Hello all,
I’ve been in the process of an extensive street build for a few years with lots of mods. This is a sentimental project building the street/autox car my late Father and I spoke at length about. Suspension, brakes, transmission gearing mods, engine have all been massaged.

At this point I’m interested in opinions on which newer ECU system to try on the car.

Option 1: NA-tune seems to be a pretty simple setup and leave it alone option. Possibly less power to be had.

Option 2: VEMS seems very capable and Peep will make a new engine harness if you ask, or at least it was an option in the past.

Option 3: Augtronic?

Option 4: any other recommendations?

I can learn to tune on my own with VEMS, but have never done it before. I’ve got a laptop that can be dedicated to the cause.



Engine specs and mods are as follows:

1986 engine with 9.5:1 compression 2-4% leakdown readings

Elgin billet cam custom grind with stock lift and 272* intake/exhaust duration

adjustable cam gear

MSDS gen 2 header and full 2.5” exhaust.

3 angle valve job and light decking

951 valve springs and fresh valve stem oil seals

Multi spark ignition with msd coil

larger injectors (still need an adjustable fpr to dial things in on fuel supply)

Future modifications:
Have one of my spare heads worked for ferrea valves. Possibly build a 2.85L NA stroker as well.

 

Having run VEMS on my 2.5 8v NA for 5 years, I would suggest Megasquirt/Microsquirt.
Less expensive and there is 1000x more support available for any issues. VEMS support is nearly non-existent.

I put Microsquirt onto my engine swap and making the harness and getting it running couldn't have been any easier.

 

Vote AGAINST AEM Infinity!
It can do anything you could ever imagine.
It just doesn't want to.
Tuning software is clunky.
Finicky (and not user adjustable?!) relationship between the crank sensor/cam sensor timing.
Documentation is pathetic, tech support only occasionally helpful.

After many weeks of can't-make-that-POS-run, I was literally moments away from ripping it out and starting over.
One last try, it started...
Recently exchanged PMs with someone who crossed that threshold. Believe he went with the Haltech...

 

I have NA Tune and think it's great. But I have no experience with the others, and my car is otherwise pretty much stock.

 

I like my SDS EFI North American made in Calgary, AB. These guys are O.G. They have been around when there were like only 7 companies making stand alone, and they have experience with German. They are very high quality and have excellent communication. Took about a month to get after ordering. It's custom made to your wishes, and comes with a rough tune. Can be tuned without a laptop, although it's harder. Now is your chance to change to low impedance injectors. And later BOOST if you like. But it is NOT plug and play. And setup might take 20-30+ hours if its your first time. Cost will be like 2000 usd I think. Anyway, best of luck with your 944, whichever way you choose!

 

I'd vote for FTech9. It's truly plug and play, a direct replacement for the OE computer, all housed in the OE case and everything. I did NOTHING to tune it and my 924S runs great.

 

I stopped paying attention to stock DME stuff years ago - does the FT9 let you use a MAF or MAP instead of the junk AFM?

Anyone who is going down this path should at the very least ditch the barn-door.

 

Just saw this part - highly recommend it!

In 2021 I had a 2.9L engine (103mm bore/88mm stroke) with a big cam and super-ported head etc in my car. 12.5 compression, ran E85, the thing was an absolute torque monster and was approaching scary fast at high RPM. Builder said it was 210hp or so.

The extra displacement makes a HUGE difference in how nice the car is to drive.

I sold that engine towards the end of 2021 to fund my engine swap.

 

Spencer, where was your head work done and details on the head and cam?

I have a 3L crank with a spun bearing that would probably be a good candidate for a stroker motor (Plans for a friend) along with a spare 2.5 crank as well.
What is the current go to on the cheaper side of sleeves? Darton Sintered sleeves? I've seen a bunch of options so far, including LN Engineering now offering Nickies for our engines. 928 Motorsports also offers wet sleeves they claim can be bored to 4.3" (109mm). That would mean that with 109mm pistons and a 95mm stroke on an offset ground 3L crank, you could get 3.54 liters from one of these engines...

According to previous threads, a stock 951 should put down 185-187 rwhp. My goal is simply to achieve that number as that would be more than enough to make me happy in this chassis.
I think with anything over 3L, we should be able to get closer to 250 rwhp with a good cam and head combo. Then again, that's a whole 'nother rabbit hole...

