Mark J

Hi all,

Am after some advice: i am currently a 964 C4 owner, had it for 4 years, but am hankering for an older model 911 with just rear drive, as it should be. Have found one i quite like with 150k miles on it on an 85' plate.

What sort of condition should i expect it to be in and what things am i likely to need to spend money on to sort? Should i expect it to have had a top end rebuild by now etc ? Would the suspension need a complete overhaul?...probably going to put a fast road/race suspension on it anyway.
Is corrosion going to be a big issue? or could it be sorted bit by bit?

What gearbox would be on the 85 uk model? Any worries there? Clutch etc?

If engine was seeming a bit long in the tooth with 150k on it, what sort of costs would i be looking at to breathe new life into it etc

Any useful advice much appreciated. Not afraid to spend a bit of money on it but dont want to buy a wallet drain thats going to cost me thousands and thousands as would just be false economy. I intend to use it for potential daily drive but also a track day fun car and some euro touring thrown in for good measure.

ricster

Hi MarkJ,
Your there I am here...I cant correctly give you condition of a 150k mile car without seeing it myself. Take a look at the records..see if anything in the suspension has been done already. To make a motor new (rebuild) can cost you 12-15k. Suspension can cost 3-5k to put right etc. Again without seeing the car..can determine..if you like the car..and hammer the right deal in your mind..go for it.

theiceman

Have you considered ripping out the front diff and converting yours to 2 wheel drive . I have heard this is quite common for 964 C4's as the front diff is extremely complex and expemsive to fix. Then you can retain the 3.6 power and chasis with the two wheel drive .. plus it's a car you know so there are no surpises . i tought there was an article in excellence a couple of years back whee they did that with a 964 C4...

Mark J

thanks for the replies guys. I wasnt after specific info on the actual car i am looking at, it was more a general enquiry as to what i should be expecting from a car with that mileage and age on it, ie should it have had a top end rebuild by 150k miles? will it feel tired with that many miles (my 964 only has 88k on it) will there be guaranteed rust problems in certain areas? will the exhaust system be shot and need replacing or would that have been done already? etc etc.

GothingNC

Iceman,

It is a lot more complex to convert to 2WD the entire gear box has to be replaced as the system will not operate properly without the front axles hooked up.

From another post on RL

The "Sputnik" 4WD system in the 964s relies on longitudinal and lateral sensors (hidden under the center console) as well as the ABS sensors to detect wheel slippage and direction of travel. From these inputs the PDAS brain is able to shuffle the power between the diffs accordingly.

As mentioned earlier (and unlike in the 993s), simply disconnecting the front drive shaft will not work because of the inherent design of the diffs (I know I'm oversimplifying this). A working 2WD conversion on a C4 requires a G50/xx, and chucking the G64.

John

racer

With 150K miles, I would want a lot of records for big ticket items like Clutch, Top end work, maybe suspension (shocks, bushings) etc. I figure a car is pretty worn by 100K miles and then takes considerable time or money to continually refresh. I imagine several with that mileage will be quite worn out. Seats often have tears.. headliners can be sagging..

As they used to say "they are all $20K(usd) cars.. spend it up front on a nice car or spend it fixing one up"

Mark J

cheers Racer, thats the kind of info i am looking for and pretty much mirrors my own thoughts.
Am wondering if i am in for a rude culture shock going from my 'still fresh' feeling 88k 1990 964 to a 5 year older, almost double the mileage car?
Im guessing the safe bet would be to go for a full PPI / leakdown test ? not that ive ever needed/used one for all my sportscar purchases over 20 years. Ive never owned something with that kind of mileage on it, but seems almost the norm for most carreras of the 80's vintage, hence my fears of getting something feeling tired. Was hoping you guys with that sort of mileage would assuage my fears but not many responses to this thread.

Less majot stuff llike interior wear or suspension sagging is less of an issue as i plan to run new suspension pack and fit front recaros, RS carpet etc, its more the mechanical and body i am concerned with.

Alpine 88

Mark, two observations. First, the numbers in ricster's post above are USD, not GBP, but you probably knew that. Second, these cars are made to be driven long and hard. I wouldn't expect a 150kmile car to feel tired unless it has been abused or poorly maintained. Others know better than me about engine issues, but there my impression is that it's pretty hit or miss--some might require major work by then, others not, and may be hard to predict.

oldskewel

I have a 1985 Cabriolet with ~130k miles. I've owned and self-maintained it now for ~13 years and ~35k miles. PO had it for ~10k miles before that. Unknown maintenance before that other than the booklet with stamps.

I swear this car seems like it's mechanically new other than possibly the transmission/clutch. So, you may get lucky with another older car as well. They are definitely out there, even with higher miles. One major factor of course is maintenance - proactive or reactive.

Being garaged is another factor. I replaced the seat covers with original-looking leather ones from Autos Int'l - probably at some point before I bought it, it was regularly parked outside with the top down. I now also have a full tonneau cover so even when I'm out, it is protected when parked or driving.

The oil consumption issue seems to be hit or miss, and difficult to check with PPI. I got lucky, and have very little consumption (maybe 0.5 liters/1000 miles). I've looked all around and under the engine, trying to see what might need replacing, and it all looks as good and solid as new. Pretty amazing.

But if I were to buy a new car and was not locked in on a sweet '85 already, I'd look for an 87-89 with the G50 transmission. The 915 has not caused any problems, but I don't know how long my luck will last.

Specifically to your questions:
should it have had a top end rebuild by 150k miles? No. Seems some of these engines have the valve guide problems and some don't. Oil consumption is the indicator.

will it feel tired with that many miles (my 964 only has 88k on it)? Should not. I'm planning on getting 300k+ out of this one if I live that long.

will there be guaranteed rust problems in certain areas? The only place I've seen rust (but I'm in CA) was some right around the battery. Check this carefully - there's another thread on here about a major project. After a couple of tries, my permanent fix for this was to replace the battery with an Optima (and grind/sand/paint the rust out).

will the exhaust system be shot and need replacing or would that have been done already? My original exhaust shows no signs of wear. I don't expect I'll ever have any problems in this area.

Mark J

thanks oldskewel, good post.

Rick K

x2 on what oldskewel said - if leakdowns/compression come back ok, go for it.

Since you already mentioned that you would be going through the suspension, the only other potential big ticket item would be a need for a tranny rebuild.

Mark J

Rick, slightly OT, but noticed from your avatar pic, that you and a few others have had the rear whaletail deleted on the 80's Carreras. How does the car feel/handle after thats gone? ie at high speed on motorways or track days. It does look sleeker without it. Does that involve any engine lid respraying etc ?
I guess i would be losing d/force for any track days if i took it off or does it only come into effect at xxxmph ?