Actual Value of 914 2.0
01-01-2009, 08:00 PM
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Actual Value of 914 2.0
I made the mistake of posting a WTB for a excellent condition orange 914 2.0. I received lots of responses. Everybody said pretty much the same thing;..."Mine is not for sale, but if you want to pay me $20,000 plus, I might be willing so sell it". I'm not a charity organization.
What is the actual value of an excellent condition 914 2.0? I mean, if somebody actually wanted to sell it.
Craig
What is the actual value of an excellent condition 914 2.0? I mean, if somebody actually wanted to sell it.
Craig
01-01-2009, 10:41 PM
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About $18.5K. That would be an excellent - original '73 914 2.0. Other years would be close to that. These cars have gone up dramatically in the last 3-5 years. Reference Excellence Magazine - November 2008 edition for a more complete list of price ranges.
Given that Excellence places a '73 914 2.0 in excellent - original condition at $18.5K, the guys contacting you who's cars are NOT for sale and are entertaining offers of $20K are not out of line. Charity organization or not, that is reality. These cars have hit their pace. Watch for them to increase further. Particularly the original 6 cylinders and the LE cars from 74. Once again, original - excellent condition cars... Rat traps will continue to sell for next to nothing.
Mine isn't orange and isn't for sale but I wouldn't even smile for less than $25K and you wouldn't even have my interest until $30K. Even there I would be losing money...
Given that Excellence places a '73 914 2.0 in excellent - original condition at $18.5K, the guys contacting you who's cars are NOT for sale and are entertaining offers of $20K are not out of line. Charity organization or not, that is reality. These cars have hit their pace. Watch for them to increase further. Particularly the original 6 cylinders and the LE cars from 74. Once again, original - excellent condition cars... Rat traps will continue to sell for next to nothing.
Mine isn't orange and isn't for sale but I wouldn't even smile for less than $25K and you wouldn't even have my interest until $30K. Even there I would be losing money...
01-02-2009, 01:34 AM
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You are emotionally attached to your car. I can empathize. I’m emotionally attached to some of mine, but putting the kind of value you do on it is ridiculous. I might as well have asked you to value your wife or a loved one. It’s simply not for sale.
I posted this message to get information from those who are NOT emotionally attached and unrealistic. The fact: I want to buy a 914, from someone who wants to sell one.
What it cost you to restore it is completely irrelevant to its value. Everybody undertaking a restoration knows that going in, or learns that very quickly (read “The Gold Plated Porsche”).
The fact is, these cars are going down like everything else (Homes, Stocks, 1967 Corvettes, etc). I don’t want to hammer anyone. That’s not me. I just want to find one that’s really for sale and not some guy who says…”Yeah, I’ll sell mine for $25,000”.
If somebody out there has a nice orange 914 2.0, and it’s really for sale, I would not be afraid to pay $15K-$18K…The high end of its current value.
01-02-2009, 03:46 AM
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Look, you asked what a 914 is worth. I answered with an expert referenced source. You now think that people who are not selling their cars should STILL sell their car to you for what it is worth and not more. My point is that if something is not for sale and you still want it, you had better reach a little deeper. Please don't put me on the list of guys you could pay more and get the car. Mine isn't for sale at any price. I am not done with it.
I know a guy who owns a nice orange 914 2.0. I will mention your thread. He is a jacka++. You should get along just fine.
I know a guy who owns a nice orange 914 2.0. I will mention your thread. He is a jacka++. You should get along just fine.
01-02-2009, 12:37 PM
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What I think people forget is that cars are never sold. They're bought.
If you get a seller that is willing to sell their car at a price that is felt to be acceptable by someone in the marketplace, you get a sale. But if all the cars on offer are to the buyer 'overpriced', then there is no sale. Fair enough, but on the other hand, the buyer doesn't ever get the chance to purchase and enjoy the car he really wants either. Classic supply/demand stuff.
