Alan

Guys,
Future project (long long term idea...) Who is running Daytime Running Lights today in a 928 (or maybe in another car...)

What do you like / not like...

Porsche GTS system has front fogs on whenever ignition is on and fuel pump is running...

Any thoughts on a system that would automatically turn the fog light on ONLY under the following conditions:

Marker Lights aren't on AND outside ambient brightness drops below a threshold limit OR the windscreen wipers are on)

Lights would have a delay for switching off (of at least 1 minute).

I have no plans to build this anytime real soon... just starting to think about how a good systems should work. The stock GTS system functionality seems unacceptable to me.

Qn - Should the fogs be on at reduced brightness?

Qn - Are there other conditions for the fogs to be on?

Qn - Should there be a low ambient brightness indicator to warn the driver anyway...

Qn - Should front/side /rear marker lights automatically go on also...?

Like with the stock system the fogs would go off whenever the high beams come on (e.g. in flash-to-pass mode something would actually happen).

Alan

Schocki

http://www.xlight.at/

This Austrian company has an interesting device available. It turns the lights on only if the engine is running (Voltage controlled) and dims the lights by 60% to turn fog or low beams into true daylight driving lights

ROG100

Alan,
I would be interested.
Our bug and family van have them.
IIRC is there not a warning bulb already on the instrument facia - I may be having a brain fart here.
The unit Schocki gave a link to may already do what we want.
I will get my German student to translate further.
Roger

chaadster

I am also interested, but would be happy if just the parking lights were ignition switched; I run those with the fogs switched on during the day, so it would be convenient not to have to manually turn 'em on and off.

I'm not sure I understand the purpose of reducing brightness on the fogs...

AO

I just turn my fogs on when I get in the car. When i get out of the car, I turn them off. Pretty simple, actually. PM me if want details on how this setup works.

SharkSkin

I don't really care for daytime running lights myself. Makes you stand out too much, makes it easier to gauge your speed.... I guess that's not a concern after all because we all drive the speed limit, right?

justin

I would like just my front fogs on, as long as the fog light switch is activated, no other lights, just front fogs,but I can hit the fog switch and shut them off if I wanted too.

Alan

Guys,
Thanks for inputs so far... Since I live in the land of the blindingly bright sun (360 days every year) I couldn't justify having the fog lights on all the time...

Some of my thoughts:

Chaad - I also don't quite see the reason for reducing the intensity - although its often quoted - for Fogs there should be no glare anyway and while admittedly the reason for DRL is visibility of you and not for illumination - it seems that if fogs aren't annoying at night they certainly wouldn't be during the day either.... what am I missing here..?

Sterling - I thought the DRL relay option was only on the GTS - but I see it started in '90 (same config) this relay is a standard SPST type with a diode in series with the coil -ve (so $120 is a bit steep I'd rather make my own for $5! open the can - squeeze the diode in ...) It should have worked - maybe you got the wrong relay (need: 431.951.253.G - hard to find).

I thought that having auto marker lights might be a good addition - since one complaint about DRL's is they lull people into a false sense of security causing them to turn their main lighting on later at dusk - thus leading to increased risks of rear end collisions... This would also be the reason for a dashboard indication of low light or at least of DRL activation. Roger - I'm unaware of any factory std. dash indication for this - although most cars have spare unused warning slots that could perhaps be repurposed. Or the Green - marker light warning could perhaps serve dual purpose...

I would as stated above like to have this be conditional on ambient lighting - comes on at early dusk levels (so would turn on automatically in a long traffic tunnel too). Keeps it off during the blinding light of day (adjustable...)

Since some states (technically) mandate lighting be on while windshield wipers are active - that's relatively easy to do also.

Dave & Andrew - I already have a system for your desired operation - available immediately - only $29.99 and can be remotely installed by phone just send the $!.

Justin - I actually like the idea that this could be switched with the fog switch... so: DRL active only when the fog switch is on and light switch is in the off position - thats quite a good idea.

