View Poll Results: Let me know which July days you can consider helping.
Sunday, July 16th
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Saturday, July 29
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Multiple Choice Poll. Voters: 7. You may not vote on this poll
TB/WP Party 1 hr West of DC (and beer)
07-12-2006, 10:22 AM
#16
Hey Chris - thanks for changing the date - looks like it works for everyone 
I'm definitely in - I will grab a trailer and tow my S4 in if thats OK - very nervous to drive it right now. I have the TB/WP kit on order from 928 specialists, and I have plenty of tools that I will be bringing. Look forward to it!
Bill
I'm definitely in - I will grab a trailer and tow my S4 in if thats OK - very nervous to drive it right now. I have the TB/WP kit on order from 928 specialists, and I have plenty of tools that I will be bringing. Look forward to it!Bill
07-12-2006, 10:52 AM
#17
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Chris, I've marked this down in my calendar. Should be no problem for me to drive up there and lend a hand. It will be cool to get two done in one day! I'll bring my tools and save you a trip down to C'ville, unless you want to make the drive in the 911 anyway.
07-13-2006, 10:20 AM
#18
Burning Brakes
Thread Starter
Sorry about my delayed response, but I'm back in town now.
Aug 5th sounds great for most of us and I'll PM everyone with my street address. Some are asking what time we will get started. I will be here all day, so anytime after 8 AM is fine with me. We have 18 pages of instructions to follow and I will take lots of photos along the way.
I'm really looking forward to this.
Aug 5th sounds great for most of us and I'll PM everyone with my street address. Some are asking what time we will get started. I will be here all day, so anytime after 8 AM is fine with me. We have 18 pages of instructions to follow and I will take lots of photos along the way.
I'm really looking forward to this.
07-13-2006, 02:34 PM
#19
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You can do alot of the "pre-work" before the crowd gets there.
-- Raise the car on all four corners, giving yourself room to attach the flywheel lock. Get the car to a height that's comfortable to work on hanging over the front apron. Having the rear up too means that there's enough room underneath and not too high for us 5'10" guys over the front.
-- Remove any undertrays and slide them towards the rear of the car on the floor.
-- Drain the coolant, including the stuff in the block. Remember those two block drains back by the motor mounts. Do any flushing of the coolant system now, and get the accumulated crud out of the block. Once everything is drained, put the block plugs back in with never-seeze and new sealing washers, and torque them to spec (15 lb/ft). Doing this now will make it less likely that you will forget to do it later. Forget the block drains and you'll spill a lot oc coolant out when you pull the WP. Trust me...
-- Remove the upper and lower radiator hoses.
-- Put the radiator drain plug back in after the car has been sitting for a day weeping.
-- Clean all the spilled fluids off the floor, so your guests can slide in and out of there in comfort while they attach the flywheel lock.
-- Disconnect the battery ground strap somewhere in the sequence too.
-- Do any cleaning you can in the front where you'll be working.
-- Set up a work table so you can stage your tools next to the car.
-- Set up another "laydown" area for parts that come off the car. Big parts like the fan console will lay down under the rear of the car. Another reason to raise all four corners! Smaller parts are bagged for later cleaning and reinstallation.
-- Keith W has a "bagging assistant" work with him, labeling ziplocks of parts/bolts as they come off the car. That means a box or two of ziplocks may need to be sacrificed from the pantry.Permanent marker is a help, but a good ballpoint may stand up to cleaning solutions better.
-- There's no such thing as too much light available under the hood while you are working. We use a couple halogen floods over the engine bay, and have droplights too.
-- Buy a couple boxes of latex or nitrile gloves to wear.
Other thoughts:
-- I use dilute Simple Green in a cut-up gallon plastic bottle for nuts-and-bolts cleaner. Drop the parts in from those bags, swirl them around and then soak them for a while, rinse with water and back in the bag. It's not glamorous duty, but it is important. The really stubborn stuff might need paint thinner, but the Simple Green goes down the drain. Paint thinner is HazWaste.
-- Cleaning stuff that stays on the car is a duty for Brake Cleaner. Put a few layers of cardboard under the work area when you use this stuff, and make sure you don't inhale, mr president. Ventilation and no sparks of course. Half a dozen cans in reserve if you can. There's never a shortage of things to clean!
-- Have a box of various assorted wire ties handy. They hold hoses and wiring harnesses out of the way, and help secure the wiring and stuff back in place when you are done.
