handling than the other two main models of Porsche while costing less.
That and 928's have a bigger trunk.....
Anyway, cars are toys. If not, then go get a Metro or an Escort or a Neon. Buy the one that does the most for you, and good luck.
Normy!
'85 928 S2
'66 F100
'80 Jetta
'76 CB-750-4
03-24-2002 | 10:25 PM
#5
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From: arizona
There are many opinions about how we should maintain our 928, but If you don't feel sense of driver and car becoming one when you get in and start her up, if there isn't excitment in your heart as you drive it, then the 928 is not for you.
The one thing that most 928 owners have in common is that thrill. To drive another type of car may be nice, but to drive a 928 is an adventure and each time we take them out is another chapter.
The one thing that most 928 owners have in common is that thrill. To drive another type of car may be nice, but to drive a 928 is an adventure and each time we take them out is another chapter.
03-24-2002 | 10:57 PM
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Ecrosier,
If I understand your question, you seem to be looking for a group of car owners that accepts newcomers for their purist tendencies.
The purist debate doesn't have much meaning when the car is not collectible and such is the case with the 928 - we're not there...yet. 20 years from now we may be worrying about factory steering wheel stitch patterns and that might be fun (emphasis on *might*). But perhaps a collectible Porsche 356 would better suit you as you'd find plenty of enthusiasts obsessed with factory originality who'd be pleased to see you sidle up to their swap meet table with a wad of cash.
I've found in the 928 community there are all kinds covering the gamut from rabid concours fettishists to hybrid Cheby engine swappers. It all depends on what sort of motoring you enjoy.
My car for example has very minor changes, all of them Porsche, nearly all of them from the same model year (I like that kind of crap, so I'm a pseudo-purist, I guess), and some bits are from later model years (wheels, headlights). So far, nothing is aftermarket but the stereo, and I may go that way yet again with the air conditioning.
The nice thing is that the 928 was made right, so bone stock cars are fine performers and are very pleasurable to own. You can get your OEM grins in a 928, but I wouldn't expect other 928ers to get too worked up about how you keep your car, one way or the other.
Dan
Pasadena, CA
'83S
If I understand your question, you seem to be looking for a group of car owners that accepts newcomers for their purist tendencies.
The purist debate doesn't have much meaning when the car is not collectible and such is the case with the 928 - we're not there...yet. 20 years from now we may be worrying about factory steering wheel stitch patterns and that might be fun (emphasis on *might*). But perhaps a collectible Porsche 356 would better suit you as you'd find plenty of enthusiasts obsessed with factory originality who'd be pleased to see you sidle up to their swap meet table with a wad of cash.
I've found in the 928 community there are all kinds covering the gamut from rabid concours fettishists to hybrid Cheby engine swappers. It all depends on what sort of motoring you enjoy.
My car for example has very minor changes, all of them Porsche, nearly all of them from the same model year (I like that kind of crap, so I'm a pseudo-purist, I guess), and some bits are from later model years (wheels, headlights). So far, nothing is aftermarket but the stereo, and I may go that way yet again with the air conditioning.
The nice thing is that the 928 was made right, so bone stock cars are fine performers and are very pleasurable to own. You can get your OEM grins in a 928, but I wouldn't expect other 928ers to get too worked up about how you keep your car, one way or the other.
Dan
Pasadena, CA
'83S
03-25-2002 | 05:37 PM
#7
Racer
Joined: Jan 2002
Posts: 252
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From: Salida, California
I'll be general in my opinion. I have visited MANY sites relating to cars and motorcycles. My answer to you is that if you buy a porsche whether it is a 914 or 928 you will find much support on the rennlist. If you have a porsche you have a family here. I'm sure there are good boards for miata's but....it's just not the same. I personally have owned like 20cars and I always end up with a porsche again. There is one for every budget and style. I am on my sixth porsche a shark of course, and the personality of the car just ooozes out every time I look at it or drive it. I love all porsches, and I'm not a snob (even 911's). Please join the family you can email me anytime. I'm just full of opinions on which car to buy. By the way the 944 turbo (951) is the fastest best handling/braking car alive for the money! Period! The smack stops here.....so sell the miata (fun car) and get a porsche...feeling! 
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03-26-2002 | 01:50 PM
#8
Intermediate
Joined: Mar 2002
Posts: 46
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From: Southern New Hampshire/Mass brdr
Hi - I am a new owner having just purchased my 1987 928-S4 in November. The 928-S4 delivers the most incredible driving experience. I would strongly recommend you go with a 928.
<img src="graemlins/wave.gif" border="0" alt="[byebye]" />
<img src="graemlins/wave.gif" border="0" alt="[byebye]" />
03-27-2002 | 03:25 AM
#9
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From: United States - Iowa
Oh...I've got to jump on this one!
The 911 is not an original Porsche.
First, the VW back in the 30's was the real start of the next model.
The 356, which was based off the original VW. Production ran for years in the A, B, and C models of the Type 356.
Then the 911, which was based off the 356.
So the purists are wrong! Anyway, what are the purists saying about the new Porsche lineup? They are all watercooled?
[Bet I'll get flamed for this...but what the heck! It's all in good fun. Anyway, I have owned three watercooled Porsches so far.] <img src="graemlins/icon501.gif" border="0" alt="[icon501]" />
The 911 is not an original Porsche.
First, the VW back in the 30's was the real start of the next model.
The 356, which was based off the original VW. Production ran for years in the A, B, and C models of the Type 356.
Then the 911, which was based off the 356.
So the purists are wrong! Anyway, what are the purists saying about the new Porsche lineup? They are all watercooled?
