Philadelphia area 911 owners
12-27-2002, 03:35 PM
#1
Burning Brakes
Thread Starter
Philadelphia area 911 owners
Hiya guys,
My father and I are now seriously looking for a "joint venture" (of sorts) SC or 3.2. Ill skip the story about how we cant seem to find any around here, but my problem lies in that I havent driven a 911 in about 4 years.
Is there anyone in the area that would be willing to let me take a look at their car and show me what I should be looking for/give out some tips when I purchase? I feel bad "testing" some cars I know I wont buy just to see what feels/smells/looks/sounds "right" mechanically and cosmetically (hate tire kickers) so if there is anyone around here that wouldnt mind enlightening a waterpumper about a first 911 purchase, I would be very appreciative.
Thanks!
My father and I are now seriously looking for a "joint venture" (of sorts) SC or 3.2. Ill skip the story about how we cant seem to find any around here, but my problem lies in that I havent driven a 911 in about 4 years.
Is there anyone in the area that would be willing to let me take a look at their car and show me what I should be looking for/give out some tips when I purchase? I feel bad "testing" some cars I know I wont buy just to see what feels/smells/looks/sounds "right" mechanically and cosmetically (hate tire kickers) so if there is anyone around here that wouldnt mind enlightening a waterpumper about a first 911 purchase, I would be very appreciative.
Thanks!
12-28-2002, 09:17 AM
#2
Advanced
Join Date: Jun 2002
Location: Wynnewood, PA
Posts: 88
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Stuttgart,
There are several good books on buying used 911s that will tell you what to look for in each year and model. Check the catalogs from Performance, Tweeks, Pelican, etc. Also, there's been a number of threads on this board about common problems, prices to fix, etc. Remember Bruce Anderson's rule of thumb, buy the newest latest model you can afford.
That said, book due diligence is one thing. I agree with you that there's no substitute for a trained set of eyes and ears. You're absolutely right to want someone to look over and listen to cars with you. If you've been around Porsches for a while, you'll probably look at few cars and know in your gut right away they're not right. One very nice '86 I looked at ran beautifully and was obviously a garage queen, but had had a new clutch put in after 40K miles. Maybe I passed up a good car, but it was bad enough mojo about the way the car had probably been driven that I steered away (I also wanted the G50 tranny of '87-'89).
When I found what I thought was the right car, I asked a buddy of mine who's a 3.2 guru to go with me to see and drive it. We went over the car extensively, and he was able to point out many very favorable aspects about the maintenance and condition of the car. He's been in the PCA here for a long time and knew the seller. I violated a cardinal rule in not getting my own PPI - the owner had done it the month previously and you could see, for example evidence that the valve adjustments were done by the new gaskets. I relied on it, and so far, fortune has smiled upon me. I've had no problems with the car and it has not leaked one drop of fluid on the floor of my garage. Wish I could say that about my wife's POS Chrysler minivan.
Whether you go SC or 3.2 Carrera depends on a variety of factors including cost and what you want to do with the car - daily driver, track car, weekend fun/project car, etc. Have fun looking and don't be in a hurry. It's probably a good time to be in the market - its seems that prices are down across all the models. You might even find you could reach up for a 964 or 993. But IMHO, the 3.2 is the way to go. There's a certain sound to the engine and feel of the steering that makes driving it so exhilirating.
Good luck!
<img src="graemlins/beerchug.gif" border="0" alt="[cheers]" />
There are several good books on buying used 911s that will tell you what to look for in each year and model. Check the catalogs from Performance, Tweeks, Pelican, etc. Also, there's been a number of threads on this board about common problems, prices to fix, etc. Remember Bruce Anderson's rule of thumb, buy the newest latest model you can afford.
