Bill Ball

John:

Nice shots and explanation. I'll be doing my first 928 clutch soon, and this thread is timely.

jon928se

Stunning stuff Mr Kelly - If only I had a twin plate clutch I'ld know how to do it already. Thank you on behalf of those with twin plate clutchs.

NJSF

Apologies if my well intentioned replies led you astray.

Mike Frye

John,

Your photos and descriptions are awesome, the next few steps are well laid out for me. I NEVER would have gotten all of that from the WSM descriptions and I hadn't found a thread or write-up that had it step-by-step.

If you don't mind I'd like to do a write-up and use some of your pics to make it available for anyone else tackling this job. As you said, after a while, the photos get pulled and the threads aren't as helpful. All this depends of course on me getting this job done sometime this year!

Thanks one more time everyone that has contributed to this thread, with any luck, this thread will be put to bed because technically it was about removing the clutch and the thing is hanging on by one pin, so there shouldn't be anything but patience required on my part.

Bill,

This thread should contain every possible miscue and wrong assumption that you or anyone else could possibly make. I should be a tester for 'idiot proof'.


For anyone looking for the Reader's Digest version...
What I've learned is:



The WSM says to tap out, but do not remove, the three pins. ('stepped' pin forward, other two back)
Most people don't bother with the pins and don't have problems with them later (I did and I did)
The bolts for the coupling have to come completely out (like the u-joint on the steering rack) and then the coupling may have to be 'persuaded' all the way back.
Once the bolts are all out of the PP, the starter ring gear may still be stuck to the flywheel by the pins if you've left them in. Some mild persuasion may be required by tapping it and rotating it as you work.
This technique may cause the timing pins to interfere with the bell housing, so be aware of their location and don't let them get far enough back at the point where they rotate back down. Have them at the bottom for final removal.
The WSM description may have been perfect in German on a brand new clutch and flywheel, but the translations don't have much resemblance to the real world.

Oh, and also, this list and the contributors are GREAT! I definitely would have hurt myself or my car if it hadn't been for all the help and moral support. This should have been a two hour job, but with my tentative nature and my stubborn car, it's been several days of 2 hours at a time. Thanks again.

Vilhuer

It helps to have shims installed on dismantling twin disk clutch also, not just installing it. They make package slightly smaller. Same thing with flat pieces on single disk setup.

There are many different ways to remove and install pilot bearing. One thing I would not do is install new by hitting it in.

https://rennlist.com/forums/928-forum/140212-pilot-bearing-removal.html

Mike Frye

Erkka,

Thanks for the tip and the link. Until JKelly's pics, I didn't know what the WSM was talking about with the 4mm 'locally made' wire clips (shims) or where to put them. I can see that if I had put them in there before backing out the bolts it would have made the whole thing more compact. If I get hung up because of that, I'll have to put the bolts back in (rotate), tighten them down (rotate), put in the shims (rotate), then back the bolts out again.

Thanks for anticipating my next few 'issues', and I apologize for not finding these links on my own. I did a lot of searches, but most of them resulted in the clutch pack just 'falling out', so when mine didn't, I couldn't seem to find a thread with a similar problem.

Vilhuer

As many have found out, clutch tends to fall down on ones head. WSM forgets to mention mechanic must place his/her head under it.

Bill Ball

Yeah, I'm trying to come up with some other way to handle the falling clutch pack than with parts of my body, even if my head is not that essential.

Mike, I'm sure I'll come up with a few more inventive ways to botch this job. I ALWAYS do, because I NEVER do it the conventional way.

worf928

Bill, I always leave the release arm on the ball cup until I'm ready to catch the assembly.

SteveG

John: It seems there is a need for a clutch manual too. I would be a buyer at $15.00.

Rob Edwards

I'll second that- I've read this and many other clutch threads, stared endlessly at the WSM and PET diagrams, and still don't understand how the darn thing works, let alone how to R&R it. Though there's no slippage, I'm getting chirpy noises 'down there', so it's just a matter of time before it's my turn to ask dumb questions.....

RichS 1986928

Count me in on a Clutch manual! I'm sure I'll need to do it again.
It would of saved me a LOT of $$$!

Way to stick with this Mike!

My problem was that I was convinced that the brand new $2000 clutch
job my car came with couldn't be the problem... But it was.. Bad Pilot!

Mike Frye

Thanks Rob and Rich,

I'm still wrestling with it. One of my problems is that I get on the train at 6:00am and get off in the evening at 6:30pm, so after dinner and family time I get maybe an hour of exhausted wrenching before I get bleary eyed.

Tonight I got the other pin to free up, the ring gear backed off the timing gear almost 1/4 of an inch all the way around, but now it's hitting the inside of the bell housing and won't clear with the pins in place. Missed it by that much .

I'm on the fence about whether to pull the tranny and torque tube back or just cut the damn pins with a dremel and replace them later. I can get to them all now, I just can't get enough room to drop everything.

If you look at the bottom of the pic, you'll see the 'stepped' pin that finally let go of the ring gear after I beat it in about 1/8 inch. However, all of the pins are still protruding enough that they won't allow the ring gear to clear the timing gear and drop.

Stan.Shaw@Excell.Net

*Note Added: Maybe nevermind it seems you say you are trying to get them out together, but the problem (to me) is that you have a gap between the pressure plate and starter ring.

Umm, your photo confuses me a bit. I always remove my clutch with the starter ring, but it seem that you are attempting to get the pressure plate out without the starter ring. I did check the WSM and my recollection is correct, that it all comes out together.

Mike Frye

Stan,

I'm sure you're right, but the pressure plate is free and isn't hanging up on anything. I could push it back in flush on the pins or leave it loose and that part doesn't cause the problem. I just pulled it away in the photo to show that all of the pieces are loose. With the bolts out of the PP, there's nothing holding the PP onto the starter ring, so it's just hanging loose.

If you look closely you'll see the gap where the ring gear is apart from the timing ring, but still on the pins.

Those damn pins are causing all of my problems!

JKelly

Can you rotate the clutch pack and figure out which pins are causing the problem? Is there a pin or two that is staying in the flywheel while another pin or two is staying in the intermediate plate? I don't know if it would help to tap any of them back toward the flywheel, but they can come about 1/32 of an inch out of the back of the flywheel before they start hanging up in the bellhousing when you rotate the whole thing.

That's got to be frustrating. You're hanging in there good though .