Notices
928 Forum 1978-1995
Sponsored by:
Sponsored by: 928 Specialists

Cam Gear Wear

Thread Tools
 
Search this Thread
 
Old Apr 28, 2020 | 11:08 AM
  #16  
worf928's Avatar
worf928
Addict
Rennlist Member
20 Year Member
 
Joined: Oct 2003
Posts: 17,335
Likes: 2,189
From: Gone. On the Open Road
Default

Originally Posted by Petza914
Pretty sure there's a note about that in the WSM or one of the writeups I was using when I did my motor last year, or maybe it was just offered up in my thread by the gurus here.
Yes—^ in WSM.

Also in many many treads. It’s just that there are so many threads....
Reply
Old Apr 28, 2020 | 12:42 PM
  #17  
Mrmerlin's Avatar
Mrmerlin
Team Owner
20 Year Member
 
Joined: May 2004
Posts: 31,333
Likes: 4,289
From: Philly PA
Default

As Dave and Pete said , the NOTE about Spacer removal when fitting the steel oil pump gear is in the WSM.
Reply
Old Apr 28, 2020 | 10:25 PM
  #18  
linderpat's Avatar
linderpat
Thread Starter
Rennlist Member
15 Year Member
 
Joined: Nov 2006
Posts: 14,911
Likes: 2,838
From: Pittsburgh, PA
Default

OK guys - how do you get that woodruff key out? Picture:

Reply
Old Apr 28, 2020 | 10:31 PM
  #19  
Petza914's Avatar
Petza914
RL Community Team
Rennlist Member
15 Year Member
 
Joined: Oct 2007
Posts: 28,695
Likes: 8,457
From: Clemson, SC
Default

Originally Posted by linderpat
OK guys - how do you get that woodruff key out? Picture:
It's just slipped in there, but probably now stuck. Pull it out with vice grips or channel locks and get a new one from Roger. Heating up the end of the shaft where it's installed and then icing the key to contract it might also work. Clamping on vice grips and then tapping the vice grips gently with a hammer might also work.
Reply
Old Apr 28, 2020 | 11:07 PM
  #20  
worf928's Avatar
worf928
Addict
Rennlist Member
20 Year Member
 
Joined: Oct 2003
Posts: 17,335
Likes: 2,189
From: Gone. On the Open Road
Default

Heat the shaft and key. Then take a small punch and with gentle tapping with a hammer, tap the back of key into the shaft. The key and slot are ‘half-round’ so the front part of the key will ‘rotate’ away from the shaft. Once you have enough of the front of the key proud of the shaft, you can tap it the rest of the way.

If you make a divot in the key, you’re tapping too hard. In that case you’ll need to resort to heat and ice. And tapping.
Reply
Old Apr 28, 2020 | 11:24 PM
  #21  
linderpat's Avatar
linderpat
Thread Starter
Rennlist Member
15 Year Member
 
Joined: Nov 2006
Posts: 14,911
Likes: 2,838
From: Pittsburgh, PA
Default

Thanks guys. I also found the reference to leaving off that 1mm washer when replacing the oil pump gear with the new steel one. Boy was that an obscure reference. I would never have found it if I wasn't looking hard for it - buried in a table with a parts blow up diagram.
Reply
Old Apr 29, 2020 | 08:33 AM
  #22  
Mrmerlin's Avatar
Mrmerlin
Team Owner
20 Year Member
 
Joined: May 2004
Posts: 31,333
Likes: 4,289
From: Philly PA
Default

After you get the key way out you should surface it with some 400 grit paper to remove any hi spots it’s a slip fit it should not rock in the keyslot
Reply
Old Apr 29, 2020 | 07:58 PM
  #23  
NickTucker's Avatar
NickTucker
Racer
5 Year Member
 
Joined: Aug 2017
Posts: 444
Likes: 40
From: Annandale, New Jersey
Default

The key is half moon shaped. I tapped the "high" side down, then tapped it the other way until it loosened up. I might have even used some penetrating oil (I forget).

With a little patience it will come out.
Reply
Rennlist Stories

The Best Porsche Posts for Porsche Enthusiasts

story-0

Stunning Porsche 356A Super GT Speedster Auction Fails to Meet Reserve

 Verdad Gallardo
story-1

Every Era of 911 Owner Explained in One Sentence

 Verdad Gallardo
story-2

Thinking of Buying a Porsche? Do These 10 Things First

 Joe Kucinski
story-3

Pixar Pals Turned Into 1-of-1 Porsches!