That said, book due diligence is one thing. I agree with you that there's no substitute for a trained set of eyes and ears. You're absolutely right to want someone to look over and listen to cars with you. If you've been around Porsches for a while, you'll probably look at few cars and know in your gut right away they're not right. One very nice '86 I looked at ran beautifully and was obviously a garage queen, but had had a new clutch put in after 40K miles. Maybe I passed up a good car, but it was bad enough mojo about the way the car had probably been driven that I steered away (I also wanted the G50 tranny of '87-'89).
When I found what I thought was the right car, I asked a buddy of mine who's a 3.2 guru to go with me to see and drive it. We went over the car extensively, and he was able to point out many very favorable aspects about the maintenance and condition of the car. He's been in the PCA here for a long time and knew the seller. I violated a cardinal rule in not getting my own PPI - the owner had done it the month previously and you could see, for example evidence that the valve adjustments were done by the new gaskets. I relied on it, and so far, fortune has smiled upon me. I've had no problems with the car and it has not leaked one drop of fluid on the floor of my garage. Wish I could say that about my wife's POS Chrysler minivan.
Whether you go SC or 3.2 Carrera depends on a variety of factors including cost and what you want to do with the car - daily driver, track car, weekend fun/project car, etc. Have fun looking and don't be in a hurry. It's probably a good time to be in the market - its seems that prices are down across all the models. You might even find you could reach up for a 964 or 993. But IMHO, the 3.2 is the way to go. There's a certain sound to the engine and feel of the steering that makes driving it so exhilirating.
Good luck!
<img src="graemlins/beerchug.gif" border="0" alt="[cheers]" />
12-28-2002, 02:37 PM
#3
Advanced
Join Date: Sep 2002
Location: City of Brotherly Love
Posts: 66
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Stuttgard,
I own an SC since 1994 and have done all the work including engine/trans rebuilt. I had dismantled the car for the total paint job and fully enjoyed all these activities. Would I would do it again? Yes.
I'll be glad to share with you some experience you'll probably want to know before going for an SC. Good luck.....
I own an SC since 1994 and have done all the work including engine/trans rebuilt. I had dismantled the car for the total paint job and fully enjoyed all these activities. Would I would do it again? Yes.
I'll be glad to share with you some experience you'll probably want to know before going for an SC. Good luck.....
12-29-2002, 02:32 AM
#4
Burning Brakes
Thread Starter
Thanks for the responses. 
Jeff, Ive read just about every major book regarding the cars, and even went to so far as to purchase repair and technical books already (101 Projects, 911 Performance Handbook, etc etc). Im confident that I have a rudimentary book knowledge of the cars, but little first hand experience.
Ive driven numerous examples from 2.4's to 3.2's during my initial search years ago, but as I said, its been awhile since Ive even been in one. Im not really considering a 964 because of the engine horror stories I read/hear about and a 993 is out of my price range. In addition, Im reluctant to drive a 3.6 for fear of being spoiled.
In any event, Im not rushing the search, because I want to find THE car, and hell, the search is half the fun anyway.
Boy-T - Norristown, eh? A close lister - Im over in Lansdale, bout 15 minutes away. Im glad to hear you had good experiences doing your own work on the car, thats one of the other reasons Im gravitating toward an earlier car - Id like to be able to do most of the work with my father and the SC's and 3.2's seem to be the 911's to dive into in this respect.
Ill probably shoot you both a few PM's containing questions as my search narrows down - your help is greatly appreciated.
Jeff, Ive read just about every major book regarding the cars, and even went to so far as to purchase repair and technical books already (101 Projects, 911 Performance Handbook, etc etc). Im confident that I have a rudimentary book knowledge of the cars, but little first hand experience.
Ive driven numerous examples from 2.4's to 3.2's during my initial search years ago, but as I said, its been awhile since Ive even been in one. Im not really considering a 964 because of the engine horror stories I read/hear about and a 993 is out of my price range. In addition, Im reluctant to drive a 3.6 for fear of being spoiled.
