B&B triflo header and what muffler?
#1
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B&B triflo header and what muffler?
I have a 1989 Carrera with a 3.6 liter conversion. It has a B&B header (no cats) and a single outlet B&B muffler (looks like a 3-4 inch outlet). I'm not happy with the sound of the muffler and it has developed a nasty resonance at lower RPM (sounds like a loose baffle, but doesn't look cracked). I'm assuming that the B&B header is a power maker on this car and would like to keep it if possible, but what mufflers bolt up to the B&B header and don't have the resonance problems and a nice exhaust note? With the B&B muffler it doesn't really sound like a Porsche to me.
#2
Here's a pic of my solution, A Fabiani header muffler kit. Works and sounds great
Sound bytes at <a href="http://www.pelicanparts.com/MotorCity/wmv/3_6liter.htm" target="_blank">My 3.6 tranplant page</a>
I replaced the B&B that was previously there with the Fabiani due to resonance, durability(cracking), and warrenty (or lack thereof from B&B)
Sound bytes at <a href="http://www.pelicanparts.com/MotorCity/wmv/3_6liter.htm" target="_blank">My 3.6 tranplant page</a>
I replaced the B&B that was previously there with the Fabiani due to resonance, durability(cracking), and warrenty (or lack thereof from B&B)
#3
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P-Zabo,
I'd check to see whether a Monty will fit right up to your B&B header. I think Monty (they're Aussie), manufactures a terrific stainless steel muffler that looks & sounds great (a tad pricey though).
I know Steve Weiner (a 3.6L guru) at Rennsport really likes the Monty. Check with Steve as to whether it will fit up to your headers.
I have a dansk dual in - dual out mated to my SSI heat exchangers. I like my muffler's sound from outside the car. Inside resonance is too really much.
Richard
'87 Carrera-3.6L
Bill V.:
How does your new muffler sound compared to my set up (which you recorded last Spring)?
R.
I'd check to see whether a Monty will fit right up to your B&B header. I think Monty (they're Aussie), manufactures a terrific stainless steel muffler that looks & sounds great (a tad pricey though).
I know Steve Weiner (a 3.6L guru) at Rennsport really likes the Monty. Check with Steve as to whether it will fit up to your headers.
I have a dansk dual in - dual out mated to my SSI heat exchangers. I like my muffler's sound from outside the car. Inside resonance is too really much.
Richard
'87 Carrera-3.6L
Bill V.:
How does your new muffler sound compared to my set up (which you recorded last Spring)?
R.
#4
The B&B headers have a proprietary spacing. The only off the shelf mufflers that fit, that I know of, are the various iterations of B&B made specificaly for that header. The Fabiani uses custom cut and welded 2.5" ss pipes for an exact fit.
Rich, they sound very similar, but the recordings are poor and the constricted environs of Ricks yard don't make for good comparisons, I'll have to hear yours at the track. I'm trying to get to LRP this Thrs. You wouldn't happen to be going?
Rich, they sound very similar, but the recordings are poor and the constricted environs of Ricks yard don't make for good comparisons, I'll have to hear yours at the track. I'm trying to get to LRP this Thrs. You wouldn't happen to be going?
#5
Race Car
I eliminated my B&B muffler's droning resonance by reducing the size of the (twin, in my case) outlets from 3 inches down to 2 inches. I had a local muffler shop do it, and then I painted the whole assembly.
No noticeable difference in power, and the sound is now nice and rumbly all across the range, without that tri-flow 2K-3K buzz shaking your fillings loose.
No noticeable difference in power, and the sound is now nice and rumbly all across the range, without that tri-flow 2K-3K buzz shaking your fillings loose.
#6
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Dammit Bill, is everyone going to Lime Rock this Thursday but me?
Geoffrey Ring will be there with his BIG turbo; now I find out you're gonna be there too. Me, I'll be working (or whatever it is lawyers do; the term "work" may be an exaggeration).
I really can't complain since I was at LRP last week for 3 consecutive days (9/12, 13 & 14) with North Country and NNJR PCA. And, I'll be back there on 9/25 with Metro/NY. Still, I'd like to see you and Geoffrey at the track.
What are your DE plans for what's left of the season here in the north east? I'm seriously contemplating TracQuest @ The Glen the last weekend in October (25 & 26?). I hear they run excellent events with a mix of vehicles (Ferraris, 'Vettes, Vipers, BMWs, Porsches and anything else you want to show up in).
Have fun at LRP. If you get a chance, find Geoffrey and say "hello".
Richard
'87 Carrera-3.6L
Geoffrey Ring will be there with his BIG turbo; now I find out you're gonna be there too. Me, I'll be working (or whatever it is lawyers do; the term "work" may be an exaggeration).
I really can't complain since I was at LRP last week for 3 consecutive days (9/12, 13 & 14) with North Country and NNJR PCA. And, I'll be back there on 9/25 with Metro/NY. Still, I'd like to see you and Geoffrey at the track.
