sharky47

So I was thinking the other day about how I was going to build up my "S" engine for the track car. I am going to use a Megasquirt unit for EFI and Ignition and I was thinking about alcohol as fuel. With the megasquirt, all I have to do is change the programming to adapt to alternative fuels, the only major thing is having compatible seals/equipment.

When I worked at the airport, we had an airplane there that was part of a research experiment - it ran great! They had to change out all the seals and tune it for the alcohol, but with an EFI system this would be easy, right?

Discuss...............

Manning

Doesn't alcohol have less potential for energy than gasoline?

Serge944

What about Toluene? You can get it in 50 gallon drums for relatively cheap and it has a RON octane rating of 121.

J Berk

FWIW....Toluene is a major cancer causing agent....it's proper handling is the subject of about every HAZWOPER training class I've ever had. Might be a great fuel though!

sharky47

Manning - yes it does, you have to use more fuel for the same amount of energy. BUT - the way gas prices are going, it may become cheaper. Mainly it is an experiment to see if it will work, I can always change it back to gasoline in the software.

Manning

I think it is a neat project none the less. Are you seriously considering this?

sharky47

Why not? I am building the engine up from nothing, so putting in compatible seals from the beginning won't be a problem, even if I never use them for alcohol. But yeah, I'd like to - need to find out where I can buy that much alcohol at one time for a decent price. I am planning on keeping this car barely street legal, so I can play on the back roads around here, I wonder what the implications are one using non-taxed/non-gasoline fuels........

I think with a fully programmable EFI (Megasquirt) - which I was going to use anyway, it should be fairly easy. Even if I have to mix something into the alcohol to make it perform better, if it is mostly alcohol it should be cheaper, right?

Manning

I imagine if you can buy it in volume, yeah, but go price a can of alcohol fuel for a marine stove and see what you come up with per gallon.

EDIT Something around $17.00 per gallon jug from West Marine.

sharky47

What about building a still?

Porsche-O-Phile

Methanol would be a great way to go (you can boost the hell out of it), but you have to re-map the chips for the stoich of methanol (IIRC it's about 6:1 or so) and obviously you're only going to go half as far on a tank. . . Also you need to have additives put into your fuel since methanol has no lubricating properties for the seals in the tank, pump, lines, injectors, etc. I believe the ignition would also have to be reworked, but heck, it's done quite reliably on race/drag cars, no reason it can't be done. I've toyed with the idea myself, but haven't done any real investigating hardcore into it. . .

sharky47

Yeah, I figured I would need some kind of additive, and the ignition should be covered by the Megasquirt. What are the legalities of distilling grain alcohol?

badcoupe

We run methanol straight in our midget. It takes almost exactly twice as much fuel for the same amount of energy. Injectors are tuff part. We run mechanical fuel injection by hilborn. I'm not sure who makes efi injectors compatible with alcohol. Engine seals are ok, the problem is eats aluminum, we have to run castor oil through the system eveynight when we get done so it doesn't eats the aluminum cylinders up and the pistons. Plus you'll have to replace any rubber fuel line in the system with braided stainless or other alky compatible mayerial. We run 18:1 comprssion ratio though so with boost you could safely get by 11 or 12:1 no sweat. It's about $2.25 a gallon from our distributor (we are a VP dealer) and usually 2.50 or so at the track. Like I said the methanol is hard on any rubber and aluminum thats about the only drawback.

meanmaroon951

the engine would run really cool too, btu factor is less

Campeck

heh. you better get some HUGE *** injectors. if i remeber correctly it needs about double the gas to get the right AFR. which is also different. somewhere along 9:1?

again. I dont remeber so well.
my turbo thread in the turbo forum has a link to a really helpfull site about that.

Sam I am

Sharky47,

Check out this link, it has alot of useful info on alternative fuels.

alternative fuel

By the way, I think you have a great idea.