Granite 944

Joseph,

IMHO, I would never attempt to remove an engine from this car, or most any other car without the "luxury" of a hoist. I strongly recommend going down, and renting an engine hoist (preferable with a leveling spreader), grab a hold of the engine with that, and then proceed. The alignment of the driveshaft spline into the splines of clutch disk is just to unforgiving without the aid of a hoist on the engine, especially if your by yourself, with no help. To much personal injury risk, and parts damage risk for me anyway, without one. Yeah, given enough leverage on it, you can, and will bend the forward end of driveshaft. You'll know when its all apart. I STRONGLY urge using an engine hoist upon re-install. Rental cost me like $35.00 a day. I'll be buying one before I drop the next engine of mine. Good luck!

joseph mitro

thanks everyone. so here's the knowledge i've accumulated so far:

definitely need an engine hoist (rented one the other day but didn't have everything i needed to get the engine out that day)

remove the transmission first? never done this or even heard that it needs to be done this way. How hard is this? what's involved? removing the CV joints and unbolting some mounting points in the back? i'll check clark's garage.

Granite 944

You don't need to remove the tranny in order to get the engine out. The torque tube/driveshaft can remain as found. You have the choice of removing engine out the top of car, or drop it out the bottom. Exactly, where are you at in this removal process? The car has been lowered? Engine is currently unbolted, but sitting on the ground with a block under it? I'm assuming you have the cross member out of it already? It would help us all to know exactly where your at now, and whats been done so far.

Charlie

Joseph, I pulled my engine a few months ago with two floor jacks. It would be easier with a hoist. I borrowed a hoist to put it in, did not think I could do it with floor jacks. Just get a hoist and and relieve the pressure on the drive shaft, and with a little prying it should come out.

Macfreak007

Joesph, if you are going out the top you should definately not leave the bellhousing connected to the engine TRUST ME! I have done this twice now and I know that it may seem easier, but you are gonna have to end up doing much more work that way, take the pressure plate bolts out from inside the starter hole gradually, and then disconnect all of the bellhousing bolts and the senors including their housing, then then engine will come basically straight up and out. you have probably already destroyed your motor mounts the way you are doing it currently, order some more of those. reconnect the torque tube bolts and hook up the hoist then do exactly what I said to do, you have to trust me on this, it will save you time and headache in the long run, and this way you could even change the clutch if need be. If you run into a brick wall doing it my way just ask. I promise if you follow my directions it should come out headache free. leaving the bellhousing intact is just asking for trouble...

joseph mitro

thanks charlie.

granite - everything is completely unbolted. i left the crossmember attached to pull the engine from below on the advice of another member. the only thing left connected is the driveshaft. the bell housing is about 2 inches separated from the torque tube housing, but i can't get it apart to drop the engine completely. the engine is currently resting on the crossmember which is on the ground at a 30 degree angle (rotated towards the passenger side). the car has been lowered as far down as possible to reduce stress on the driveshaft. it is close to the height it would be with wheels and tires on.

the complicating problem is that i don't have the rear engine hoist shackle. it was not reinstalled last year when i had the head repaired from the chain tensioner failure. damn independent shops. i did buy another shackle, and in the process of installing it today, one of the two M6 bolts snapped in the head because i torqued it too much. so now i can't really use the rear shackle unless i attach it to the head with only one M6 bolt, which it looks like i will have to do. i will probably just end up buying a hoist since i will probably need it several times between now and ?

thanks for all the help everybody.

Granite 944

Sounds like quite the precarious situation going there. I understand the rear shackle/lift point deal. I don't suggest using that lift point, if you can only get one bolt in it, especially if your using a hookup to it that has a side pull on it. Even when well bolted on, one should use a spreader/lift leveler, to keep the pull straight up on these shackles/lift points so they don't bend and distort. In the past, I've used a 2 by 4, with holes drilled near the ends, to keep a chain coming straight down on lift points. A spreader/lift leveler would be even better. You might try using a universal style engine tie up, one with the chain going to two L brackets that you bolt somewhere on the engine? Ya might have to remove some other components to get it to work, like the fuel rail or such. Maybe you can come up with some nylon or even cable slings, and go all the way around the engine with it with one sling?

The bellhousing will have to come off in order to pull engine out the top (hood off). Car is down low right now. Car has to be blocked up rather high in order to get engine out the bottom. You've got to get a hoist on this puppy one way or another in order to deal with all this. I hope you've got some extra hands helping you with this. Good luck......and most of all .......be safe!

Danno

DO NOT USE THE REAR ENGINE-BRACKET WITH A SINGLE 6MM BOLT !!! It won't hold and you'll drop your engine, crack the pan and cause more damage.

In addition to the hoist, you need a leveler to angle the engine. That's why it's stuck on the driveshaft, the weight and load is such that the crank is no longer parallel to the driveshaft; you're risking bending it.

I've removed the engine through the top numerous times with the radiator in place, just have to remove the headlight bar. If you want additional 6" clearance, then remove the radiator and the front belt-covers, pulleys and belts. The tranny and torque-tube stays in place.

joseph mitro

so i went and purchased an engine hoist with a leveler tonight. spent 1 1/2 hours assembling the hoist. too late to start on the engine now, but when i do - here's the question. the leveler has four chains with one L-shaped bracket on each chain. each bracket has an eyelet to bolt the bracket to the engine using a large M8 or M10 bolt. so where are the three or four locations on the engine i can attach the L-brackets to? the first is to the mounting location of the front engine shackle, but what about the other three L-brackets?

again, i ask myself....why did i take on the job?

Campeck

i know that there should be a mounting bracket at he back somwhere...behind the cam cover?
also...an engine adjuster thingy helps ALOT!! so you can titl the engine forward to let it slide off the driveshaft......brb with a pic

Campeck

see the thing that the lift is holding?
it is VERY usefull....

joseph mitro

UPDATE - allright everybody, if anybody is interested.......I got the engine off today!!! minor victory for me. i bolted the engine hoist to the motor in three locations, lifted it up to take weight off the driveshaft, inserted a ball-joint fork to separate the bellhousing and torque tube, and that engine almost slid right off the driveshaft. i couldn't believe it. it still needed a little more maneuvering to entirely clear the driveshaft, but now the engine is out of the car and I can rest easier. all fingers and toes are intact (which is good since it's crucial to my job!!)

thank you all for your help. it will probably be needed in the future when the rebuild starts.

Granite 944

Man, am I glad to hear that! Ya had me a little worried for a while there!
And I'm sure glad Danno made a stronger point of not using the aft lift point!

"again, i ask myself....why did i take on the job?"

because you CAN do it!.........Your a Rennlister!

I've been waiting to see ya post something as to what was happening! I missed your previous post. Where did you end up making the other two hookups?

Fingers and toes intact is ALWAYS a good thing! Congrats!!!
Yeah......I'm interested!

Granite 944

Campeck,

"there is usually only one way to do things right....yet an infinitum ammount of ways to do something wrong - me"

I don't know man......ever heard the phrase...."theres more than one way to skin a cat" ?

Murphy's law for the second part.........just gotta be!........ask how I know!

joseph mitro

i bolted one L-bracket to the front engine shackle location (uses a 17mm wrench) and the other two I bolted to 13mm bolts on the head just above the headers. on my 16 valve head, there are two spots there where the coolant tubing that flows to the heater valve is bolted to the head, and they worked well for distributing the load of the engine well.

next up: remove the bellhousing, bolt the engine to the stand, and begin disassembly.