In any event, Im not rushing the search, because I want to find THE car, and hell, the search is half the fun anyway.Boy-T - Norristown, eh? A close lister - Im over in Lansdale, bout 15 minutes away. Im glad to hear you had good experiences doing your own work on the car, thats one of the other reasons Im gravitating toward an earlier car - Id like to be able to do most of the work with my father and the SC's and 3.2's seem to be the 911's to dive into in this respect.
Ill probably shoot you both a few PM's containing questions as my search narrows down - your help is greatly appreciated.
12-29-2002, 12:42 PM
#5
Stutt, Check out your local PCA region. They're nuts about these cars and they love to talk about them. I don't personally know anyone that is more honest or knowlegable than Mike Hartman in Lewistown, about 2 hours west of you. Check out the swap meet in Hershey this spring. I learned a bunch there. Good Luck! -------------------------------- Brian Howe '86 944 '81 911SC Targa
12-30-2002, 08:29 AM
#6
Advanced
Join Date: Jan 2002
Location: Philly
Posts: 50
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Just make sure that anything your interested in buying should have be looked over by an experianced porsche mechanic. also any one who wouldn't want the car looked over would be some one who is hiding something so be careful!!
12-31-2002, 12:46 PM
#7
Stutt,
Check out Riesentoter's (the local PCA club)website - <a href="http://www.rtr-pca.org" target="_blank">www.rtr-pca.org</a> for their '03 meeting schedule. A good place to start locally.
Check out Riesentoter's (the local PCA club)website - <a href="http://www.rtr-pca.org" target="_blank">www.rtr-pca.org</a> for their '03 meeting schedule. A good place to start locally.
Trending Topics
12-31-2002, 06:47 PM
#8
Burning Brakes
Thread Starter
I am an RTR member - but I never really went to meetings religiously because there seems to be a very strong "anti-water" feeling IMO. 
Either way, Der Gasser usually has some nice cars (local region magazine) but for some reason I havent recieved the latest issue yet.
Thanks!
Either way, Der Gasser usually has some nice cars (local region magazine) but for some reason I havent recieved the latest issue yet.
Thanks!
01-01-2003, 05:43 PM
#9
Stutt,
Riesentoter combines the Nov & Dec issues of 'der Gasser'...the next issue will be out around the 3rd week of January.
RE: your comment that the RTR folks seem to (pardon the pun *G*)"harbor" anti-water feelings, in the 2 years I've attended their meetings, I haven't picked up on that at all - there are 944's and 968's regularly doing the RTR DE events. If you are an employee of the Phila Suburban Water Company, I can appreciate your sensitivity to the H2O issue *G*, especially since it doesn't pertain to the SC or Carrera.
Riesentoter combines the Nov & Dec issues of 'der Gasser'...the next issue will be out around the 3rd week of January.
RE: your comment that the RTR folks seem to (pardon the pun *G*)"harbor" anti-water feelings, in the 2 years I've attended their meetings, I haven't picked up on that at all - there are 944's and 968's regularly doing the RTR DE events. If you are an employee of the Phila Suburban Water Company, I can appreciate your sensitivity to the H2O issue *G*, especially since it doesn't pertain to the SC or Carrera.
01-01-2003, 07:42 PM
#10
Racer
Join Date: Aug 2002
Posts: 277
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
stuttgart and john, i would love to meet up with you boys sometime in the future and ogle your cars. i am literally on the pa/de border.
jeff, was that 86 911 at holt motorsports? silver with black interior?
jeff, was that 86 911 at holt motorsports? silver with black interior?
01-01-2003, 08:07 PM
#11
Stuttgart951:
You posted:
[quote] I'm not really considering a 964 because of the engine horror stories I read/hear about and a 993 is out of my price range. In addition, I'm reluctant to drive a 3.6 for fear of being spoiled. <hr></blockquote>
The "engine horror stories" you mention in your post above is somewhat incorrect and misleading. The early 964's ('89 - '91) can have leaking engines in the cylinder to head region, but FEW engines actually have had this problem. Most that had the problem were updated/fixed by Porsche while the cars were still under warranty. Others were fixed by prior owners years ago and many just do not have this problem and won't have this problem.
