EBC - Slotted and Dimpled Brake rotors
10-06-2002, 06:40 PM
#1
AutoX
Thread Starter
Join Date: Sep 2002
Location: UK
Posts: 13
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
EBC - Slotted and Dimpled Brake rotors
Confused...i have heard horror and good stories about the use of EBC Kevlar pads - especially when used with the slotted and dimpled (n.b not drilled) rotors.
does anybody have any real world experience regarding fitting drilled or otherwise non standard brake discs to an '88 Carerra ? Word on this side of the pond, is that OE is best and all others do little except create dust...(and cost more) - thoughts welcome
STEVE
does anybody have any real world experience regarding fitting drilled or otherwise non standard brake discs to an '88 Carerra ? Word on this side of the pond, is that OE is best and all others do little except create dust...(and cost more) - thoughts welcome
STEVE
10-07-2002, 12:01 PM
#2
Rennlist Member
I'm no rotor expert, but some here have commented that slotted works better than drilled. They say that drilled rotors will crack at the hole locations. I've only used solid rotors myself, so have no personal experience. I'm trying to imagine what would happen with dimpled rotors, however. Brake dust already cakes in the little holes and sometimes has to be cleaned out, so I imagine that dimples would be the perfect place for brake dust to collect. That's only a thought experiment, so I could be way wrong.
The reports on frozen (cryogenically treated) rotors seem mixed. Some have reported no difference in longevity, while others have reported frozen rotors to last longer. I'm still on my first set, so can't yet say how long they'll last for me. From what I can tell, you are right that even many racers still use OE rotors.
The reports on frozen (cryogenically treated) rotors seem mixed. Some have reported no difference in longevity, while others have reported frozen rotors to last longer. I'm still on my first set, so can't yet say how long they'll last for me. From what I can tell, you are right that even many racers still use OE rotors.
10-08-2002, 11:15 AM
#3
Advanced
Join Date: Oct 2001
Location: London
Posts: 50
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Can't say I have even heard of a dimpled rotor. Please explain the rationale.
Personally, I would use simple OE rotors. They are so cheap that you would be mad to use anything else. The 3.2 rotors are a little undersized for track work and hence can warp very easily, even after a good cooldown lap if left to sit stationary next to hot pads (it pays to push your car backwards or forwards a little every minute or so after you parkup for say 10 minutes). So why risk your expensive drilled/slotted/dimpled rotors when there is at best a very small performance advantage? Spend the extra money on good pads and some venting to get some nice cool air in there.
I have the standard brakes on my 1989 Carrera (that carries a little bit more weight than a CS) and the OE rotors are just fine for track days.
Richard Bernau
1989 3.2
Personally, I would use simple OE rotors. They are so cheap that you would be mad to use anything else. The 3.2 rotors are a little undersized for track work and hence can warp very easily, even after a good cooldown lap if left to sit stationary next to hot pads (it pays to push your car backwards or forwards a little every minute or so after you parkup for say 10 minutes). So why risk your expensive drilled/slotted/dimpled rotors when there is at best a very small performance advantage? Spend the extra money on good pads and some venting to get some nice cool air in there.
I have the standard brakes on my 1989 Carrera (that carries a little bit more weight than a CS) and the OE rotors are just fine for track days.
Richard Bernau
1989 3.2
10-08-2002, 11:24 AM
#4
Advanced
Join Date: Oct 2001
Location: London
Posts: 50
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
I forgot to add that, while I have no experience with EBC pads, I hear that the Green ones are not up to scratch for heavy sport cars ie Porsches compared with Elises. Red ones are better but have a reputation for eating discs. I have used Porterfield R-4 and Pagid Blue compound for the last two years and would hapily recommend either. I used Pagid orange compound in the past and also recommend them for the track, but they are not so happy on the road where they need some heat before working well - I still used them on the road as they are not that bad though.
If you need brake advice in the UK try Steve Winter at JAZ (Wembley), who races in the classic series with a 3.2 brake set-up, or Colin Belton at 930 Motorsport (Chester?). Colin is the PCGB tech adviser for 3.2s and runs one himself.
Richard
If you need brake advice in the UK try Steve Winter at JAZ (Wembley), who races in the classic series with a 3.2 brake set-up, or Colin Belton at 930 Motorsport (Chester?). Colin is the PCGB tech adviser for 3.2s and runs one himself.
Richard
10-08-2002, 03:53 PM
#5
Technical Specialist
Rennlist
Lifetime Member
Rennlist
Lifetime Member
Here's my rotor experience:
On my 81SC, I started out with stock rotors and when they needed replacing, I went with slotted rotors (ATE Powerdisc) in the front and solid in the back. At the time, I was starting to track it, and the slotted rotors do help to keep the rotors clean, and still provide a reasonable heat sink. In addition, I've used Pagid Orange pads for years, both on and off track, and have never had any pad material clumping on the rotor, which can mimic a warped rotor. I attribute that to the combination of breaking the pads in properly, and the use of slotted rotors. I also do a cool down lap after each track session, and sometimes continue around the paddock to ensure the brakes are cooled down.