 Michael S. Palmer
story-4

Theon Goes Full Carbon Fiber With Stunning New Build

 Verdad Gallardo
story-5

Genius Porsche-Themed Gifts That'll Make Any Dad or Grad Smile

 Joe Kucinski
story-6

10 Used Porsches Are Selling for Way Too Cheap

 Joe Kucinski
story-7

Tuner Is Converting Porsche 911s Into Shooting Brakes

 Verdad Gallardo
story-8

This Coachbuilt Creation Is A Modern Take on the Legendary Porsche 917

 Verdad Gallardo
story-9

Is This Convertible Cayenne A Steal, Or A Returnless Investment?

 Verdad Gallardo
Old Apr 30, 2020 | 11:33 PM
  #24  
Tails's Avatar
Tails
Burning Brakes
 
Joined: May 2001
Posts: 1,124
Likes: 11
Default

Back to the camshaft drive gears. As previously stated the gears are "good to go" for many more miles. The driving faces are within the groves and they all look in good condition. I did a lot of research on cam gears years ago and the hardness of the coating in these drive gears is around 6H. The only damage is on the flats at the top of the gear teeth and the belt driving faces are within the groves are good. To cut down the wear/damage on the flat tops of the gears and the driving groves faces I have put filter material in the spigot that fits into the inlet pipes. You will note that the two inlet pipes for the engine have the spigot holes which are situated before the Venturi section of the said inlet pipes, therefore they have increased pressure in this area and any dirt etc will be forced into the camshaft drive sprocket/gear area, hence the filter material inserts..
Reply
Old May 1, 2020 | 09:48 AM
  #25  
Adk46's Avatar
Adk46
Rennlist Member
10 Year Member
 
Joined: Aug 2014
Posts: 2,485
Likes: 387
From: Adirondack Mountains, New York
Default

I have a theory that clean rubber against the coating will not cause much wear. But grit in the air or adhering to the rubber might. If "Desert Rat" FredR thinks the coating is good for him, it will be even better for Pittsburgh. Just a theory.
Reply
Old May 1, 2020 | 10:18 AM
  #26  
worf928's Avatar
worf928
Addict
Rennlist Member
20 Year Member
 
Joined: Oct 2003
Posts: 17,335
Likes: 2,189
From: Gone. On the Open Road
Default

Coating wear is accelerated by too-tight or too-loose belt.

Theory of dirt entering belt enclosure is interesting, but not I think the primary cause of wear.

I have seen new gears worn sharp in less than a few thousand miles. I’ve seen several with dead gears at <20k miles and Nth belt where N > 1.

I’ve seen several >40k mile on their original factory-installed multi-decade N=1 belt with near-perfect gears.

Newest gears from Porsche are very different in terms of surface. Wear properties unknown.
Reply
Old May 1, 2020 | 12:21 PM
  #27  
FredR's Avatar
FredR
Rennlist Member
20 Year Member
 
Joined: Jun 2005
Posts: 10,591
Likes: 1,032
From: Oman
Default

Originally Posted by Adk46
I have a theory that clean rubber against the coating will not cause much wear. But grit in the air or adhering to the rubber might. If "Desert Rat" FredR thinks the coating is good for him, it will be even better for Pittsburgh. Just a theory.
Curt,

I replaced my cam gears a year or so ago after they had covered approx 90k miles. The fact that they wear out on the flats concerns me in that they do not take the drive load- that should be distributed across the tooth although maxloading happens on the right edge of the tooth or so I would think.

If the system is working as it logically should, one would think the part of the belt that rides over the flat should not be in contact or at best lightly so. That we see the coating on the flat go first and the trough of the tooth is virtually untouched that is the bit that has concerned me for some time. I fully expected accelerated wear over here but from what I have been able to glean 90k miles is about the going rate for a correctly adjusted belt.
Reply
Old May 1, 2020 | 12:31 PM
  #28  
Adamant1971's Avatar
Adamant1971
Rennlist Member
10 Year Member
 
Joined: Aug 2011
Posts: 7,301
Likes: 2,233
Default

Originally Posted by FredR
The fact that they wear out on the flats concerns me in that they do not take the drive load
The fact they wear on the flats tells us that they do take a considerable load and or friction from belt movement. The evidence is there on every single gear I have seen.

IMO when that wear appears it is time to re-coat the gears or save up for new gears on the next belt change.
Reply
Old May 1, 2020 | 01:09 PM
  #29  
FredR's Avatar
FredR
Rennlist Member
20 Year Member
 
Joined: Jun 2005
Posts: 10,591
Likes: 1,032
From: Oman
Default

Originally Posted by Tails

You will note that the two inlet pipes for the engine have the spigot holes which are situated before the Venturi section of the said inlet pipes, therefore they have increased pressure in this area and any dirt etc will be forced into the camshaft drive sprocket/gear area, hence the filter material inserts..
Are you sure of your fluid dynamics?
When I got my 90S4 20 years ago I was fascinated as to why they stuck a venturi where they did. Porsche must have figured it was a complete waste of time given they dropped it for the GTS with no other compensatory modifications. I did wonder if the venturi was a trick to get over the various clutter on the passenger side but to be fair I felt I never really understood the process logic and that takes some doing!.