 

I bought the engine built already - head was done by some big-name guy in Chicago as a favor to the actual builder.
Cam was a Milledge 8SR-14, if I recall.
That engine had Darton sleeves in it but I imagine regular "Dry" sleeves would be less expensive to do.

The real limit on the 944 engine is RPM - you can get the head flowing pretty well and a big cam but you can't really spin them to a high enough RPM to make it worthwhile (unless you also dry sump it and use better rod bearings/internals).
Then you can only go so big on the cam before the hydraulic lifters don't work and....
$$$$$$

Ancient Ford Pinto 2.3L engines can get parts for days for cheap, and do 270hp N/A so yes a 944 should be doable with sufficient budget...

 

Hi V2Rocket,
I finished building a 2.8L stroker engine with Milledge high lift cam, Wossner 100mm 12.5 CR dome pistons, and Pauter rods with 3.0L crankshaft., Added piston skirt oil squirters and opened the block between cylinders 1-2 and 3-4 to minimize windage parasitic HP losses.,The cylinder head was upgraded by Michael Mount.

The engine is installed in the race car but not started. I am using an Roque NA Tune with Joshua chip for 2.8 L stroker.
If this MAF/ECU has issues, what are the MegaSquirt components needed? Have adjustable FPR, low impedance fuel injectors. My ECU harness is for 1983 Porsche 944.
Thank you,
Tom

 

My AFM works fine. I have had other cars with MAFs and can't say they worked better. A MAF would never pass inspection anyway. As stated by many others, NAs don't have much to give anyway.

 

Sorry to the OP for taking this into the weeds a bit but it's relevant info still.

There is a thread called how to Megasquirt your 944, it's a good read if you look for it.

They work fine to measure the incoming air but they are in themselves a big restriction. Anytime you are below about 4500 rpm and WOT the barn door is partially closed, making your engine breathe through a straw.

Look at the torque gains (14 lbft, about 10%) down low in this Dyno I did several years ago. The black/blue line is stock DME/AFM, the red line is swapped to the old NA-tune MAF kit with a stock tune. Swapping the stock stuff back on for smog check after driving with the MAF felt like the car had a drag parachute on the back. FWIW, it takes about 15 minutes to swap the MAF setup out and the stock stuff back in for CA smog check, BTDT several times.

The MAF is SO much more responsive and nice to drive. A MAP setup feels the same way (I sold my NA-tune MAF to buy VEMS in 2015 and ran that until 2021).



There is plenty of power to be had with an NA 944 engine if you have the $ and time to chase it. With further tuning and advancing the stock cam I ended up netting ~20hp (crank) over stock with no internal changes. Add a real camshaft and desperately needed extra displacement and you really can go far.

 

Look in to a Haltech Elite. It is simply the best bang for the buck ecu. Yes you need to splice in a harness or make your own, but luckily everything is just Bosch and Molex for pins. I'm working on a DBW and sequential injection conversion on mine with a 1500 Elite. I think you can get away with a 750 if you don't want to spend too much money.
I also second avoiding an AEM Infinity. The crank and cam sensing is trash.

 

Respectfully - An Internet pole is probably not a great way to make a decision on something like an ECU…

Advice from people with first hand experience is excellent, but you may want to consider doing your research and decide what makes the most sense to you based on your build’s requirements and your budget.

Youre likely to get a lot of biased and misinformed information by just asking a group of people what they would use. Careful reading of spec sheets, feature lists, SW capability, followed by consideration of how those line up with what you need will get you much closer to an informed, logical decision.

For example, there was a thread on here about a Maxxecu group buy where the people involved were touting it as the greatest thing ever, even though most had basically no idea what they were talking about. Over two years later and none of those clowns have a car running on the ECU… At the time I had just purchased an arguably far better ECU (while being told by them that it was basically junk), and have had my car running with that ECU for over a year now. And very satisfied with the results.

So anyway, it’s easy to sound like an expert on the internet and it’s easy to be swayed by people pretending to know what they’re taking about. So I’d suggest talking your pole results with a grain of salt and doing some deep dive research on what’s available out there for yourself.