-- Plan to replace all your coolant hoses if they haven't been done in the last five years. It will be another five years before you do this again, right? Max ten year old hoses then if you replace them every other TB.
-- Plan to replace all your accessory drive belts. Be sure to mark the old ones as they come off.
-- Caps and rotors will be darn near loose in your hands. Time to replace?
-- Get coolant, distilled water, and a bottle of Water Wetter in advance.
Above all, have fun, be safe, take plenty of pictures, etc!
-- Raise the car on all four corners, giving yourself room to attach the flywheel lock. Get the car to a height that's comfortable to work on hanging over the front apron. Having the rear up too means that there's enough room underneath and not too high for us 5'10" guys over the front.
-- Remove any undertrays and slide them towards the rear of the car on the floor.
-- Drain the coolant, including the stuff in the block. Remember those two block drains back by the motor mounts. Do any flushing of the coolant system now, and get the accumulated crud out of the block. Once everything is drained, put the block plugs back in with never-seeze and new sealing washers, and torque them to spec (15 lb/ft). Doing this now will make it less likely that you will forget to do it later. Forget the block drains and you'll spill a lot oc coolant out when you pull the WP. Trust me...
-- Remove the upper and lower radiator hoses.
-- Put the radiator drain plug back in after the car has been sitting for a day weeping.
-- Clean all the spilled fluids off the floor, so your guests can slide in and out of there in comfort while they attach the flywheel lock.
-- Disconnect the battery ground strap somewhere in the sequence too.
-- Do any cleaning you can in the front where you'll be working.
-- Set up a work table so you can stage your tools next to the car.
-- Set up another "laydown" area for parts that come off the car. Big parts like the fan console will lay down under the rear of the car. Another reason to raise all four corners! Smaller parts are bagged for later cleaning and reinstallation.
-- Keith W has a "bagging assistant" work with him, labeling ziplocks of parts/bolts as they come off the car. That means a box or two of ziplocks may need to be sacrificed from the pantry.Permanent marker is a help, but a good ballpoint may stand up to cleaning solutions better.
-- There's no such thing as too much light available under the hood while you are working. We use a couple halogen floods over the engine bay, and have droplights too.
-- Buy a couple boxes of latex or nitrile gloves to wear.
Other thoughts:
-- I use dilute Simple Green in a cut-up gallon plastic bottle for nuts-and-bolts cleaner. Drop the parts in from those bags, swirl them around and then soak them for a while, rinse with water and back in the bag. It's not glamorous duty, but it is important. The really stubborn stuff might need paint thinner, but the Simple Green goes down the drain. Paint thinner is HazWaste.
-- Cleaning stuff that stays on the car is a duty for Brake Cleaner. Put a few layers of cardboard under the work area when you use this stuff, and make sure you don't inhale, mr president. Ventilation and no sparks of course. Half a dozen cans in reserve if you can. There's never a shortage of things to clean!
-- Have a box of various assorted wire ties handy. They hold hoses and wiring harnesses out of the way, and help secure the wiring and stuff back in place when you are done.
-- Plan to replace all your coolant hoses if they haven't been done in the last five years. It will be another five years before you do this again, right? Max ten year old hoses then if you replace them every other TB.
-- Plan to replace all your accessory drive belts. Be sure to mark the old ones as they come off.
-- Caps and rotors will be darn near loose in your hands. Time to replace?
-- Get coolant, distilled water, and a bottle of Water Wetter in advance.
Above all, have fun, be safe, take plenty of pictures, etc!
07-13-2006, 03:37 PM
#20
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Dr. Bob, excellent summary. I would add the following:
1. A printout of John Pirtle's writeup as well as Wally's
2. Sharpie pen to write on the ziploc bags
3. Red nail polish to mark the cam gears, if necessary
4. Advance Auto (no affiliation) has small parts cleaners on sale for something like $30. Has a pump for solvent or Simple Green. I bought one and 5 gallons of solvent. Works like a charm. The solvent is a bit hard on the latex gloves though.
1. A printout of John Pirtle's writeup as well as Wally's
2. Sharpie pen to write on the ziploc bags
3. Red nail polish to mark the cam gears, if necessary
4. Advance Auto (no affiliation) has small parts cleaners on sale for something like $30. Has a pump for solvent or Simple Green. I bought one and 5 gallons of solvent. Works like a charm. The solvent is a bit hard on the latex gloves though.
07-13-2006, 03:57 PM
#21
Burning Brakes
Thread Starter
Hey, that's all the stuff I thought you guys were gonna do for me (just kidding!).
