Matt H

EZ - that is my point EXACTLY. Why the time and trouble when swapping a 944 motor wouldnt cost near that, hell you could probably get a NEW 944 motor and not come close to 1/2 what he is going to spend for it to be right.

Peckster, note I pointed out that they will NEVER do one again that cheap. Mark my words.
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Canuck

Matt -

Thanks for your comments. Also, thanks to the fellow who mentioned the half-shafts. I have already been negotiating for a turbo transaxle, and will hope to nail that down in the next few days. Have lots of new parts in my 944 engine, and will be trading that, my current transaxle and torque tube, and some $ for the turbo stuff. Now will add half-shafts to the list.

As to the why, if I don't plan to really get on it a bunch? Well, look back at my objectives. Good running engine, parts and wrench-turner findable anywhere. Extra power a bonus.

Used engine is to have something that will run while I sort out just where I want to go with other mods...in engine, suspension, etc. Definitely will be adding bigger brakes soon.

Budget? What's a budget? Seriously, will spend what it takes 'til I get what I feel good with. Right now I am projecting about $12 grand by Christmas. Next year, who knows?

Actually Matt, in the LT-1's I am familiar with, there is a difference between the serpentine set-ups on the Camaros and the 'Vettes, and the 'Vettes are therefore more difficult to fit into the engine compartment. and, of course, that doesn't take into acount the internal differences, because right now we don't need to worry about that. The most humble stocker will provide plenty of push compared to that stock early-'85 4-banger.

Best wishes,

Canuck

Lonely Raven

I'm very intersted in this project, keep us updated Canuck!

I do hope that shop doesn't screw you on the swap though.

Canuck

Thanks, Raven.

I suspect the shop will do a good job for the price quoted. They & I know each other, and they are doing it as an "adventure"...because they like building cars, and because they have wanted to try one and see what it takes to so modify a 944. They may not be as quick as a shop with lots of hands and a very active bean counter, as they do turn out replica AC Cobras for living money. But, they are nice people to work with. Anyway, if I get had, other than Christmas and Birthday, well, sometimes that's all the sex guys approaching 70 get anyway...

Just to further convince everyone I am insane, at the same time I am also doing an engine transplant in my '79 Canadian Toy 4x4. There all I am replacing is the engine, transmission, steering assembly, and a few other minor parts. I bought that truck new in '79 and it still has just under 100,000 miles on it. Unfortunately, it came with the 20-R engine and no power steering or cruise control...they weren't available then. Why am I doing a swap?...tired of going up steep grades at 45 mph behind log trucks, etc. Plus, I'm doing it because I can <G>. Will be asking them to bury the Toy with me...it has been that dependable a rig...into Mexico, above the Arctic circle...everywhere.

Will report back when we have more stuff in hand and more actual progress.

Canuck

Matt H

Canuck -
I think that half-shafts are a good idea, glad to see you are open to the suggestions of others. I also like the idea of selling to buy (I do that all the time!)

I think the point most of us are trying to make is that you can have a NEW (how many problems can that have?) 944 engine for WAAAAY less money. It is a simple design that anyone should be able to work on. It is also going to be hard to find someone to work on a hybrid like that. I would have never touched it at my shop I can guarantee you that much. I am sure I would not be the only one like that either. Might want to give that some thought, may not put you off any but at least think about it.

The problem with used is that you need to know EXACTLY what you have. It will make ordering parts when they break (and they will) much easier. So your plan is another engine some time in the future?

Budget is how you manage to keep cars like this. Without one you will spend 100X the value of the car. Like anything you really need to sit down and figure what you want to do. When I did the 951 recently I was actually a little under budget (though I will go slightly over with gaskets etc, that I didnt factor in). As cool as it might be to have it, there has to be SOME thought given to spending the money. For instance, put a 944 motor back in it, take the extra 12K and buy a car to travel the country in. It is your money but in some senses it doesnt seem like this was thought through very far.

I believe the difference in the serp set-up is the alternator location. There are some internal differences but you are right it doesnt matter.
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Matt H

Canuck, here is a great link that talks about the different LT-1s including the difference between F-body LT1 and Corvette (it is a Fiero site for doing conversions!)

http://www.fierolt1.com/faq.htm
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EZRider

Point well taken Matt and it something to take a note of since you're experienced with engine swaps. I won't lose any sleep watching other people burning up their money needlessly. Don't get me wrong I love V8s just like these conversion junkies. But a 944 Porsche is an art in engineering which still endures without peers to this day. Sadly, people are missing this point. What people see instead is a lust for dinosaurus torque from a pushrod engine instead of the more advanced OHV. There's no pleasure like the knowledge that a little 4cylinder engine that can kick some serious ***. I am not into street racing so it don't matter how fast these high torque chevies can rip from one stop light to next.

