StoogeMoe

Wow! Lots of work to make that happen.

What I would really like is an OBD II interface integrated into the DME. It sure would make diagnosing problems a lot easier and would help with track data collection.

NineFourFourNeophyte

hello rogue_ant,

first off, great accomplishment!!!
i hope implementing the new dme really helps add more efficiency and performance to our 944s.
i am interested in posts and packages about the s. in visiting the website, i see links for na, s2 and turbo, would s and s2 be similar?
i'm also guessing with s cars being a minority compared to na and turbo the prices may be more since there would be less of a demand, nonetheless, please let us know about s pricing and package availability.
thanks.

Van

I can probably answer a few of your questions.

The 944S is a 16-valve 2.5 liter engine; the 944S2 is 16-valve 3.0 liter engine.

While *some* performance and/or efficiency can be made through the "tune" - or the software that running on the DME; the DME itself isn't a major player in changing your engine's performance.

I'd have to bet Joshua is incorporating ways to conveniently access and update the tune, but don't expect magic to happen from your 25-year old engine/engine design/engine management system just because you plug in a newly designed DME.

There are a lot of other parameters that dictate how much power you can get - things like compression ratio, cam lift/duration/timing, air flow through the intake/exhaust, head/combustion chamber design, spark plug location, fuel injection, rotational mass, etc.

SpeedyC2

Wow - I've messed with "chip tuning" cars since my '89 Nissan 240SX, through Audi's to Porsches, but NEVER have I seen or heard of an independant person putting together a brand-new DME! Heck, has there ever been such a thing as an aftermarket DME?

It sure is nice to know if the DME in my S2 ever fails I have a place to go for a brand new - and modern - unit! Incredible.

Rogue_Ant

Sorry - I missed your question... but it looks like Van had most of it covered

I currently have offerings for the 944 8-valve, and 951. This new DME replacement, will only plug-in the 8-valve 944 variants (944NA & 951). The 16-valve 944s had a completely different DME, that is not compatible with the 8-valve cars.
The 16-valve DME is setup as the top priority being emissions; the second priority is economy, with power/performance being the last major priority.

That said, I have been working on the 944S 16-valve lately. I have been able to rewrite code to shift the priorities around, namely putting power/performance as the top priority with all other priorities following. I do expect to see some good gains, especially since I'm combining it with my MAF - which replaces the restrictive AFM.
As soon as I have some more info/data, I will post it in a separate 944S thread.


Thanks! And I agree, I have not found anyone ever developing a backwards-compatible ECU for any car...
The S2 DME is a different ECU from the 944 8-valve cars. As such, my new DME replacement ECU will not work for the S/S2/968 cars... Good news is that the S/S2/968 ECU is more robust than the 944/951 unit. So, you S/S2/968 people should be good for a while yet.

techartisan

In no way attempting to diminish your accomplishment....but you just said "any car"....
http://braunstadt.com/lugtronic/node/13
I can only think of 2 or 3 other "backwards compatible" systems, Ive seen over the years....so its definitely an impressive feat youve accomplished. I am wondering, does your ecu have mode specific settings for your MAF system vs the stock AFM? or would there be no advantage to that beyond the chips programming?

oh and for the sake of clarity, the harness adapter shown in the pics is not used on Audi 5 cylinder AAN / 3B setups....those plug directly in....which was my intention to highlight...despite the sites images not doing that for me.

Rogue_Ant

Perhaps I need to clarify my previous statement...
Yes, there are plug-in ECU setups for different vehicles. That is something that has been going on now for a little while.
What is different, is that none of them are backwards compatible with factory software. All of the plug-in ECUs I've seen are essentially universal computers with a vehicle-specific plug. They do not, and cannot use the factory software.

On my new ECU, there is the added external plug, which facilitates WBO2, and MAP sensor connection - both of which are utilized by my software (depending on the setup). But otherwise, the new ECU will work with any current chip (factory or aftermarket) for the 944/951.

techartisan

Ahh Gotya, I wasnt aware of that. Anyway, next 944 I pick up has your name all over it.

BoostBuggy

Joshua:

any updates on pricing and availability for the 951 DME?

Rogue_Ant

Not just yet - I spent the day on the dyno, working on the 944S (16valve) MAF kit...

NineFourFourNeophyte

hello,

thanks for the feedback Van and Joshua.

van - i wasn't expecting a whole lot for performance and power and in looking at the graph in the other post, ~9 is fine and it comes with a bit of efficiency. good.
yeah being a purist is tough to really increase power on these, if i wanted more power, then i'd have to change the engine. then a lot of what you mentioned in the last few lines would need less consideration.

joshua - i was referring to the website and tuning options with the tuning tools, i see 951, na and s2 but no s for tunerpro and asked about the s2 because of the 16v nature they had in common. though they had a displacement difference, i thought having the 16v in common was enough to substitute or download s2 for and s. however the fact that you've had the ability to work on 16v setup for the 2.5 engines, then we'll await final pricing based on group buy?

thanks again.

Luis Cano

Thank you! There is much love for these old cars and projects like this keep it alive for all of us.

Finally getting back to my projects this winter and look forward to picking up one of these for my '83. In addition, looking forward to the 16V MAF and any future products for my '90 S2 cab.

T&T Racing

Josh,

I am a little confused. Rogue website lists a 944 NA upgrade. Is the same upgrade as referred to in this post???? Our is this a new option that will become available? If so, when will it become available. Is there a dyno chart available for the stock dme vs Roque upgrade dme for a 944 NA?

Thanks,
Tom

Arominus

T&T, there would be no change on the dyno as this just replaces your DME with a new one, you keep running the same chip you already had in your old DME. Stock or whatever. If you also get the MAF kit you get the rogue chip and then drop it into whichever DME you have.

The rogue DME isn't available just yet according to his previous posts.

Rogue_Ant

Tom,
Arominus answered it for me.
I do not have the new DME up on the website just yet... still working on that!
Keep checking in, I will get the page up soon.