When I added the Turbo brakes, I again used slotted rotors in front, but went with cryogenic Porsche "drilled" rotors, which are not drilled but have holes that are cast-in during the manufacturing process. These are less likely to crack as quickly as the drilled rotors, but eventually will crack. When I sold the SC, I had around 5000 miles on the Turbo brakes, and the rears were showing little wear (you can see pictures on the 911SC FAQ in the performance section). I also had forced air cooling on the front Turbo brakes.
On the C2, I am using cryogenically-processed rotors, front and rear, again slotted in the front. I probably have 3000 miles on them, with Pagid Orange pads for track and street, and they are doing fine, and starting to show some wear. I also have air ducts which replace the fog lamps, for help with brake cooling.
On rotors, if you're application is entirely on the street, the stock factory rotors will do you just fine. If you go on the track, I'd suggest slotted rotors in front, in addition to adding air cooling (scoop mounted under the a-arm is one approach) for the front brakes.
On my 81SC, I started out with stock rotors and when they needed replacing, I went with slotted rotors (ATE Powerdisc) in the front and solid in the back. At the time, I was starting to track it, and the slotted rotors do help to keep the rotors clean, and still provide a reasonable heat sink. In addition, I've used Pagid Orange pads for years, both on and off track, and have never had any pad material clumping on the rotor, which can mimic a warped rotor. I attribute that to the combination of breaking the pads in properly, and the use of slotted rotors. I also do a cool down lap after each track session, and sometimes continue around the paddock to ensure the brakes are cooled down.
When I added the Turbo brakes, I again used slotted rotors in front, but went with cryogenic Porsche "drilled" rotors, which are not drilled but have holes that are cast-in during the manufacturing process. These are less likely to crack as quickly as the drilled rotors, but eventually will crack. When I sold the SC, I had around 5000 miles on the Turbo brakes, and the rears were showing little wear (you can see pictures on the 911SC FAQ in the performance section). I also had forced air cooling on the front Turbo brakes.
On the C2, I am using cryogenically-processed rotors, front and rear, again slotted in the front. I probably have 3000 miles on them, with Pagid Orange pads for track and street, and they are doing fine, and starting to show some wear. I also have air ducts which replace the fog lamps, for help with brake cooling.
On rotors, if you're application is entirely on the street, the stock factory rotors will do you just fine. If you go on the track, I'd suggest slotted rotors in front, in addition to adding air cooling (scoop mounted under the a-arm is one approach) for the front brakes.
10-08-2002, 04:47 PM
#6
Addict
Rennlist
Lifetime Member
Rennlist
Lifetime Member
Concur with bill - personally I use 'little grays' with PF 97s and slotted rotors and am quite happy with the performance, Cracking around the cast in wholes is not a problem and is in fact expected. It becomes a problem when the cracks begin connecting the wholes.
I would guess that the dimples would be some form of stress relief, but would seem to be a perfect place to accumulate hot, black stuff.
<img src="graemlins/beerchug.gif" border="0" alt="[cheers]" />
I would guess that the dimples would be some form of stress relief, but would seem to be a perfect place to accumulate hot, black stuff.
<img src="graemlins/beerchug.gif" border="0" alt="[cheers]" />
10-09-2002, 06:27 PM
#7
Advanced
Join Date: Mar 2002
Location: Madrid, Spain
Posts: 89
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Steve,
My mechanic´s advice was to replace rotors with whatever I felt happier with (drilled or solid) as he insisted it was mostly a cosmetic difference. He insisted, however, on sticking to original pads, as you´d never get the same performance or duration from aftermarket ones...
My 2 cents, though
My mechanic´s advice was to replace rotors with whatever I felt happier with (drilled or solid) as he insisted it was mostly a cosmetic difference. He insisted, however, on sticking to original pads, as you´d never get the same performance or duration from aftermarket ones...
My 2 cents, though
Trending Topics
10-09-2002, 08:29 PM
#8
Addict
Rennlist
Lifetime Member
Rennlist
Lifetime Member
Carlos,
sounds like your mechanic has no experience tracking one of these (or any car) and experiencing brake fade first hand. Two or three laps max on stock pads. Stock pads do give the best cold performance.
Alan
sounds like your mechanic has no experience tracking one of these (or any car) and experiencing brake fade first hand. Two or three laps max on stock pads. Stock pads do give the best cold performance.
Alan
10-12-2002, 09:12 AM
#10
Technical Specialist
Rennlist
Lifetime Member
Rennlist
Lifetime Member
[quote]<strong>
My mechanic´s advice was to replace rotors with whatever I felt happier with (drilled or solid) as he insisted it was mostly a cosmetic difference. He insisted, however, on sticking to original pads, as you´d never get the same performance or duration from aftermarket ones...
</strong><hr></blockquote>
Carlos,
I'd consider a new mechanic, too.
My mechanic´s advice was to replace rotors with whatever I felt happier with (drilled or solid) as he insisted it was mostly a cosmetic difference. He insisted, however, on sticking to original pads, as you´d never get the same performance or duration from aftermarket ones...
</strong><hr></blockquote>
Carlos,
I'd consider a new mechanic, too.