Matt H

Canuck, here is a great link that talks about the different LT-1s including the difference between F-body LT1 and Corvette (it is a Fiero site for doing conversions!)

http://www.fierolt1.com/faq.htm
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Canuck

Sometimes a guy just has to do what he has to do. I moved to Canada with $500 and no entry permit. Talked my way in. By minding P's & Q's, I ended up a Deputy Minister or equivalent in two Canadian governments. Took up rifle shooting and made National Team in two years. Went into private industry, and ended up writing the master Manpower Plan for the Canadian Highway Gas Pipe Line Project, and negotiating with 4 international unions and over 700 other bodies, including indian tribes. Came back home, took up another shooting discipline and in 6 years won two national championships. Sometimes you just have to try things out. Makes life sometimes glorious, sometimes miserable. BUT, is all worth the trip, even if it doesn't all work perfectly.

Canuck

Matt H

I am not such a purist that I dont like a good conversion, however, I dont see the pleasure of doing so for absolutely no reason. The reasons Canuck gave are not good reasons (in my mind). If his reasons were I want to have 500+ HP NA and I want to be able to buy alternators at Autozone, then he would be spot on. For a car that he wants to drive everyday and just wants it to be reliable then, FWIW, this is a huge mistake. It is not my money however, and you are right, I cannot tell him how to spend it. The 240 wagon we wanted to be fast and cheap, a used 350 and that was pretty much handled, the RXs we wanted to be blindingly fast 40K later it sure was (1993 RX -> 1996 LT-4 spec supercharged, NOS, 6 speed conversion, etc, etc, etc) I am not in any way trying to discourage him, I just want to know WHY and to do some enlightening about real world costs of these conversions. In the end he will have a semi (maybe, since the motor is used) reliable, reasonably quick, 944. If the car were perfect you would get about 4-6K. With the things he is planning none of us would touch it, anyone else looking is probably going to shy away. He did say he was 70, so he wont have to live with the mistake long :>) <- That was a joke just in case anyone thought otherwise.
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Ken D

Sounds like you've had an interesting & rewarding life. Personally I don't care what your reasons are for doing the swap. As long as you maintain the right frame of mind ("Budget? We don't need no stinking budget!"), you'll have a lot of fun, especially if it turns out to be what you hoped. If it doesn't turn out right, chalk it up to lessons learned.

Then go buy a 930 and let it all hang out. You'll forget about Birthdays and Christmases real fast

jaibeiber

i kind of understand the reason for the conversion. however, a couple of things (in my opinion) if you say its not about the power dont say the HP gains is a benefit. i think that shows you want the power. second the 944 is a semi-rare bread. we lose some daily from accidents. once the new engine is in, that will be one less. however i dont know how much i can wine about that because i too am doing a swap. but at least it is still a 944 engine.

good luck with your adventure. please take lots of pics.

RSflared72e

You can use a stock 944 master cylinder with a small block Chevy installation. You simply need to mount it with the base of the booster recessed INSIDE the firewall. This buys you an inch or two of space which was plenty in one conversion I personally have seen. You will then need to shorten the actuating rod to maintain normal pedal travel.

The naysayers always chime in quickly when this topic comes up, which is frequently around here. Probably because so few actually go through with a project of this magnitude. I think a 944 is a fine candidate for this type of thing, being plentiful, cheap, relatively underpowered, but with great handling, and the SBC engine will fit pretty easily into them.

And, unfortunately and illogically, given their capabilities, 944s don't seem destined in the foreseeable future to become true classics (appreciating much in value, rare, etc). So you're not using up a chassis that is going to be worth much more or less regardless of what you do with it, so the bastardization concept is nothing more or less than a personal choice. Just make sure you use a 951 tranny.
Regards Al

smokey

Canuck, go for it. Sounds like a right-hemisphere car. Keep us posted, and never ever add up your bills. The Racer's Group makes some trick half-shafts. The regular Porsche shafts would only last about 14 hours on track, and theirs can do a 24 hour race. Not cheap.

adie

Don't do it, it wont work, the engines to heavy, the breaks too weak, the body to soft, the chassis to flimzy, the cars not a race car it's a drivers car, the car is a race car not a drag car, it wont be a porsche............err can't think of anything more but I'm sure they will be along soon. I'd be real interested in the cost of the conversion, just got the price list from regegade (used to do my own conversions but I'm far to far away from home at the moment) I am trying to find out what car had the right engine (I'm printing off Matt's wealth of knowledge as I type, who'd have known that Id get Chevy info on the Porsche site) and then I'm going to wait patiently for the engine's timing belt to go (knowing my luck it won't happen, if it's still running strong come summer I'll be selling the engine cheap. Keep the info comming as well as any additional parts you needed along route, I guess I'd better start collecting parts now. Best of luck with the project.