demonfish

OK, so the 3.2 is quick, but, i feel as a package its lacking slightly, maybe its just because I am used to the acceleration of my old Delta's, I just feel like a touch more power would be the icing on the cake...

Would you:

A - Replace the 3.2 with a 3.6 engine....

B - Spend all the money on chocolate....

C - Spend the same amount as A on rebuilding \ getting more out of 3.2

D - something else

I know the other option is sell my car, put what i'd spend on it with it and get a 964...

BUT

I have so many uprated bits on mine, I'd want to swap them over, which would mean buying the new car first, and selling my current one for less.

The only thing stopping me doing all this really, is the fact its a narrow body (sad i know, how vain) where i'd really like the turbo look...

Lets hope a shell comes up somewhere for sale Very Happy

Also - whats the best area's for weight reduction, as the car isnt really that heavy anyway... I just cant bring myself to totally strip out the car, even though the interior is blue... and its only a weekend car....

maybe i should though.

jester911

It really depends on what you want ultimately from your car. Gaining any real hp is going to cost major $. Going to a 3.6 conversion might be the way to go if you really like the feel of the car otherwise. You sound like your not completely content with what you have though. You may want to sell your car and find another that fits the bill. It is almost always cheaper to buy what you want than build it. The problem is you can't always find someone else who had the same dream for their car.

I personally am going to run my 3.2 until it needs major work. I will then do a 3.6 transplant. Either that or I will buy one already converted and sell what I have.
The problem with going to newer cars is that the newer they are the less you get that raw feeling most of us love. You may want to go drive a 964 before making any sort of decision.

84_Carrera

IMO, the early 964 C4 I drove was nice, perhaps a little smoother than my '84 3.2L. However, it was heavier, so performance was probably around the same.

Now, compare that to a local guy's '83 SC that got a 3.6L stuffed in it, and the SC is AMAZING in comparison. However, that mod cost his $14k, after his engine as a core. I am considering something along these lines... 6psi supercharger on my 3.2L, probably $6k - $8k by the time I'm done, or if it is going to hit $14-$15k, and I can get in the $18-$20k ballpark for my Cab, I'll look into doing a nice chipped 993 C2 instead.

I understand the boat you're in - you know the condition of nearly everything on your current chassis, but it IS usually more cost-effective to pick up someone else's instead of tricking out yours - unless you're going to keep the completed project for YEARS to come, in which case I'd rather know what I'm starting with & pay the extra for all new mods, etc.

demonfish

i'd like to go supercharger too, and stick with the 3.2.... maybe thats a better option - but i wouldnt know how to go about it...

84_Carrera

I'm starting to make inquiries now. I'm eyeing a ProCharger C1 as the likely platform, as I don't feel like drilling & tapping oil feed / return lines for a Vortech. Changing the charger oil every 6,000 miles will get a little old, though that's about twice a year currently for my '84. I've also started asking established P-car vendors about possible sourcing.

demonfish

do you need to lower compression ratio - ie any rebuild work required?

Sounds VERY interesting...

MDL

I went to their Web site but I did not find anything specific for a 911. Have you spoken to anyone there about the application they recommend for our cars?

http://www.procharger.com/index.html

84_Carrera

ideally, you would want to run an air-charge cooler, and lower the compression to 8.5:1 or 9.0:1 on a water cooled engine, if you're running close to 14psi. I have gone 9psi without issue on other water cooled engines running ~9.8:1 CR without a cooler, but with a knock sensor, going from 220 rated crank hp to 322 wheel hp using 91+ octane & larger fuel injectors & pump, stock fuel pressure regulator, and a chip to control the new fuel curves / injector pulse duration. This was on a pent-roof 4-valve per cylinder setup, running a Powerdyne charger (also used a Vortech, better reliability, more plumbing involved, and didn't require annual charger rebuilds).

Now, that is NOT an air-cooled 911 boxer engine, so I'm looking into it, with an expected realistic non-cooled max pressure of 6psi, with stock US CR, planning on 93 octane. If I need to tear down the engine to rebuild for a lower CR, I don't know if I'll stay with the project.

Edit:
They do not sell a kit, this is the problem.

Problem #1: Most chargers are 4-6- or 8-rib serpentine pulleys, we obviously have a V-belt. So, a new crank pulley is in order, with timing marks & all, etc.

Problem #2: Fuel control & delivery: Likely need to go to an aftermarket control system, MoTec, HalTech, Tec-3, blah blah. Expensive. Assume injectors are available, assume Bosch is the vendor and an uprated duty cycle injector would be available. For the 3.0 / 3.2L SHO engines I've done before, they were 24 lb-hr, and Accel / other vendors had low-impedance injectors up & over 48 lb-hr (which is what I ran before at 15psi of boost). If "someone" can make a DME chip to control the operation, then you just need to verify that the lines / rails can handle increased flow requirements. As for the pump... territory unknown on that one so far. Worst case, I'd imagine a fuel cell with a more universal pump would be at hand.

Air (In): Can the barn door air meter setup work with boost, or does it need to be moved in front of the compressor inlet? Is there room to do this? Does the system need to be converted to a Mass-Air meter system? Is a cooler required to avoid detonation?

Air (Out): Do the stock heat exchangers / crossover exhaust setup allow for enough out-bound flow? Are headers required?

Spark: Is a twin-plug setup required to ensure complete combustion without washing a cylinder down due to excess fuel?

These & a ton more questions need to be answered as a kit is put together.

fast951

We can handle the tuning for you. Once you increase the flow, you need larger injectors. More than likely the AFM will be maxed out, we do offer a MAF conversion. If you decide to upgrade the ignition (or twin plug), we offer the wasted spark system to work with the factory DME.
We are using the 3.2L Motronic on some EFI conversions for the 930.

84_Carrera

Thanks John, will be contacting you to be sure. I'd probably feel better moving to a MAF also, but honestly would like to keep it a single-plug, if it's efficient enough. Twin plug means engine work, would prefer to keep it bolt-on if possible for the early stages.

I wonder how difficult it would be to set up a knock sensor on the case, with a nice idiot light on the dash, without getting into tying in the DME, just a "Hey moron, you're pre-detonating here.." kind of tool. Hmmm.

Mike Murphy

demonfish,

Upgrade your 3.2 by purchasing a 930. Quickest, cheapest way to add horsepower and the wide body you're looking for. Then, when you're done with the 930, you sell it for what you paid, meaning you take your cash and get a 964 turbo.

demonfish

yes - that is the most logical solution !