Thanks for a good list of prep items. All I had to date was:
a box of parts
Pirtle's print out (18 pages)
my tool drawers full of generic wrenches
floor jack
2 jack stands
1 creeper
an assortment of light and dark beer
I plan to purchase 2 more jack stands and some ramps. I don't have a Porsche jack, so the tires will have to stay on the ground until I get better lift-point info. It's not like my 911 at all in that respect, and my brother recommends buying the floor jack pads like he has for his 996. Should I get those?
I also saw the lift bars posted on another thread, but those sound hard to find and I need to learn how to get by with a floor jack first so I can advise repair shops if I ever need to take it to someone.
Thanks for a good list of prep items. All I had to date was:
a box of parts
Pirtle's print out (18 pages)
my tool drawers full of generic wrenches
floor jack
2 jack stands
1 creeper
an assortment of light and dark beer
I plan to purchase 2 more jack stands and some ramps. I don't have a Porsche jack, so the tires will have to stay on the ground until I get better lift-point info. It's not like my 911 at all in that respect, and my brother recommends buying the floor jack pads like he has for his 996. Should I get those?
I also saw the lift bars posted on another thread, but those sound hard to find and I need to learn how to get by with a floor jack first so I can advise repair shops if I ever need to take it to someone.
07-13-2006, 05:30 PM
#22
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And some more.....
1. Craftsman 1/4" ratchet, driver set, metric to 15mm
2. Magnet pickup tool (I can bring mine, I have two of them, one with a mirror)
3. An assortment of metric allen wrenches
In fact, now is a good time to head to Sears and load up on all the nifty tools you've always wanted, plus a big red rollaway, etc.
1. Craftsman 1/4" ratchet, driver set, metric to 15mm
2. Magnet pickup tool (I can bring mine, I have two of them, one with a mirror)
3. An assortment of metric allen wrenches
In fact, now is a good time to head to Sears and load up on all the nifty tools you've always wanted, plus a big red rollaway, etc.
07-13-2006, 08:57 PM
#23
I'll bring my lift bars to show them off - plus my jack stands, and all of my metric wrenches and socket sets. I don't have a breaker bar, Bill did you say yoU are bringing yours?
- plus my jack stands, and all of my metric wrenches and socket sets. I don't have a breaker bar, Bill did you say yoU are bringing yours?
07-13-2006, 11:09 PM
#24
Chronic Tool Dropper
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Originally Posted by LaughaC
Hey, that's all the stuff I thought you guys were gonna do for me (just kidding!).
Thanks for a good list of prep items. All I had to date was:
a box of parts
Pirtle's print out (18 pages)
my tool drawers full of generic wrenches
floor jack
2 jack stands
1 creeper
an assortment of light and dark beer
I plan to purchase 2 more jack stands and some ramps. I don't have a Porsche jack, so the tires will have to stay on the ground until I get better lift-point info. It's not like my 911 at all in that respect, and my brother recommends buying the floor jack pads like he has for his 996. Should I get those?
I also saw the lift bars posted on another thread, but those sound hard to find and I need to learn how to get by with a floor jack first so I can advise repair shops if I ever need to take it to someone.
Thanks for a good list of prep items. All I had to date was:
a box of parts
Pirtle's print out (18 pages)
my tool drawers full of generic wrenches
floor jack
2 jack stands
1 creeper
an assortment of light and dark beer
I plan to purchase 2 more jack stands and some ramps. I don't have a Porsche jack, so the tires will have to stay on the ground until I get better lift-point info. It's not like my 911 at all in that respect, and my brother recommends buying the floor jack pads like he has for his 996. Should I get those?
I also saw the lift bars posted on another thread, but those sound hard to find and I need to learn how to get by with a floor jack first so I can advise repair shops if I ever need to take it to someone.
I have ramps but they gather dust near the 928. Make sure you get the extended ramps if you really want to use them on the 928. Otherwise, the front spoiler drags and pushes on the ramp before the tire pins it. Plus, the ramps would tear up my pretty epoxy-painted garage floor a bit.
The lift bars will make your job a lot quicker; Two quick jack lifts, and the stands fit under the bars.
