Kevin Michael

Yes it was! Electrical problems plagued the early cars mainly, but even those were quite reliable. the 87 and ups were and still are dead reliable if not neglected for a long period. You are very right about the 928 interiors though. I will always have a soft-spot for the 951 though. Although I stated I prefer 928's, I love that feeling of coming on boost and the world class handling in those 951's. To me they were much better cars than the 911's of the day and almost as expensive new.

JohnKoaWood

I drive in a month what you have been averaging in a year...

I still stand by my original assessment that a stock vs stock comparison on a twisty track the 951 wins, any day of the week.

And sorry, but the 928 was NOT the CGT of its day... 959 in 86-90 was the CGT of the 928s day...

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Porsche_959

Pay close attention to the timeline at the bottom of the page. 959, followed by the 911 GT1, then the CGT...

The 928 is a GT (Grand Tourer), and was NEVER delivered from the factory with forced induction for just this reason!

I should add, 928s are very nice, and when properly maintained (as with any P car) very reliable... I would still have one.... but it had to go....

Jfrahm

No electrical horror stories, just the usual switch or connector issue or two. Same as the 944 series. Cars that were mistreated or got wet inside will be trouble, 928, 944, 951 or whatever. Some problems with the brain or MAF but both are rebuildable with modern updates. Not really any worse than the AFM/DME/KLR and related issues on the 951. The 928 fuel injectors can be swapped with common Ford parts.

Interiors falling apart? I have not seen anywhere near as many center console or glovebox problems, and don't get me started bout the 10-speaker door boxes on the 944s. No problems with the 928 hatch glass. I have had a lot more problems with window switches and sunroof gears, switches, etc. on the 944 series.

There are some issues with the early 928 5-speed synchros and front control arms, but most people looking for street/track are probably looking at an 85 and up 928. My 928s have not been early enough to have these issues so I do not know much about them. The control arm issue is easily sorted out and I know people do track the early 5-speeds, maybe you have to abuse the trans to mess it up.

-Joel.

J Berk

I looked at 928's before I got my S2....most were early and some were mid/late 80's cars.

Almost every one I looked at had dash/stalk/buttons in poor condition. The seats were generally no different than 944's...eg: worn bolsters, etc.

Joel...have you tracked your car? I wonder what it's like in stock form on the track? Only ones I've seen have been either heavily modified or at least worked suspension.

Jfrahm

I've never tracked a 928 and stock they might be a bit softer than a stock 951, however a track car is likely to get some springs and shocks. The 951 is likely to be chipped, as would a 32v 928S.

Stock vs. stock would be somewhat interesting but unrealistic. What would it be? Stock 86 951 with 217HP, stock ride height, vs a 288HP 928 with factory adjustable ride height? Set to what height? Stock 87-88 951 vs 316HP 928S4? Stock 951S vs stock 928GT? Stock wheels and tires? M030? M474?

I think it'd be a hell of a race. Not sure who would win... in a best of breed stock street example of each year I would favor the 928 in all years except 1988 (951S vs 928S4.) Also the 86 951 might have a good chance against the 86 928S as the 928S does not wear the wider rear wheels/tires yet and if it is an early one it still has the early brakes. However the 86 928Shas a stonking 288HP 32v motor and possibly underrated at that. I had one and it was pretty fast. 288HP and torque everywhere would be formidable compared to a 217HP 951 with narrower tires and no front ride height adjustment.

I have not seen a lot of issues with stalk controls on the 928 but the 944 cruise control stalk seems to get broken off a lot. The 928 parts are more or less the same. Dash cracks are as evident on both. Seats are the same except for extra padding on the 928 seats.

I've had two 928s, two 951s, two 944s2s and two 968s and my brother has had examples of all these cars as well so I have owned and worked on a lot of them. Both cars are decent, some issues here and there, no big deal unless you find an abused one IMO.

Don't get me wrong, I like the 944 series cars. Hell I've had six or them or so. However the stellar underpinnings and undeniably larger motor make the 928 quite a car.

-Joel.

Rogue_Ant

Timeslips or its just another 'it would've run' fabrication.

Kevin Michael

A total fabrication for sure. But there are quite a few others out there fabricating the same times and some even faster. There is one running 30psi and is dead reliable through a stock transaxle. That car I believe would run in the 9's or low 10's. Let's not forget the factory built the later engines to handle boost, and lots of it. A few would argue that fact but it is true, they just never made the turbo versions( and for very obvious reasons!)

Rogue_Ant

I've known plenty of cars that 'should' run 11's and faster... But execution is entirely different.

Kevin Michael

The stock 87 5spd S4 would do a 13.5. So is it so hard to believe adding 13 psi would put her in the 11's? I can't prove it on here, especially since the SC has long since been removed to be replaced by twin turbos (not done yet). The car is very well known here and in these parts.

Daniel Dudley

I think stock to stock you should compare a 944 Turbo to a 928 GT. They are very evenly matched. I have owned both the 951 and several 928s, and I track a lightly modified 928. In stock form, both cars need more tire.

I like the power delivery and abundant low end torque of the 928, and I like the cornering attitude. They were however set up to be very safe understeering cars stock, and need a little more rear sway to really shine. I have run a 944S in addition to the 951, and I really liked the 951 for it's performance, but prefer the way a 928 feels when set up properly over the 944 variants. It is totally subjective that I like the 928. If I lived in the high desert, I might well prefer the 951.

hacker-pschorr

I've only seen one McLaren F1 at a track day, so I guess that means the 944 is also faster?

I see far more Mazda Miata's at every track event. So I guess that means they are faster then every 944?

This could be a great thread without the asinine comments.

The last PCA Race event I was at (Labor Day few years ago Road America) the only two 928's were cleaning up most of the GT1 field. The only car in front was a FABCAR built 911 Turbo.
Here's a hint on why this matters, GT1 is where they put the really fast 911 Turbo's. Not one 951 in that group this particular weekend.

Time for a new mechanic.

I own both and I'm getting a huge kick out of this thread.

odurandina

my 928 did one thing better than my 968. glide at 120 mph, which is what it was built to do...

my 968 runs @ 4,800 rpm's at this speed. everything else about my 928 was a castastrophe.


this is not a thread that will build bridges between nations.

J Berk

I don't think there's a shred of doubt about which car has more 'grunt' or is easier to mod to make HUGE horsepower....that goes to the 928 hands-down.

I also have no doubt that a built 928 is a monster in the long straights on any track.

What I do think is that since they are far heavier than a 944 or 911 that there are fewer people interested in tracking them.

I am in no way knocking 928's...I love them and have wanted one for years....but if they were superior track cars I would think that there would be a closer distribution to 944's.....on track days the 944 out-numbers the 928 10 to 1.

As for my mechanic...he's superb....although for full disclosure, he is a 944S2/951 owner. He's owned 911's as well but never a 928....which as I said, he looks at as too expensive to maintain. He's tracked cars with both PCA and EMRA for many years and I do respect him as a mechanic.

alxdgr8

I wouldn't say a 928 is easier to mod at all. To get power you need to go some kind of forced induction...which is $$$. Modding a 951 for gains is easy since it's already FI from the factory. Sure if money were no issue, it would be easier to make more power out of a V8 than I4.

alxdgr8

Woot Bench Racing!



If you don't have an 11 second slip, your car isn't an 11 second car. Simple as that.