Will the boxster become the next 944?
02-15-2003, 03:01 PM
#1
Burning Brakes
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Will the boxster become the next 944?
Boxsters are depreciating fast, real fast. They already have the bastard child complex that the 944 seems to have. Hell, even Sopranos gave them a low blow. I’m thinking in a few years you’ll be able to find many examples in the teens. So will they become the next poor mans Porsche? A 20 year old 944 can be had for $2,000 in running condition. Will a 1997 boxster go for $3,000 in 2016?
02-15-2003, 03:18 PM
#2
Three Wheelin'
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yep. sure will. in fact, if you factor in inflation the boxster is actually selling at a slightly lower price than a 944 in the same production of its kind year (like a first year 944 vs a first year Boxster) - im pretty sure of that anyway 
example: 2002 Boxster (6th production year) was sold at ~45 (40min / 50 max) sticker price
and my 1988 944S (5th/6th) production year sold for around 39 (i think 34 was min in 1988 and 48 was max in 88 for all the different models of 944 in 88: NA / S / Turbo / TurboS) anyway.. as you see.. even without inflation the 944 was selling for almost as much as a boxster is selling now.. factor in inflation and..
<a href="http://data.bls.gov/cgi-bin/cpicalc.pl" target="_blank">http://data.bls.gov/cgi-bin/cpicalc.pl</a>
38 grand in 1988 is the same as 57 grand in 2002
woopi
yes, im bored. bye
example: 2002 Boxster (6th production year) was sold at ~45 (40min / 50 max) sticker price
and my 1988 944S (5th/6th) production year sold for around 39 (i think 34 was min in 1988 and 48 was max in 88 for all the different models of 944 in 88: NA / S / Turbo / TurboS) anyway.. as you see.. even without inflation the 944 was selling for almost as much as a boxster is selling now.. factor in inflation and..
<a href="http://data.bls.gov/cgi-bin/cpicalc.pl" target="_blank">http://data.bls.gov/cgi-bin/cpicalc.pl</a>
38 grand in 1988 is the same as 57 grand in 2002
woopi
yes, im bored. bye
02-15-2003, 04:02 PM
#4
Racer
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Short answer
YES
I'm going to get a good laugh at my nephew's expense fifteen years from now when his $27K Boxster is going for the same money as my 944!
and YES I plan on driving a 944 fifteen years from now!
It's MY Porsche of choice... period!
<img border="0" alt="[cheers]" title="" src="graemlins/beerchug.gif" />
YES
I'm going to get a good laugh at my nephew's expense fifteen years from now when his $27K Boxster is going for the same money as my 944!
and YES I plan on driving a 944 fifteen years from now!
It's MY Porsche of choice... period!
<img border="0" alt="[cheers]" title="" src="graemlins/beerchug.gif" />
02-15-2003, 05:33 PM
#7
Race Car
</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana,Tahoma,Arial,Helvetica,Geneva">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana,Tahoma,Arial,Helvetica,Geneva">Originally posted by Micah Jones:
<strong>I thought there were also rumors of a 986 Turbo.
Micah</strong></font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana,Tahoma,Arial,Helvetica,Geneva">That would be the obvious next step and I thought that would be the case three years ago. However, Porsche introduced the 951 only 3 years after introducing the 944, and it has been nearly 6 years since the boxster came out, so maybe a turbo 986 is not to be expected. I would love to have one!
I for one think the boxster has been better received than the 944, but then i'm only 30 and don't recall the initial acceptance of the 944. I also think Porsche has gone to great lengths to tie the boxster in to the Porsche 996 line (identical headlights and styling cues), moreso than they did with the 944 vs 911.
But hey, I can deal with that depreciation! A $15-20000 boxster S in the near future! yea!
<strong>I thought there were also rumors of a 986 Turbo.
Micah</strong></font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana,Tahoma,Arial,Helvetica,Geneva">That would be the obvious next step and I thought that would be the case three years ago. However, Porsche introduced the 951 only 3 years after introducing the 944, and it has been nearly 6 years since the boxster came out, so maybe a turbo 986 is not to be expected. I would love to have one!