Without them: Jack from the rear lift point on either side, using a block of wood between the floor jack and the metal lift point. You'll pick up the side of the car, so you'll slide a safety stand under the front lift point on that same side, with another little 2x4 block to protect the lift point there. Lower the jack, and move it to the opposite rear lift point. Set a stand at the same height as the one that's under the front already, and put it under the other front lift point after you raise the low side from that rear pad. Let the jack down, and the front is on stands and the rear is low. Now, from the rear, slide the floor jack under the butt so you can lift the rear by that big aluminum cross-brace that sits under the differential. Raise the car, and put a safety stand under each of the rear lift points, again with a little 2x4 block on there to protect the sheet-metal lift saddle. Your car is now perched on 4 stands, one under each factory lift point. Three lifts with the floor jack and you are done!
07-13-2006, 11:26 PM
#25
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Oh yeah--
Make Absolutely sure that your parts box has new water pump bolts, and all the little retainers and circlips for the bearings in the rollers. I asked Jim Bailey to put together a "care package" for my project, and all those little bits in the bags made the project a LOT easier. New radiator drain plug, seals for the block bolts, a bunch of coolant hoses, a coolant pressure switch and a new radiator cap, belts, caps, rotors, plugs, bearings and rollers, a WP and the TB, plenty more. It was like getting a lot of puzzle pieces for my birthday! And I pretty much used all those parts too. Turns out that Jim's maiden aunt is the famous Claire Vuoyant. Whooda thunk?
Oh yeah-- Thread sealant, gasket sealer, gear oil for the tensioner and some tubing and a pump oiler for same. Burgers and brats for the grill, with plenty of onions. Beer for the 'tweener moments, water and pop for the rest.
Torque wrenches, three of them... Big ***** for the crank bolt, and a 3/8 for the 10mm and 8mm bolts, plus a 1/4" inch-pound wrench for the 6mm bolts and nuts. Use the wrenches religiously, 'cause you'll rot in broken-water-pump-bolt hell next time if you neglect the wrenches this time. We damned previous owners and their mechanics to a fiery fate after breaking 7 WP bolts off. Don't be one of those people!
Have fun, wish I was there, etc.
Make Absolutely sure that your parts box has new water pump bolts, and all the little retainers and circlips for the bearings in the rollers. I asked Jim Bailey to put together a "care package" for my project, and all those little bits in the bags made the project a LOT easier. New radiator drain plug, seals for the block bolts, a bunch of coolant hoses, a coolant pressure switch and a new radiator cap, belts, caps, rotors, plugs, bearings and rollers, a WP and the TB, plenty more. It was like getting a lot of puzzle pieces for my birthday! And I pretty much used all those parts too. Turns out that Jim's maiden aunt is the famous Claire Vuoyant. Whooda thunk?
Oh yeah-- Thread sealant, gasket sealer, gear oil for the tensioner and some tubing and a pump oiler for same. Burgers and brats for the grill, with plenty of onions. Beer for the 'tweener moments, water and pop for the rest.
Torque wrenches, three of them... Big ***** for the crank bolt, and a 3/8 for the 10mm and 8mm bolts, plus a 1/4" inch-pound wrench for the 6mm bolts and nuts. Use the wrenches religiously, 'cause you'll rot in broken-water-pump-bolt hell next time if you neglect the wrenches this time. We damned previous owners and their mechanics to a fiery fate after breaking 7 WP bolts off. Don't be one of those people!
Have fun, wish I was there, etc.
07-13-2006, 11:32 PM
#26
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Bill, I have the breaker bar, 3/4" ratchet and the crank nut socket. Plus the flywheel lock.
For hoisting the front end, I use heavy duty ABS ramps from Advance Auto, and some 2x12 boards to get the front spoiler to clear the ramps before the tires grab. Then unload the front suspension a few inches with the floor jack and a small block of wood on the steel bracket covering the front mount for the lower control arm. This will give enough clearance underneath to remove the under trays and the accessory belts.
Good idea to also remove the cooling fan housing, two 10mm screws, remove the harness from below and pull it out. An old cardboard box folded flat in front of the radiator will protect it from damage while the work is going on.
Oh yeah, lots of rags.
Should be "fun"
For hoisting the front end, I use heavy duty ABS ramps from Advance Auto, and some 2x12 boards to get the front spoiler to clear the ramps before the tires grab. Then unload the front suspension a few inches with the floor jack and a small block of wood on the steel bracket covering the front mount for the lower control arm. This will give enough clearance underneath to remove the under trays and the accessory belts.
Good idea to also remove the cooling fan housing, two 10mm screws, remove the harness from below and pull it out. An old cardboard box folded flat in front of the radiator will protect it from damage while the work is going on.
Oh yeah, lots of rags.