Be that as it may, your logic appears somewhat flawed to my way of thinking but maybe my grey matter is getting mushed as the years pass by. For air flowing through a conduit it starts off at atmospheric pressure, there may be a small ram effect to increase pressure a tad at speed and then air enters into the trumpets. It flows a foot or so over the cam vents and then enters the venturi. The air flow through the system is constant and what goes through the entry section then passes through the throat of the venturi at higher velocity. To achieve the higher velocity requires a requisite pressure drop [Bernoulli theory]. As the air then passes through the trumpet section, the cross sectional area increases and the velocity drops so there is some recovery of the pressure lost across the throat but not all of it. The notion that the pressure increases as the air flows over the spigot does not seem to fit with what I was taught in fluid mechanics and process engineering design but kindly feel free to help me understand how you arrived at the pressure increase above the spigot theory. Beyond that I would suggest the very reason that spigot exists and protrudes into the airsteam at 90 degrees to the axis of flow is to act as an eductor. The intake stream hammering over the spigot should suck air out of the cam chamber and thus induce air to enter elsewhere and cooling things off some given the power transmission of the drive is not 100% efficient and things are thus going to heat up. If my thinking is correct inserting some media to filter the air is simply going to block the normally educted air flow. I would be delighted if you can convince me otherwise- always keen to learn.
Reply
Old May 1, 2020 | 01:22 PM
  #30  
SteveG's Avatar
SteveG
Rennlist Member
 
Joined: Jul 2001
Posts: 6,562
Likes: 114
From: New York
Default

Originally Posted by FredR
Ed,

As suggested already those sprockets without doubt will last another belt and a few years
Not the way he drives.
You have never followed Ed on the Interstate.
Reply



All times are GMT -3. The time now is 12:49 AM.

story-0
Stunning Porsche 356A Super GT Speedster Auction Fails to Meet Reserve

Slideshow: One of the rarest Porsche 356 Speedsters ever built has resurfaced, offering a glimpse into a little-known chapter of the model's competition history.

By Verdad Gallardo | 2026-06-15 17:16:00


VIEW MORE
story-1
Every Era of 911 Owner Explained in One Sentence

Slideshow: Every generation of Porsche 911 attracts a different type of enthusiast, and each one comes with its own very specific personality.

By Verdad Gallardo | 2026-06-12 12:49:28


VIEW MORE
story-2
Thinking of Buying a Porsche? Do These 10 Things First

Slideshow: Before you start shopping for your dream Porsche, make sure you've checked these 10 items off your list.

By Joe Kucinski | 2026-06-10 15:28:29


VIEW MORE
story-3
Pixar Pals Turned Into 1-of-1 Porsches!

Slideshow: three Porsche 911s inspired by three iconic Pixar characters!

By Michael S. Palmer | 2026-06-09 17:22:06


VIEW MORE
story-4
Theon Goes Full Carbon Fiber With Stunning New Build

Slideshow: Built around a carbon-bodied 964 and a naturally aspirated 4.0-liter flat-six, this bespoke commission highlights how far the restomod formula has evolved.

By Verdad Gallardo | 2026-06-06 14:41:46


VIEW MORE
story-5
Genius Porsche-Themed Gifts That'll Make Any Dad or Grad Smile

Slideshow: Looking for gift ideas for you Dad or your newest grad? Look no further than these Porsche-themed ideas.

By Joe Kucinski | 2026-06-12 10:37:13


VIEW MORE
story-6
10 Used Porsches Are Selling for Way Too Cheap

Slideshow: These 10 used Porsches offer more driving thrills than their price would suggest.

By Joe Kucinski | 2026-06-03 09:11:13


VIEW MORE
story-7
Tuner Is Converting Porsche 911s Into Shooting Brakes

Slideshow: A Polish Porsche specialist is moving ahead with one of the most unusual 911 conversions in recent memory: a shooting brake version of the 991-generation sports car.

By Verdad Gallardo | 2026-06-01 19:46:47


VIEW MORE
story-8
This Coachbuilt Creation Is A Modern Take on the Legendary Porsche 917

Slideshow: A Porsche Carrera GT has been transformed into a one-off coachbuilt machine that blends analog supercar engineering with styling inspired by the legendary 917 race cars.

By Verdad Gallardo | 2026-06-01 17:06:04


VIEW MORE
story-9
Is This Convertible Cayenne A Steal, Or A Returnless Investment?

Slideshow: A heavily modified Porsche Cayenne convertible with faux wood trim and a long list of flaws recently sold at auction for surprisingly little money.

By Verdad Gallardo | 2026-05-29 18:52:37


VIEW MORE