[Bet I'll get flamed for this...but what the heck! It's all in good fun. Anyway, I have owned three watercooled Porsches so far.] <img src="graemlins/icon501.gif" border="0" alt="[icon501]" />
03-27-2002 | 12:37 PM
#10
Three Wheelin'
Joined: Jun 2001
Posts: 1,298
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From: Los Angeles/Honolulu
Ecrosier, I think you'll find Porsche owners to be accepting of your car regardless of whether it's modified or OEM. If it's a complete beater that you obviously neglect then there'll probably be a few evil stares coming your way.
Two instances I noticed snobbery though were up at Devek Days and once down in San Diego. Up north it was a kid with a 6.5L stroked engine and he'd been to racing schools galore. He would stand around the car like an F1 driver while his girlfriend answered any and all questions about the car which was definately an interesting ride.
The 2nd were among a few drivers that are really into the concourse competitions who upon your arrival would point out every blemish on your car. (Um, I drove it here, I couldn't dodge all the bugs on the 405)In the latter case I had brought two new and excited 928 owners along and since then they've declined to hang out with that group.
There's one 928S4 I saw at an Arizona PCA meet that was so original the owner has the car phone and antenna from 1988 still on the car. I think it's a thrill to see that.
K <img src="graemlins/beerchug.gif" border="0" alt="[cheers]" />
Two instances I noticed snobbery though were up at Devek Days and once down in San Diego. Up north it was a kid with a 6.5L stroked engine and he'd been to racing schools galore. He would stand around the car like an F1 driver while his girlfriend answered any and all questions about the car which was definately an interesting ride.
The 2nd were among a few drivers that are really into the concourse competitions who upon your arrival would point out every blemish on your car. (Um, I drove it here, I couldn't dodge all the bugs on the 405)In the latter case I had brought two new and excited 928 owners along and since then they've declined to hang out with that group.
There's one 928S4 I saw at an Arizona PCA meet that was so original the owner has the car phone and antenna from 1988 still on the car. I think it's a thrill to see that.
K <img src="graemlins/beerchug.gif" border="0" alt="[cheers]" />
03-27-2002 | 01:22 PM
#11
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From: United States - Iowa
Purists,
You get what Porsche type you want and do what you want with it. It's that simple.
I have owned a 914, 924, 944 and now the 928. Loved em all! My website shows the trophies I won at car shows last year competing against all the Hot Rods and musclecars. Read my comments on car shows...it will shed some sight on how many people think. I have heard some real winners...
The snobbery is really something! I have been at car shows and had the other Porsche owners make comments on how the 928 isn't a REAL Porsche, they don't like it's looks (some hate the looks, others like it) and others. I have made quite the impression at many a show! I sit near the car and am happy to answer questions until my voice is hoarse. At a couple of shows, the owners either left the car all day or knew nothing more than the year and model of their Porsche. I answered questions on both my car and theirs. I had one gentleman walk off in a huff because I knew more about his car and was fielding questions on the differences of his and mine to spectators...basically I made him look like an idiot (I didn't make him look like an idiot, he did it to himself).But on the other hand, the number of people that have never seen or even knew that Porsche built water-cooled engines in the past really throws them a loop.
But the purist'sand air-cooled is the only way, they can stuff their opinions and take their cars to concours events. If they can afford to do so fine. Leave the rest of us alone to drive and enjoy the experience. If an owner wants to modify their Porsche, then "personalize" it their way. I am "personalizing" mine slightly, but 95% of it will be original factory. That's my right and I will use it!
I personally favor the water-cooled, front engine design for the balance of power and cornering ability. I'm not saying the base 911 chassis is a slug...by no means not! But, I just have a preference to the looks and handling of the 924,944,968,928 line. I have had many a 911 owner snub thier nose at my 928...so what? They don't seem to understand the concept of comradery of Porsche owners and drivers.
Welcome to the Porsche experience!
You get what Porsche type you want and do what you want with it. It's that simple.
I have owned a 914, 924, 944 and now the 928. Loved em all! My website shows the trophies I won at car shows last year competing against all the Hot Rods and musclecars. Read my comments on car shows...it will shed some sight on how many people think. I have heard some real winners...
The snobbery is really something! I have been at car shows and had the other Porsche owners make comments on how the 928 isn't a REAL Porsche, they don't like it's looks (some hate the looks, others like it) and others. I have made quite the impression at many a show! I sit near the car and am happy to answer questions until my voice is hoarse. At a couple of shows, the owners either left the car all day or knew nothing more than the year and model of their Porsche. I answered questions on both my car and theirs. I had one gentleman walk off in a huff because I knew more about his car and was fielding questions on the differences of his and mine to spectators...basically I made him look like an idiot (I didn't make him look like an idiot, he did it to himself).But on the other hand, the number of people that have never seen or even knew that Porsche built water-cooled engines in the past really throws them a loop.
But the purist'sand air-cooled is the only way, they can stuff their opinions and take their cars to concours events. If they can afford to do so fine. Leave the rest of us alone to drive and enjoy the experience. If an owner wants to modify their Porsche, then "personalize" it their way. I am "personalizing" mine slightly, but 95% of it will be original factory. That's my right and I will use it!
I personally favor the water-cooled, front engine design for the balance of power and cornering ability. I'm not saying the base 911 chassis is a slug...by no means not! But, I just have a preference to the looks and handling of the 924,944,968,928 line. I have had many a 911 owner snub thier nose at my 928...so what? They don't seem to understand the concept of comradery of Porsche owners and drivers.
Welcome to the Porsche experience!