I encourage you to try out a 964 while you search for your next 911. There are some nice bargin's out there right now and you get a lot of performance from the 3.6 motor. The torque from the 3.6 motor is extremely addicting and the 964's, while being more complex, are generally very reliable.
Good luck,
Jay
<a href="http://www.jays911.com" target="_blank">90 964</a>
You posted:
[quote] I'm not really considering a 964 because of the engine horror stories I read/hear about and a 993 is out of my price range. In addition, I'm reluctant to drive a 3.6 for fear of being spoiled. <hr></blockquote>
The "engine horror stories" you mention in your post above is somewhat incorrect and misleading. The early 964's ('89 - '91) can have leaking engines in the cylinder to head region, but FEW engines actually have had this problem. Most that had the problem were updated/fixed by Porsche while the cars were still under warranty. Others were fixed by prior owners years ago and many just do not have this problem and won't have this problem.
I encourage you to try out a 964 while you search for your next 911. There are some nice bargin's out there right now and you get a lot of performance from the 3.6 motor. The torque from the 3.6 motor is extremely addicting and the 964's, while being more complex, are generally very reliable.
Good luck,
Jay
<a href="http://www.jays911.com" target="_blank">90 964</a>
01-01-2003, 09:20 PM
#12
Pro
Join Date: Jun 2001
Location: Milton, MA
Posts: 579
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
[quote]Originally posted by Stuttgart951:
<strong>A close lister - Im over in Lansdale, bout 15 minutes away. </strong><hr></blockquote>
I went to North Penn. Lived in North Wales for 15 years and my 993 will be getting redone at my brothers shop (in North Wales), and then up to Maxatony for a clutch and engine freshening. You might want to give John Butz a call (610)683-5777 he's a great guy and really dialed in in the Allentown area.
Tell him some guy from Boston sent you
<strong>A close lister - Im over in Lansdale, bout 15 minutes away.
</strong><hr></blockquote>I went to North Penn. Lived in North Wales for 15 years and my 993 will be getting redone at my brothers shop (in North Wales), and then up to Maxatony for a clutch and engine freshening. You might want to give John Butz a call (610)683-5777 he's a great guy and really dialed in in the Allentown area.
Tell him some guy from Boston sent you
01-03-2003, 02:50 PM
#13
Advanced
Join Date: Jun 2002
Location: Wynnewood, PA
Posts: 88
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
[quote]jeff, was that 86 911 at holt motorsports? silver with black interior?[/QB]<hr></blockquote>
It was at Don Rosen Porsche/Audi, guards red cab with spoilers. Nice guy there named Eliot something, but prices are outrageous IMO. They wanted $32K after putting the new clutch in and weren't going to move off that price.
It was at Don Rosen Porsche/Audi, guards red cab with spoilers. Nice guy there named Eliot something, but prices are outrageous IMO. They wanted $32K after putting the new clutch in and weren't going to move off that price.
01-03-2003, 04:55 PM
#14
Addict
Rennlist Member
Rennlist Member
Join Date: Aug 2001
Location: camp hill, pa
Posts: 32
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
[quote]Originally posted by Porschephanatic:
<strong> I don't personally know anyone that is more honest or knowlegable than Mike Hartman in Lewistown, about 2 hours west of you. </strong><hr></blockquote>
I'll second the opinion on Mike Hartman in Lewistown. Probably the most honest dealership owner(or person for that matter) I've ever dealt with. Knowledgable of Porsche, Ferrari and Jaguar. The URL for his business is vansmotors.com.
<strong> I don't personally know anyone that is more honest or knowlegable than Mike Hartman in Lewistown, about 2 hours west of you. </strong><hr></blockquote>
I'll second the opinion on Mike Hartman in Lewistown. Probably the most honest dealership owner(or person for that matter) I've ever dealt with. Knowledgable of Porsche, Ferrari and Jaguar. The URL for his business is vansmotors.com.