I for one think the boxster has been better received than the 944, but then i'm only 30 and don't recall the initial acceptance of the 944. I also think Porsche has gone to great lengths to tie the boxster in to the Porsche 996 line (identical headlights and styling cues), moreso than they did with the 944 vs 911.
But hey, I can deal with that depreciation! A $15-20000 boxster S in the near future! yea!
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02-15-2003, 07:17 PM
#9
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They won't make a Boxster Turbo until they come out with the 997. The 911 with the Cayenne's 8 cylinders in the 911, so a NA 911 will make 350+ horses and perform better then a Boxster Turbo. That's the only way they'll up the performance of the Boxster.
Mark my words.
-Matt
Mark my words.
-Matt
02-15-2003, 07:33 PM
#11
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I have been watching the prices lately and there are a lot showing up from lease returns and people are dumping some of their toys as the economy gets worse. Which means you can pick up an early one for around $20k right now with many around $25k.
02-15-2003, 07:43 PM
#12
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Problem is, the Boxter is a VERY SMALL car. And very short. I am 6'1", and my 944 fits me fine. I didnt fit into a Boxter as well. So, with it's 2+2 seating and hatch, I think the 944 is a more versatile car than the Boxter will ever be, room-wise!
02-15-2003, 07:46 PM
#13
I suspect that Matt is right with regards to a Boxster Turbo. And it's because of marketing.
My friend at Porsche put it this way. "Porsche will NEVER race the Boxster in a factory sponsored effort. Why? Well, what happens when a Boxster beats a 911?"
Porsche would have a marketing problem on its hands if a 986 was outperforming a 996. They learned this lesson in the 80's with the 951.
OTOH, my friend concedes that the Boxster S already "threatens" the 996 Cabriolet. In the year 2000 (3.4L in 996), the power to weight ratio of both cars was nearly identical!
He also adds that a Boxster coupe DOES exist and will likely see production.
Now with regard to the Boxster being the next 944, this is probably true. But note that the same MAY apply to the 996, which has also seen extreme depreciation over the past year. The combination of zero percent new car financing, the economic downturn, and increased competition has driven down resale values across the board. Some 996s are bring less than 993s.
On the bright side, this depreciation is just making some great cars all the more affordable for enthusiasts...
My friend at Porsche put it this way. "Porsche will NEVER race the Boxster in a factory sponsored effort. Why? Well, what happens when a Boxster beats a 911?"
Porsche would have a marketing problem on its hands if a 986 was outperforming a 996. They learned this lesson in the 80's with the 951.
OTOH, my friend concedes that the Boxster S already "threatens" the 996 Cabriolet. In the year 2000 (3.4L in 996), the power to weight ratio of both cars was nearly identical!
He also adds that a Boxster coupe DOES exist and will likely see production.
Now with regard to the Boxster being the next 944, this is probably true. But note that the same MAY apply to the 996, which has also seen extreme depreciation over the past year. The combination of zero percent new car financing, the economic downturn, and increased competition has driven down resale values across the board. Some 996s are bring less than 993s.
On the bright side, this depreciation is just making some great cars all the more affordable for enthusiasts...
02-15-2003, 08:16 PM
#14
Three Wheelin'
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I have been recently thinking that the market for 986 modifications should start to become more prolific, especially since I have also seen falling prices lately. 986 Turbo.. hmm.. <drool> Affordable 996 Turbo power!I have seen kits in some UK mags for the installation of a 996 engine in a 986 (flipped around). I would just assume that a enough people with enough dough and wherewithall would be making mods like installing high HP 911 Turbo engine. The market is ripe for 986 mods!
