Turbolag11

Thanks guys. I'll look around and see what I can find.

What are your opinions on the 90s and mid 90s 911s ?

PelicanParts.com

911, 964 & 993 all great cars but around these parts, they tend to prefer the -'89 cars.

Amber Gramps

Google Bosch Hammer

Are you looking for public status symbol or personal satisfaction in your 911? I don't give a rat what others think when I'm past redline in second gear.

If you want raw pleasure and stimulation of body and soul go '87-'89. If you want a girl car thet gets noticed then go later.....and the newest you can afford. And by girl car I mean water cooled sissy bucket.

Turbolag11

Thanks man.

Hahahah. Thanks for the tip. I've been checking local craigslist for any. They have one or two, but they are carbiolets. I really want a hard top.

What do you guys think a good price for a good shape 87-89 is ?

How feasable is it to drive it on an almost daily basis.... except for rain and stuff like that ?

I read in another thread above this one that they are appreciating ! So I would feel comfortable knowing that if I guy it now and decide to sell it in a couple years I can get my same price or possibly more ?

I've been trying to read up on google and forums on driveability of them. But would love to hear everyone's opinion on an 87-89 as an almost daily.

Amber Gramps

The only problems you will face daily driving it will be the heavy clutch and the poor to none existent A/C. Once you are past that you are good to go. As far as price they are ranging from $18-25K here in SoCal. We see ads all the time for less and for more, but I would not want to venture into either territory. Find a good, clean, solid, driver that hasn't been molested and has been with the current owner for a while.

Turbolag11

Thanks man. That's not bad at all.

I daily drive my motorcycle right now so the air condition is controlled by the traffic. Haha

As long as there are no really really expensive repairs that could happen that could cost me $10,000.

Dr Mitch

I've also been debating which 911 - 3.2 vs 964. (Would prefer a 993, but out of my price point)
Would be looking for a daily driver, and I'm the type who would try to drive it all year round! Short commute to work, plowed roads - can avoid salty highways in winter
Airbags are a nice piece of mind feature, but I'm a bit of a purist and like to (try to) tinker a bit on my own, so I'm heavily leaning towards a 911 3.2 - have found a '86 in amazing condition with LSD - over 400km - is a daily driver and well maintained, the other is a '87 in excellent cosmetic and mechanical condition - interior showing it's age a bit - both priced close together.
'87 is a red carrera - can't go wrong!
'86 white targa with red interior - looks quite nice!
There is a beautiful 964 Carrera 4 locally for sale as well a bit more $$ though...
Tough decisions!

Turbolag11

Any photos??

PushingMyLuck

Can someone explain the hate towards water cooled cars?

Is the hate directed at actual negative side effects of water cooling, or is water cooling just a proxy for other less desirable aspects of cars from that newer era? (For example, let's assume water cooled cars go slower. So, are people here actually trying to say they hate slower cars? But just saying they hate "water cooled cars". Or do they hate the actual water cooling? Like if the water cooled car was faster, would they still hate it? ie: Do they hate the slowness of the new car (or whatever proxy criterion) or the literal water cooling itself?

If it's literally the water cooling that people hate, why is that? What is so bad about cooling off the engine? Do cooler motors run poorly?

Or, if water cooling is just a proxy for other actual negative traits, (like speed or reliability) and not the actual water cooling itself, then what are those traits? What do people hate so much about the water-cooled era? Power brakes? Steering? Airbags? ABS?
Why exactly are airbags bad? If you drove head first into a tree, I think you'd feel differently about airbags. Why are anti-lock brakes so bad? If you slid off the road in snow, maybe ABS would have helped you. Can anyone come up with empircal data that shows why ABS is bad? Or airbags?

Or, is this a "macho" thing? Like, I don't need no sissy anti-lock brakes? Seems kind of childish, frankly. Or, do people think the cars are too complex to work on? That doesn't make sense, b/c ABS, airbags, PS are all basic components that be swapped out like any other part.

WPOZZZ

I've had a 996 and it was a great car, but it was so easy to drive, a caveman could do it. The 996 is quick and handles extremely well, but it is not engaging to drive. It does not involve the driver as much as a 911 does. Imagine a fast Toyota that handled well. The 911 requires you to be attentive at all times while driving her.

PushingMyLuck

Driving a Model-T is probably even more "engaging" then.
Some people might find what you're saying a benefit of the 996.
Don't real racecar drivers all use paddle shifters these days?

Dr Mitch

'87:


'86:

Turbolag11

Thanks for sharing Dr Mitch.

Those are beautiful.

If I found one of those locally I definitely be interested.

Another concern I wanted to address, and I posted this on the Subaru forum is this:

I'm skeptical to buy a new car because I'm not sure about build quality and reliability. I've been reading on different forums and online that multiple brands have had catastrophic failures.

I know its mechanical and anything can happen, but the cars from the 80s and 90s seem to be built tougher than cars now.

Is it just me or does anyone else feel this way ?

PushingMyLuck

This is totally incorrect. Cars are more reliable than ever. You need to check the studies and data, not anecdotes from internet forums.

“In 2013, overall vehicle dependability averages 126 PP100–a five percent improvement from the 2012 average of 132 PP100–and is the lowest problem count since the inception of the study in 1989.”

http://www.aei-ideas.org/2013/02/whe...n-ever-before/

Here is what you're experiencing: One guy with a blown head gasket at 60k posts on the internet, and thousands of people read it, and start to think ALL cars get blown head gaskets. This is how urban legends start.

Do you remember the 1980s? Go for a half hour drive, and you would see several cars on the side of the road. Today, you can go for a year and not see a broken down car. Cars used to be sold or thrown out and "expired" at 100k. Today, cars still run like new at 100k. There is simply no comparision to how bulletproof today's cars are compared to the cars of the past.

Dr Mitch

My "issue" with some of todays cars is the complexity to many of the electronics and computer systems on board. So while there are fewer catastrophic problems overall, there is more variety of problems compared to older cars. WIth the larger variety of problems, yeah, you get WAY more info on the internet about them. I'd be curious to see what Rennlist posts would be like if we had it back in the 70's and 80's...