JediAgent

Yeah, so i want to get rid of body roll.
Before i go about lower the car on the paragon spring insert, and simultaneously changing torrsion bars, i want to see what sway bars will do. I was thinking of going cheap and just buying some used Turbo sways, but then again possibly buying a set of the Welt 30mm hollows. Or something in between. not sure yet.

Questions:
1. I have a 1985.5 944NA, do i have a rear sway bar? If i don't do i need the rear sway drop links? Would these help anyway?
2. Should i go with Turbo sways (as a racing friend of mine suggested) or buy a bigger sway? Which one do YOU recommend?
3. Does anyone have anyo of these for sale? (This question is mainly why i started a new thread rather than searching old ones)
4. When changing sways are there small things i should simulaneously do? Like rubber bushings and the like...
5. The plan was sways, front springs and rear torsion bars, and finally a strut tower brace ( in that order) Would you suggest any changes to that plan? Additions? Deletions?


Thanks
Greg

btw, im a paying member if that helps you in wanting to postmore info, or post at all.

tazman

Sorry I can not help with your questions I am trying to sort this out for myself but I have some sway bars for sale if you are interested.

I have the originals from my 88 TurboS that measure 26.8mm front and 18mm rear. I have the inner bushings for the front hardly used and inner ones for the rear that are old. I was thinking around $250 for the set.

I also have a set of used Weltmeister bars I will take offers on. I have the competition drop links for the front. The front was to noisy for me but the rear is still on the car but I want to replace it with the 968 unit to make a matching set. I also have split collars for the bars instead of using the hose clamps to hold them in place like Weltmeister supplies.

tazz.mann@verizon.net

Z-man

Jedi
What will you be using your car for? Daily driver? Weekend cruiser? Autox? DE / track? Different sway bar combos work better for different applications...

-Z-man.

JediAgent

Daily Driver. Possibly weekend AutoX.

Z-man

For daily driver, I suggest you go with stock 951 sway bars front and rear.

For autox, I'd still go with the stock 951 front, and step up the rear by one: go for a 968M030 19mm 3-way adjustable rear sway bar if you wish to dial out some understeer.

-Z-man.

Eyal 951

by the way, going with 951 sways, you'll still have plenty of body roll, us stock 951ers can attest to that.
~Eyal

Sami951

If you can swing it, grab a set of 968 CS/M030 sways (both front & rear, 30mm + 19mm adj.) ... Paragon for example carries them, and it's definately a massive improvement compared to stock. I was running turbo sways on my 944S, switched to the M030 setup and it was like night and day!

You need to check the rear though, if your car doesn't have a swaybar you'll need drop links and whatnot.

JediAgent

Not to discount the stock 951 idea, but i have driven many a 951 before, and even though i was more focused on power curve differences, i did notice that i would still like some suspension improvement. Im not against having a very stiff suspension. I really only drive 5 miles to work and 4 miles to school. I don't mind feeling every part of the road. What else was this car made for? I was planning on gettting 600# springs after the sway upgrade. And torsion bars at the same time (must index... gee... fun) I REALLY like the idea of having only three settings on the sway bars. Infinitly adjustable would be overwhelming for me, and i don't need it. If paragon sells fronts for 249$ and rears for 149$ and 89$ for adapter for those 944's w/o a rear sway, maybe ill do it sooner rather than later. I was thinking this was all going to cost more than that.

So what exactly does the drop-link do? and do i need it? or would it be worth it to get one while im down there?

Skip

If you don't already have a rear bar, then you'll need drop links as well. These attach the ends of the bar to the suspension. Consider using the KLA metal bearing units - they are almost half the price of OE rubber pieces.

Also, since yours is an 86, if you'll be using the front 968 M030 bar you'll also need the center bushing holders (size change in 87, uses larger piece).

Good Luck!

JediAgent

Yes, I looked at your site to find out some of the parts needed.
Very interested in buying from you guys thou.

dgz924s

My SIG gives my opinion. Yes if it is affordable go with 968 M030 Bars. The rear drop links from KLA are a huge savings and work well!

But on another note, the aluminum A Arms/Ball Joints are subject to breakage using the 968 bars. I believe there is a Ball joint proceedure to help this problem. I am not certain on this note but I recall some postings on it.
Am I in the ballpark here? Dal

Z-man

All the more reason not to go too firm in the front! Remember, if you go firmer in the front, you will dial in more understeer: exactly why I recommend doing a "+1" type setup in the rear. In other words, upgrade to a turbo front sway bar, and a 968 M030 19mm sway bar in the rear. The 968 19mm bar is a step up from the rear turbo sway, that's why I call it a +1.

Trust me on this: that setup works! Sure, I still have plenty of body lean in my car, but I'd rather have body lean than an ill handling car. And right now, with the stock suspension, 19mm 968 rear sway bar (set to full firm, I might add), my car feels more dialed in. (Add the 245-45-16 rubber at all four corners, and on the track, I actually experience 'crisp turn in!' Now there's a thought! )

IIRC, the 'ball joint proceduire' is the replace the A-arms!

I'm sure I'm confusing the issues for you now...
-Z-man.

Dave

My '86 was originally set up for daily use and the occasional autox, I went with the turbo S sway bars. You should be able to find them with drop links and all the other rear hardware (if you don't have a stock rear bar) and with the front mounts for ~$100-150, buy fresh bushings and your all set for ~$200. This setup will reduce body roll, don't forget that an NA is a little lighter than a turbo (no turbo/WG/IC/plumbing to carry around) so these parts will do a little more for an NA than they do for a turbo. Later, when you upgrade your springs, you will be eliminating more roll.

Charlotte944

Instead of lowering and swapping sway bars, why not go through the front end and replace shocks and bushings?

Things like drop link bushings, inner and outer sway bar bushings, front control arm bushings, caster blocks, ball joint bushings, and new front struts will do wonders for the car's handling characteristics.

I just went through a major front end re-build on my 246K mile '87, and the improvement in handling, ride stability, and the reduction in road noise has been quite dramatic.

The '87 is my second 944 (sold my '84 late last year), so I knew going in what to expect and what things to look for. Originally the car handled OK, but the right front had a noticeable dip, the ride was too loud, the front end dived on braking, the rear squatted on acceleration, and the front end tramlined (wandered) through ruts and other imperfections in the road surface, all of which indicated problems with the suspension.

Despite a bad starter and starter ring gear, and the aforementioned suspension issues, the car was a very good deal for $1800.00, so I bought it with the intention of either rejuvenating it and selling the '84, or parting it out if the repairs were going to be too costly. As it turned out I ended up with two good cars, so I decided to keep the '87 and sell the '84.

If you do decide to lower your car, don't go crazy, and keep the wheel size under 18". Markus Blaszak has some interesting information about front control arm failures on lowerd cars with big wheels and big sway bars: http://www.blaszakprecision.com/Control_Arms.html

HINT #1: Measure the front sway bar diameter BEFORE you order the bushings.

Hint #2: The rear sway bar is easy to see. Look under the rear of the car where the rear control arm is bolted to the spring plate.

Hint #3: Get the car back to "stock trim" before you go chasing "performance" parts. Armed with data as to how the car behaves in stock trim will help you decide on your next course of action.

Hint #4: Determine what the vehicle's primary use will be (daily driver w/occasional DE, daily driver w/frequent DE and or AutoX use, or "track car"), and then tailor the suspension to suit the use.

jabbadeznuts

Why would any year NOT be equiped with a rear sway bar?