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Crankshaft seized after Trans Repair

Old 08-17-2005, 01:13 PM
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Default Crankshaft seized after Trans Repair

I know there's probably heaps of discussions on this but I am new to this although I've owned my 928S4 1989Auto for 15 years and I'm a qualified mech engineer I have not been a fanatic nor very well informed. My car was running like magic - like first day - until after tran repair by official Porsche dealership whom i've used the whole time except for a short spell. (Now they're saying that someone else made the error in that time!) It was not driveable out of the workshop. It was sluggish, first gear was not the same, torque was "slipping". Sometimes it klonks into first with a knock. But only when cold and only rarely.
After three months of in and out of w/shop it seized in the w/shop. Now they want Australian 25,000 and claimed no causal relationship between tran work and crankshaft seizure. They're holding my car and charging "carpark" of 25.00 a day!! Thrust Bearing almost disappeared. Is the block still good? They claimed its repaired.

First they said the drive shaft does not move. Then they said it does but the coupling bolt and groove must align and ensures the same positioning on refit of tran. then they admitted there was tolerance in groove and bolts but the error that they "found" (on opening up the engine) was some 10mm.

I need you guys to help me out here with good evidence, relevant tech notes (ideally official), authoritative statememts and views and literature.

I am, focussed on two issues :

1. That preload was not possible for they would have seen it on tran refit.
And by not seeing it they wouldn't have been able to align the groove
and bolts hence cause push the drive shaft in one way or another.
Conclusion: no excessive preload or prior error. Or negligence if there
2. That checking the dist X corerelation between flywheel and drive plate
after replacement of trans or trans parts IS REQUIRED especially for 85 and
later models. ( 1984 WSManual exempts this ). So are there notes or
advice pertaining to the latter designs requiring checking and adjusting??
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Old 08-17-2005, 01:23 PM
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Old 08-17-2005, 01:48 PM
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Clearly, it seems your shop screwed the pooch on this one. I hope you can resolve it and save your old friend.
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Old 08-17-2005, 01:57 PM
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Hi there.

It may well have had nothing to do with their work. I would check the shim stack that they have installed and make sure it is the right thickness, however.

Good luck!
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Old 08-17-2005, 02:22 PM
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Old 08-17-2005, 02:23 PM
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They f*&^%# up and are in DEEEEEEP denial................

Sue the Barstards...............
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Old 08-17-2005, 05:41 PM
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They clearly botched the job with an incorrect torque tube re-install, this is a known problem with the later 928 a/t's.

Don't let them off the hook, they F'ed up.
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Old 08-17-2005, 05:54 PM
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Oh damn!

The 25K AU figure is nonsense. Assume the block is ruined, and you can still get a replacement engine for a LOT less than that.
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Old 08-17-2005, 06:51 PM
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I have sent you a PM. Greg 0425 26 26 51.
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Old 08-18-2005, 12:56 AM
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That sucks.....I also concur with sniper...they messed up big time and ruined your engine...they should pay for a new one! It might be time for a lawyer...hopefully there is a 928 expert (hopefully a long time porsche mechanic) around that could testify?
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Old 08-18-2005, 01:05 AM
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I think Porsche themselves says the primary cause of TBF is improper trans reinstallation (somebody help us locate that). The rear groove/notch for the TT clamp bolt is set and not adjustable, but the front clamp and drive (flex) plate must be adjusted per the workshop manual, as you read, whenever the trans is out of the car. They said something about a 10MM error - that's huge. Unless I'm misunderstnading, the mention of the groove alignment at the rear exposes that they have no clue.

The 928 drivetrain is unique among Porsches. It is extremely common for Porsche dealerships to have no one who has ever been trained to work on them. You seem to have found one of those dealerships. No surprise to me. Also, the tranny is Mercedes - better to have a Mercedes dealer work on that, at least in terms of a rebuild, but have only an experienced 928 shop reinstall the tranny.

If the engine seized and the TB was gone, then chances that they have really "fixed" it are slim. They might have relieved the forward pressure on the bearing by moving the drive plate back, but unless the TBF was caught early, the block is usually machined into trash and will seize again when warmed up.
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Old 08-18-2005, 01:22 AM
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I mispoke.

I read 1985 car. The later wouldn't have the clips.

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Old 08-18-2005, 04:06 AM
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Sounds like they goofed, introducing the preload when they reassembled it. Hopefully you have well documented all symptoms, discussions, etc. since the trans work.
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Old 08-18-2005, 04:57 AM
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Check with Landshark, if you haven't already, about this dealership and their reputation. May help you find supporting evidence for your claim.
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Old 08-18-2005, 06:10 AM
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Thanks guys I'm feeling SH_T so it helps if you say they su_k and sympathise with me. But the case winner will be lots of homework and getting substantial stuff - stuff that can stand in court. Even if twenty reputable workshops out there are willing to put down on official paper as to the commonality of this problem with certain models and that they themselves have witnessed botched tran jobs it would certainly help. This is a 1989 S4 so no shims at drive shaft. I believe the prob started from certain design change, right? In 1984 WSM states"adjustment is not neccessary after replacement of transmission.." But what notes are there after the des change? Shims were done away. bolts were torqued ten per cent more? Are there any notes after design change? Any official memos with regards tran work and checking of distance X. We assume it should be checked but can anyone say for certain this is the official recommendation?

TWO FURTHER ISSUES I need to focus on :

a. They claimed some error from some previous work on the engine end preloaded flex plate 10
mm. I know the engine was not worked on. what's more? it was driving /idling etc like magic; like
first day. No one's allowed to drive my car! If there was a preload and a big one at that how
would the car be driving and for how long?!! What happens to the preload (if any) when the
Coupling is unclamped. Would they have seen it? Were they negligent on refitting?
b. Since the bearing has worn to almost nothing wouldn't the block be damaged beyoud repair?
Any restimonials out there? Any good evidence

By the way, the workshop is official not independent specialist. I am disappointed in the way I'm treated. I expected a lot of integrity and that's why I bought it from this dealership at 20,000 km in 1991 and probably spent another 100,000 with them on service last 14 years.! Now, I am treated like someone who doesn't pay bills! But I am a victim. Even if they return my car, its not the same.

Last edited by victim; 10-16-2005 at 08:37 AM.
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