Bruno'S2

I feel I might start something big here but here I go anyway. Did a few DE events this summer and really liked it. I feel now my S2 could use a few suspension upgrades. Wonder if anyone can make suggestions? I want to keep driving the car on the road but would like to improve the track behavior. Would 17' or 18' wheels make any difference?

krazykarl

http://www.clarks-garage.com/pdf-manual/susp-15.pdf

All sorts of useful information regarding suspension upgrades in that clarks-garage article. Larger wheels could help or hurt performance depending on their size and weight. Personally I think 18" wheels are too big for the 944, and the larger width would be offset by the heavier weight of the wheels.

http://www.924.org/techsection/Suspe...reparation.htm

Another useful article

JohnKoaWood

Whhhaaaatttttt?



18s can also be had that are LIGHTER than the 16inch phonies... and most newer 17 inch wheels... I replaced my 16 Phonies with Boxter twist 17s, and the twists were replaced by these...

I am also running a bunch of other suspension mods on my car that would make the car kill on HPDE / Track / spirited twistie driving...

If starting from scratch, it all depends on budget and end desire...

easy / low cost / factory original are also concerns...

I have M474 on my car from the factory, so I did the hacksaw mod to my struts, added Koni sport shocks in the rear (soon to be replaced by Koni series 30 coil overs to eliminate the torsion bars)... To that I added Elephant racing monoballs, M030 sways (soon to be replaced with weltmeisters) ground control adjustable camber plates, and topped off by a turbo cup replica strut tower bar... add in some ball joints and tie rod ends and you are cooking with fire...

I finished everything off with the paragon adjustable ride height kit and lowered the entire thing about 2 inches... with 245 rubber in front and 285 in rear the car is FAST, and deadly in the twisties....

I have surprised my share of newer 911 owners and taught a Cayman S owner that he spent too much buying a car he thought was fast!

Potomac-Greg

My track wheels are always the smallest wheels I can run. Forgetting all the other arguments, smaller wheels mean cheaper tires. MUCH cheaper tires. I'll never run anything bigger than 15" wheels on my 944. I can buy R-compounds for less than $150/tire, and good street tires for $100 each or less. (My sig photo shows me on 17"s They're long gone. If I get 17s it's going to be for street use -- because they look so good.)

If you do
3+ DE's a year, you can invest in stickier tires -- R-compounds if your event allows it.

After tires, the best money you can spend is on sway bars; and most of the benefit will come from the rear sway bar. I have a 968 M030 bar with Racer's Edge mounting blocks. It's a real simple bolt-on upgrade.

krystar

def smaller diameter tires are much cheaper. there's a performance "premium" on 17" tires and extra over the top premium on 18" tires

i think the next thing after tires is brakes. although sways are also cheap and easy enough to install.

pontifex4

I installed the 968 M030 bars (front and adjustable rear) as well as new rotors and pads and a set of weltmeister 200# front springs, wrapped up by a 4 wheel Marcus Blaszak alignment.

The alignment seems to have been the best money spent.

The work I did/had done totally transformed the car. My Konis (from the M474 package, not the high-end M030 ones) are set fairly soft, and it gives me all the grip I can handle for my driving ability, plus comfort for the road. I will do this again on the new car, unless my skill changes dramatically next year and I need much stiffer springs for it. I'm going to give it a year and see.

Potomac-Greg

I would clarify that brake PADS are a key upgrade (maybe necessary). The brake systems on 944s (all of them) are more than sufficient for any track event. If you're not competing, you just need something that will stop you reliably.

Bruno'S2

WOW thanks guys this is a lot of good information, I have a lot of copy paste to do to start finding those parts. Thanks again and keep it coming.

pontifex4

I was able to find everything but the rotors for my upgrade used, but I had given myself much of the previous winter to search Rennlist and Pelican's used parts classifieds.

As a side note, I've never seen a more reputable group of buyers and sellers than on Pelican and Rennlist. Particularly helpful, too!

We're in good company.

racer

Congrats on getting out and doing some DE's! How much DE experience do you have? What kind of things do YOU think the car needs? How original is your S2 to begin with? imho, depending on mileage of existing components, the items I would suggest are new shocks and tires, maybe a second set of rims/tires for track duty. THEN get some seat time.. then some more seat time.

After that, I would reconsider your goals for you and the car? I don't now that you have enough DE experience to know what you want out of the car, how much you want to change etc. Despite 10 years of DE in my 914 (and being a DE instructor), when I bought my 911, I kept it as stock as it came. Why? to learn the car and figure out what I wanted to improve out of it. Then I jumped in big time and made it a car that I really liked.

you might find it beneficial to take a similar wait and see approach. As someone who's been down this path, also consider that, before you drop $5K or more into your current car, it could be better to sell it and buy someone elses sorted out project.

J Berk

This is wise advice and the same that I have been told over the last two years of DE (my first 2 years I might add).

To that end, I have put Koni yellows on the car and not done much else yet.

I now have a spare set of wheels/tires and I am planning to put a tire trailer together this winter.

I should add that all the wheels are 16"....I will probably look for one more set so I can either run 8" dia all around or 8" in front and 9" out back.

I am still learning to drive what I have...so I don't feel a huge need to upgrade yet although I have picked up an M030 rear swaybar which may go on before the DE season.

Spend the time getting YOU better...and when that's matched the limits of your car then it's time to spend $....at least that's my plan.

pontifex4

There is definitely no substitute for track time, but in my case, I started with one blown rear shock, two very bad strut mounts and a front sway bar bushing which had dissolved from a power steering leak. Things were pretty dicey at speed, and the car badly needed a brake job, so I spent some money and time doing it right, and the car's added abilities should hold me for as long as I keep it.

Weigh advice along the lines of "don't change anything but your driving" against your own judgement (or a mechanic's) as to the state of the car. If there's slop due to aging, I believe you should fix it now. If I hadn't fixed what was too sloppy, I might have gotten hurt, and I certainly wouldn't have enjoyed my first track season (just finished) as much.

porschefig

Show me a set of 17 or 18" (any width 8" or more) that fits an early offset, is within a couple pounds of factory fuchs, and doesn't cost more than $2000... (if the offset isn't right, you have to include the weight of spacers..)

Potomac-Greg

I had an interesting and somewhat eye opening experience recently that made me re-focus on the track time and less on the car. After years of making my 944 better on track (stiffer, stiffer, stiffer, with sticky tires), I had the chance to run some "spirited" parade laps with my wife's Mercedes GL320CDI -- yes, a three ton SUV! Running at modest speeds, on squishy tires, I got to do all the stuff I did in my 944, but the inputs and outputs were so much more extreme, and at lower speeds. Turns out, any car is fun, as long as it's balanced enough to be able to work it around turns with the brakes.

The only thing that kills the fun is understeer. If you have too much of it, there's just some stuff you can't do.

J Berk

Charlie

I agree 100%!!!! Having your car in top mechanical shape goes without saying and is different than mods. I made sure that everything was in healthy working order before considering signing up for my first event....the koni's replaced an aging but servicable set of stock non-adjustable units that had been on the car....but even that did not happen before season 2.