People get hung up on numbers. Sellers sometimes forget the market doesn't care about what they have into their cars. Buyers sometimes forget that the ideal car for them is sitting right in front of them, and they let it slip away not because they can't afford it, but because of what they've been led to believe from others it should be worth (or what they might purchase something identical for).
But is that identical car for cheaper actually out there? And how much is your time worth to hunt down that next 'perfect' car? The answer to that question is not the same for everybody. But if you're only a couple $K apart ($20K asking vs. your $18K range), it sounds like a deal is only a short negotiation away.
Good luck in your search. Hope you can find that perfect car for the perfect price you and the seller can agree on.
If you get a seller that is willing to sell their car at a price that is felt to be acceptable by someone in the marketplace, you get a sale. But if all the cars on offer are to the buyer 'overpriced', then there is no sale. Fair enough, but on the other hand, the buyer doesn't ever get the chance to purchase and enjoy the car he really wants either. Classic supply/demand stuff.
People get hung up on numbers. Sellers sometimes forget the market doesn't care about what they have into their cars. Buyers sometimes forget that the ideal car for them is sitting right in front of them, and they let it slip away not because they can't afford it, but because of what they've been led to believe from others it should be worth (or what they might purchase something identical for).
But is that identical car for cheaper actually out there? And how much is your time worth to hunt down that next 'perfect' car? The answer to that question is not the same for everybody. But if you're only a couple $K apart ($20K asking vs. your $18K range), it sounds like a deal is only a short negotiation away.
Good luck in your search. Hope you can find that perfect car for the perfect price you and the seller can agree on.
01-02-2009, 03:35 PM
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I don't need a lesson in supply economics. I'm a founding principal in an investment banking firm, focused on M&A. I just needed to know where to be in order to filter out the cars that are for sale from those that are not. Many of the responses I've gotten are social calls, and guys wanting to talk about their cool cars. I enjoy the talk, and validate their self-installed valuations.
01-02-2009, 03:44 PM
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What I think people forget is that cars are never sold. They're bought.
If you get a seller that is willing to sell their car at a price that is felt to be acceptable by someone in the marketplace, you get a sale. But if all the cars on offer are to the buyer 'overpriced', then there is no sale. Fair enough, but on the other hand, the buyer doesn't ever get the chance to purchase and enjoy the car he really wants either. Classic supply/demand stuff.
People get hung up on numbers. Sellers sometimes forget the market doesn't care about what they have into their cars. Buyers sometimes forget that the ideal car for them is sitting right in front of them, and they let it slip away not because they can't afford it, but because of what they've been led to believe from others it should be worth (or what they might purchase something identical for).
But is that identical car for cheaper actually out there? And how much is your time worth to hunt down that next 'perfect' car? The answer to that question is not the same for everybody. But if you're only a couple $K apart ($20K asking vs. your $18K range), it sounds like a deal is only a short negotiation away.
Good luck in your search. Hope you can find that perfect car for the perfect price you and the seller can agree on.
If you get a seller that is willing to sell their car at a price that is felt to be acceptable by someone in the marketplace, you get a sale. But if all the cars on offer are to the buyer 'overpriced', then there is no sale. Fair enough, but on the other hand, the buyer doesn't ever get the chance to purchase and enjoy the car he really wants either. Classic supply/demand stuff.
People get hung up on numbers. Sellers sometimes forget the market doesn't care about what they have into their cars. Buyers sometimes forget that the ideal car for them is sitting right in front of them, and they let it slip away not because they can't afford it, but because of what they've been led to believe from others it should be worth (or what they might purchase something identical for).
But is that identical car for cheaper actually out there? And how much is your time worth to hunt down that next 'perfect' car? The answer to that question is not the same for everybody. But if you're only a couple $K apart ($20K asking vs. your $18K range), it sounds like a deal is only a short negotiation away.
Good luck in your search. Hope you can find that perfect car for the perfect price you and the seller can agree on.