Quickie google action:
<a href="http://www.gtpurelyporsche.com/index.asp?issue=8" target="_blank">GT magazine, no info</a>
</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana,Tahoma,Arial,Helvetica,Geneva">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana,Tahoma,Arial,Helvetica,Geneva">Boxster Engine Modifications
911 (996) Engine Swap
This is a conversion that should theoretically be easy since the Boxster and 996 engines use the same basic block. Increases engine displacemement from 2.5 liters to 3.4 liters, and power from 201 hp to 296 hp! The only big mechanical problem is that the 996 engine rotates the transmission in the opposite direction, so the Boxster transaxle has to be modified to allow reverse rotation. The only two places that I know of that are pursuing this are <a href="http://www.kellymoss.com/pages/boxsterxshome.htm" target="_blank">Kelly Moss Motorsports</a>. and Zucz Performance Motorsports. There are undoubtedly other complicating factors, like whether the Boxster transmission is strong enough to handle the extra power, the engine management elctronics, etc. But it sure sounds like a fun conversion to me! Not legal in SCCA's "Street Prepared Category".</font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana,Tahoma,Arial,Helvetica,Geneva"><a href="http://www.rahul.net/dennisp/boxster/boxster-mods-engine.shtml" target="_blank">boxster mods link</a>
<a href="http://www.gt3fx.com" target="_blank">GT3-RS site</a>
Quickie google action:
<a href="http://www.gtpurelyporsche.com/index.asp?issue=8" target="_blank">GT magazine, no info</a>
</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana,Tahoma,Arial,Helvetica,Geneva">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana,Tahoma,Arial,Helvetica,Geneva">Boxster Engine Modifications
911 (996) Engine Swap
This is a conversion that should theoretically be easy since the Boxster and 996 engines use the same basic block. Increases engine displacemement from 2.5 liters to 3.4 liters, and power from 201 hp to 296 hp! The only big mechanical problem is that the 996 engine rotates the transmission in the opposite direction, so the Boxster transaxle has to be modified to allow reverse rotation. The only two places that I know of that are pursuing this are <a href="http://www.kellymoss.com/pages/boxsterxshome.htm" target="_blank">Kelly Moss Motorsports</a>. and Zucz Performance Motorsports. There are undoubtedly other complicating factors, like whether the Boxster transmission is strong enough to handle the extra power, the engine management elctronics, etc. But it sure sounds like a fun conversion to me! Not legal in SCCA's "Street Prepared Category".</font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana,Tahoma,Arial,Helvetica,Geneva"><a href="http://www.rahul.net/dennisp/boxster/boxster-mods-engine.shtml" target="_blank">boxster mods link</a>
<a href="http://www.gt3fx.com" target="_blank">GT3-RS site</a>
02-15-2003, 08:58 PM
#15
Race Car
</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana,Tahoma,Arial,Helvetica,Geneva">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana,Tahoma,Arial,Helvetica,Geneva">Originally posted by thomschoon:
<strong>I have been watching the prices lately and there are a lot showing up from lease returns and people are dumping some of their toys as the economy gets worse. </strong></font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana,Tahoma,Arial,Helvetica,Geneva">if i may digress a bit. . .
i am currently a medical resident and the physician i work with recently returned his 996 after the lease expired. now he has another porsche on order but doesn't know whether he wants it or not. i told him i have a 944, but he probably didn't even know what that is.
i love porsches and i would love to have a 996, but i just can't get over how many people use porsche as a fashion statement. leasing a porsche is so typically a fashion statement - driving the current model until it's out of style then moving on to the next one. it just bugs the crap out of me. and this guy was your typical arrogant high dollar guy - looks are everything. <img border="0" alt="[soapbox]" title="" src="graemlins/soapbox.gif" />
<strong>I have been watching the prices lately and there are a lot showing up from lease returns and people are dumping some of their toys as the economy gets worse. </strong></font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana,Tahoma,Arial,Helvetica,Geneva">if i may digress a bit. . .
i am currently a medical resident and the physician i work with recently returned his 996 after the lease expired. now he has another porsche on order but doesn't know whether he wants it or not. i told him i have a 944, but he probably didn't even know what that is.
i love porsches and i would love to have a 996, but i just can't get over how many people use porsche as a fashion statement. leasing a porsche is so typically a fashion statement - driving the current model until it's out of style then moving on to the next one. it just bugs the crap out of me. and this guy was your typical arrogant high dollar guy - looks are everything. <img border="0" alt="[soapbox]" title="" src="graemlins/soapbox.gif" />