Alan

SteveG

The Sienna van has the headlights on at a reduced level. I believe it comes on after engine start and stays on til key is off. I'm always fear (irrational) that somehow the lights will remain on and drain the batt. It's also a control issue as described below. For this discussion: fogs are center of bumper, position or parking are next to fogs, markers are amber on sides, in quarter panel.

...

I would rather be in control, totally, no fogs no marker unless I turn it on. If I had to choose an option during daylight, I would rather have position (the clear square next to the fogs) only on.

10 seconds maybe, but a minute would drive me nuts.

I might vote for a system that turns on the position and/or markers (side) when wipers are on. A system that undermines signage, i.e., fogs are for "fog" or safet/inclement situations and not for running or lesser situations.

justin

Quote > Justin - I actually like the idea that this could be switched with the fog switch... so: DRL active only when the fog switch is on and light switch is in the off position - thats quite a good idea.


Alan : thats exactlly what I was thinkung. That way if you decide not to have the DRL's on, you can shut'em off. I went out to the car and just turned the fog lights on in direct sunlight and it was perfect, I just ignored the marker lights, it looked factory.

FlyingDog

Cars that have headlight only daytime running lights are one of my biggest pet peaves with new cars. The drivers forget to turn the rest of their lights on in the rain, fog, 'mandatory headlight' areas, in tunnels, and at night. I also do not like cars that you cannot turn off the lights.

I like the system that pre-GM SAABs had. The headlight switch was hooked to the ignition through a relay. If you had the lights off, they'd stay off. If you had the headlights on and the ignition on, they would be on. When you turned the ignition off, the headlights went off. If you had the headlight switch in the parking light position, it didn't matter what position the ignition switch was in. I just left my headlights on all the time. I keep meaning to do this on my Jeep, but never get around to it. The only problem with this on a 928 is the popups... if only we had a 4-position headlight switch.

When GM took over, the switch became On-Parking-On. That was incredibly annoying when trying to start a car with a weak battery.

Alan

Steve - the 1 minute delay is not after you shut the car off (thats immediate) - if you have an ambient light detector you want the light to go on right away (say you drove into a tunnel) but you wouldn't want the lights to go off right away - what if it were just about dark enough for the lights to come on - but everytime you went under a street light they went back off again (etc..) - that would drive me nuts and probably shorten their life. So the idea is just to put some hysteresis into the system.

The usage of the fogs as running lights is a factory option (e.g. Canada).

Alan

928ntslow

My GTS has the relay to run daytime. I like it (period). A great percentage of cars these days ARE running daytime lights. It certainly gets others attention which IS what they are intended for. Worried about the attention from the wrong foiks?...get a V1. I would prefer that someone see me coming down the road than NOT!!!! Having DRL(Daytime Running Lights) is certainly a safety thing in so much as it protects MY car from someone who is not paying attention, either on the road or the side of the road. Bright lights look un natural against a daytime backdrop...purpose served. When you drive down the road, you attention is drawn to others with these lights...purpose served.

As for an interior dash light, not interested. I don't want to fade any lenses by having them back lit all day. I also do not want to see any funny lights in my peripheral vision except for the digital warning lights. My engine is running and have no lights to tell me IT is on! So I don't need any lights to tell me I have other lights that are on.

I think the GTS has all it needs rather than having more gadgets, lights, delays, or systems.

Not harshing Alan as I know your thoughts are for the better and you undoubtedly come up with some very intellegent things. I think this may be just a little over the top.

JMHO

Alan

Matt,
I agree on the downside of front only auto lights is the false sense of security at dusk - so I do think it should also include the markers (for tunnels, rain etc).

However - I don't want my headlights popping up ... until I decide!

Steve:
My convention* is markers = front & side/front amber lights and side/rear & rear red lights.
Fogs = front fog lights (on with the fog switch)
Driving Lights = front high beam lights (on with fog switch & high beam)
(* applies to USA config cars)

I would never use the driving lights for running - these are high beams: no cutoff - horrible for others in dusk/rain & maybe too bright in daylight, horrible for you in fog. Besides - with headlight pods down there is nothing to flash for "flash to pass" - they are already on!

Alan

Bill51sdr

I'm with Dave on this one. Why draw more attention to yourself? I really do not see any safety advantage to these, so what's the point?