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01-02-2009, 05:25 PM
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Craig T, by "excellent condition" what is it you are actually looking for, because I think theirin lies some issues.
100pt concours car, original, never restored?
100pt concours car that is completely restored?
A very nice, rust free "original" but tastefully updated, say, with updated torsion bars and sways?
A great "driver"?
A 1970 1.7 with a transplanted 2.0L?
As mentioned, the high watermark is the '73 2.0, then the '74 2.0. Impact bumper cars tend to bring less (mich like "mid year" 911s). Early cars a bit less still.
However, condition is everything. A perfect '71 1.7 to me is just as nice as a 2.0 liter car.
Given the current market, I would take about 30% off the excellence numbers for a "fair value".
There has been what appears a very nice '73 2.0 in the classifieds here.. Asking around $13K IIRC.
Jay Gratton (sp?) had up for sale a beautifull '73 1.7 that showed well at the Parade this year. Not sure what he's asking though.
As the cars get older and more rare, condition has become more important than engine size. Sure a 2.0 is a nice one to have.. but if I offered you a 356 speedster would you throw away a 1500 because its not a 1600?
100pt concours car, original, never restored?
100pt concours car that is completely restored?
A very nice, rust free "original" but tastefully updated, say, with updated torsion bars and sways?
A great "driver"?
A 1970 1.7 with a transplanted 2.0L?
As mentioned, the high watermark is the '73 2.0, then the '74 2.0. Impact bumper cars tend to bring less (mich like "mid year" 911s). Early cars a bit less still.
However, condition is everything. A perfect '71 1.7 to me is just as nice as a 2.0 liter car.
Given the current market, I would take about 30% off the excellence numbers for a "fair value".
There has been what appears a very nice '73 2.0 in the classifieds here.. Asking around $13K IIRC.
Jay Gratton (sp?) had up for sale a beautifull '73 1.7 that showed well at the Parade this year. Not sure what he's asking though.
As the cars get older and more rare, condition has become more important than engine size. Sure a 2.0 is a nice one to have.. but if I offered you a 356 speedster would you throw away a 1500 because its not a 1600?
01-02-2009, 08:39 PM
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Craig T, by "excellent condition" what is it you are actually looking for, because I think theirin lies some issues.
100pt concours car, original, never restored?
100pt concours car that is completely restored?
A very nice, rust free "original" but tastefully updated, say, with updated torsion bars and sways?
A great "driver"?
A 1970 1.7 with a transplanted 2.0L?
As mentioned, the high watermark is the '73 2.0, then the '74 2.0. Impact bumper cars tend to bring less (mich like "mid year" 911s). Early cars a bit less still.
However, condition is everything. A perfect '71 1.7 to me is just as nice as a 2.0 liter car.
Given the current market, I would take about 30% off the excellence numbers for a "fair value".
There has been what appears a very nice '73 2.0 in the classifieds here.. Asking around $13K IIRC.
Jay Gratton (sp?) had up for sale a beautifull '73 1.7 that showed well at the Parade this year. Not sure what he's asking though.
As the cars get older and more rare, condition has become more important than engine size. Sure a 2.0 is a nice one to have.. but if I offered you a 356 speedster would you throw away a 1500 because its not a 1600?
100pt concours car, original, never restored?
100pt concours car that is completely restored?
A very nice, rust free "original" but tastefully updated, say, with updated torsion bars and sways?
A great "driver"?
A 1970 1.7 with a transplanted 2.0L?
As mentioned, the high watermark is the '73 2.0, then the '74 2.0. Impact bumper cars tend to bring less (mich like "mid year" 911s). Early cars a bit less still.
However, condition is everything. A perfect '71 1.7 to me is just as nice as a 2.0 liter car.
Given the current market, I would take about 30% off the excellence numbers for a "fair value".
There has been what appears a very nice '73 2.0 in the classifieds here.. Asking around $13K IIRC.
Jay Gratton (sp?) had up for sale a beautifull '73 1.7 that showed well at the Parade this year. Not sure what he's asking though.