Should be "fun"
07-14-2006, 12:58 AM
#27
Burning Brakes
Thread Starter
I'm dumbfounded by the level of enthusiasm from this group! You rock!
My shopping list is growing, and I will look for the parts cleaner and ramps suggested. The lift bars sound awesome and I'll probably want to place an order after seeing them in use.
Thanks, also, for the procedures to follow when using a standard floor jack. I will cut some 2x4 blocks to carry around in case I ever break down.
OT: This may sound like a dumb question, but is there any reason I should avoid buying a stock Porsche jack for this car? A PO must have lost it and I need to replace it or find a better substitute.
My shopping list is growing, and I will look for the parts cleaner and ramps suggested. The lift bars sound awesome and I'll probably want to place an order after seeing them in use.
Thanks, also, for the procedures to follow when using a standard floor jack. I will cut some 2x4 blocks to carry around in case I ever break down.
OT: This may sound like a dumb question, but is there any reason I should avoid buying a stock Porsche jack for this car? A PO must have lost it and I need to replace it or find a better substitute.
07-14-2006, 07:29 AM
#28
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IMO, forget the porsche jack. There are plenty of "affordable" jacks that are fiiiiiine. And we all know none of us would consider anything "affordable" for our sharks! Only the best will do!
Say Chris. It looks like there will be 3 TB/WP jobs done? Is that right? Heck, should I bring my portable garage too!!!
Maybe we should use that as the "spectator" area!!
p.s. ( I can bring it if you really want me too)
Say Chris. It looks like there will be 3 TB/WP jobs done? Is that right? Heck, should I bring my portable garage too!!!
Maybe we should use that as the "spectator" area!! p.s. ( I can bring it if you really want me too)
07-14-2006, 10:24 AM
#29
Burning Brakes
Thread Starter
Thanks for the tip about buying a generic jack. An small, aluminum floor jack may be a good option to consider. I'll wait until after learning more about the lift points at the TB/WP party. By the way, I bought the entire TB kit, except the tools, from 928Specialists, including cam gears (just in case). Their "kit" approach was very convenient to order. However, it only came with one accessory belt and no hoses. I will start looking for those now.
Sure, Beerfish, bring your portable garage if that is easy to carry. I have a 2 car garage and will clear both bays the best I can, but the addition of a "portable" garage could help if it rains and we need to continue work on a 3rd vehicle. "Spectators" will be welcome anywhere they find space, including my house and back yard. Anybody who doesn't turn a wrench can handle a camera and help us keep tools organized, etc.
My wife is being very cool about this, possibly because she likes my Shark better than my 911 and she wants me to consider selling one or the other at some point. I've told her I would rather sell my Infiniti and keep both the P-cars. I have been the Accelerated Reader (for schools) sales rep for VA & DC, but my job just expanded so I will do most of my travel via plane and rental cars now.
This reminds me that I may not have replied to an email or PM from someone "new" to Sharks who asked if they could attend. The answer is, yes, of course, and I apologize if I did not reply. I tried answering that message from my PDA phone and apologize if it did not send successfully. As we get closer to the 5th I will PM all interested parties with my exact street address, so please stay tuned and let me know if you need that info.
Sure, Beerfish, bring your portable garage if that is easy to carry. I have a 2 car garage and will clear both bays the best I can, but the addition of a "portable" garage could help if it rains and we need to continue work on a 3rd vehicle. "Spectators" will be welcome anywhere they find space, including my house and back yard. Anybody who doesn't turn a wrench can handle a camera and help us keep tools organized, etc.
My wife is being very cool about this, possibly because she likes my Shark better than my 911 and she wants me to consider selling one or the other at some point. I've told her I would rather sell my Infiniti and keep both the P-cars. I have been the Accelerated Reader (for schools) sales rep for VA & DC, but my job just expanded so I will do most of my travel via plane and rental cars now.
This reminds me that I may not have replied to an email or PM from someone "new" to Sharks who asked if they could attend. The answer is, yes, of course, and I apologize if I did not reply. I tried answering that message from my PDA phone and apologize if it did not send successfully. As we get closer to the 5th I will PM all interested parties with my exact street address, so please stay tuned and let me know if you need that info.
07-14-2006, 01:41 PM
#30
Chronic Tool Dropper
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Originally Posted by LaughaC
OT: This may sound like a dumb question, but is there any reason I should avoid buying a stock Porsche jack for this car? A PO must have lost it and I need to replace it or find a better substitute.