As the cars get older and more rare, condition has become more important than engine size. Sure a 2.0 is a nice one to have.. but if I offered you a 356 speedster would you throw away a 1500 because its not a 1600?
I want this car as a collector. I will drive it, but rarely. I want a car as close to bone-stock as possible. I suppose a recently restored car in its original form would be my first pick.
I do believe, after the 914-6, that the 2.0 will prove the best long term investment, just as mid-year Corvettes are worth more with a 427 over a 327. But, your point about the 356 is a good one. If I found a restored Phoenix Red 1.7 I certainly would consider it.
01-02-2009, 10:10 PM
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Good points by many. My '71 914 has all OEM Porsche 914-6 suspension, brakes etc I put on over 20 years ago when prices weren't so bad- also has a highly modded 4 cylinder engine and a sideshifter. I've owned it since new and my kids will drive it when I'm long gone- wouldn't sell it for anything, talk about an emotional attachment. My '73 2.0 is all original but needs a complete going over and will be a project with my boys over the next decade or so...
A rustfree body is the most important- engines are easy to replace or rebuild. Matching numbers are kind of silly on a 914 unless you're some kind of PCA concours junkie.
There are low mileage super clean 914's out there- 15-18K doesn't seem unreasonable. What else can you buy for that???
A rustfree body is the most important- engines are easy to replace or rebuild. Matching numbers are kind of silly on a 914 unless you're some kind of PCA concours junkie.
There are low mileage super clean 914's out there- 15-18K doesn't seem unreasonable. What else can you buy for that???
01-02-2009, 10:25 PM
#11
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Sloan's got what he says is a 914-6 for 50k.
www.sloancars.com
You might want to pick up a copy of Excellence magazine. They often do a price analysis of 914s.
www.sloancars.com
You might want to pick up a copy of Excellence magazine. They often do a price analysis of 914s.
01-04-2009, 04:34 PM
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Heres one thats supposed to be in concours condition for $18.5k. Supposedly won the Porsche Concours d'Elegance.
http://classiccars.com/Classifieds/L...CE800B11&cs=11
You can find decent ones quite easily for a fraction of that. Why not get one in good condition and do some work on it? I saw a great example a few weeks ago. Car had 67k original miles, and the guy was asking under $7k (if memory serves). Looked good from the pics. I tried to get a friend to go look at it, but no luck.
http://classiccars.com/Classifieds/L...CE800B11&cs=11
You can find decent ones quite easily for a fraction of that. Why not get one in good condition and do some work on it? I saw a great example a few weeks ago. Car had 67k original miles, and the guy was asking under $7k (if memory serves). Looked good from the pics. I tried to get a friend to go look at it, but no luck.
Last edited by flatspin; 01-04-2009 at 07:22 PM.
01-04-2009, 06:05 PM
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If that was everything he said it was 7K would be a great price- as long as you took off that god-awful rear spoiler and hoped they didn't drill any holes to put it on!!!
01-04-2009, 07:38 PM
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Good points by many. My '71 914 has all OEM Porsche 914-6 suspension, brakes etc I put on over 20 years ago when prices weren't so bad- also has a highly modded 4 cylinder engine and a sideshifter. I've owned it since new and my kids will drive it when I'm long gone- wouldn't sell it for anything, talk about an emotional attachment. My '73 2.0 is all original but needs a complete going over and will be a project with my boys over the next decade or so...
A rustfree body is the most important- engines are easy to replace or rebuild. Matching numbers are kind of silly on a 914 unless you're some kind of PCA concours junkie.
There are low mileage super clean 914's out there- 15-18K doesn't seem unreasonable. What else can you buy for that???
A rustfree body is the most important- engines are easy to replace or rebuild. Matching numbers are kind of silly on a 914 unless you're some kind of PCA concours junkie.
There are low mileage super clean 914's out there- 15-18K doesn't seem unreasonable. What else can you buy for that???