What are your DE plans for what's left of the season here in the north east? I'm seriously contemplating TracQuest @ The Glen the last weekend in October (25 & 26?). I hear they run excellent events with a mix of vehicles (Ferraris, 'Vettes, Vipers, BMWs, Porsches and anything else you want to show up in).
Have fun at LRP. If you get a chance, find Geoffrey and say "hello".
Richard
'87 Carrera-3.6L
#7
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PZabo,
BTW, if you find that you've got to ditch the B&B headers, Steve Timmons sells some really gorgeous (can an exhaust be "gorgeous"?) headers for your 3.6 conversion.
Richard
'87 Carrera-3.6L
BTW, if you find that you've got to ditch the B&B headers, Steve Timmons sells some really gorgeous (can an exhaust be "gorgeous"?) headers for your 3.6 conversion.
Richard
'87 Carrera-3.6L
Trending Topics
#8
I have B & B headers and dual in dual out muffler
that was painful between 2 & 3k rpm. I spoke to
someone in the tech dept at B & B and he claimed that their tests showed that the right outlet only accounts for a 1 - 2 hp gain. He suggested having
a round piece of stainless welded into the right
exhaust from the muffler with a quarter size hole in it to cut down on resonance while not losing any hp or block it completely and loose a few hp.
I first tried it with the quarter sized hole but it was still buzzy @ 2 - 3k so I had a plate tack-
ed in and I sealed it with high heat silacone furnace caulk. This solved the problem and I am finally happy with the sound.
This plate is on the muffler not the exhaust, so it's not visible and I had it done so that it's
easily removable. I was thinking that it would be
nice to rig the flap so that it could be opened for DE days, and I recently saw a post here or on the Pelican bd. that Jack O. had an idea to rig one to a heater lever. Good idea, I need the heat levers to work but another lever operated cable
could work.
Another related but seperate topic. Has anyone w/
B & B headers on a 3.2L engine noticed how close
the hot hot right header comes to the 90 degree
elbow on the oil line? That doesn't look like a good idea. I'm thinking that some sort of heat
shield should be put between them. Any thoughts?
Jim
that was painful between 2 & 3k rpm. I spoke to
someone in the tech dept at B & B and he claimed that their tests showed that the right outlet only accounts for a 1 - 2 hp gain. He suggested having
a round piece of stainless welded into the right
exhaust from the muffler with a quarter size hole in it to cut down on resonance while not losing any hp or block it completely and loose a few hp.
I first tried it with the quarter sized hole but it was still buzzy @ 2 - 3k so I had a plate tack-
ed in and I sealed it with high heat silacone furnace caulk. This solved the problem and I am finally happy with the sound.
This plate is on the muffler not the exhaust, so it's not visible and I had it done so that it's
easily removable. I was thinking that it would be
nice to rig the flap so that it could be opened for DE days, and I recently saw a post here or on the Pelican bd. that Jack O. had an idea to rig one to a heater lever. Good idea, I need the heat levers to work but another lever operated cable
could work.
Another related but seperate topic. Has anyone w/
B & B headers on a 3.2L engine noticed how close
the hot hot right header comes to the 90 degree
elbow on the oil line? That doesn't look like a good idea. I'm thinking that some sort of heat
shield should be put between them. Any thoughts?
Jim
#9
Race Car
Jim, I think about this stuff all the time.
I have a 3.6, but still added a heat shield to protect the S-hose from the header. (Excuse the fact that I misplaced the toothbrush I normally use to clean my car's undercarriage. )
I have a 3.6, but still added a heat shield to protect the S-hose from the header. (Excuse the fact that I misplaced the toothbrush I normally use to clean my car's undercarriage. )
#10
The last B&B muffler I looked at had the entire right side outlet covered by a plate with a .25" hole in it from the factory. When installed it looked like a normal 3" dual out muffler. Seems to defeat the purpose of a dual outlet muffler.
#11
Does anyone know why the sentances
in my previous reply end up being
different lengths? I was editing as
I went but what I was seeing and
what showed up on the board were
very different.
Jim
in my previous reply end up being
different lengths? I was editing as
I went but what I was seeing and
what showed up on the board were
very different.
Jim
#12
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Thanks for all the feedback guys, but I'm still confused about what to do on a muffler. I'm pretty disenchanted with the B&B and from what I've heard here it only reinforces my feelings. Bill - I checked out your website and listened to the audio clip, but it's hard to judge (kind of distorted) and it still sounds awfully loud. What experiences do you have with Fabspeed? The website looks pretty good: <a href="http://www.fabspeed.com/bandb.html" target="_blank">http://www.fabspeed.com/bandb.html</a>
Seems like a quality product at a good price, but I've never seen or heard it.
Seems like a quality product at a good price, but I've never seen or heard it.
#13
The Fabiani is on the loud side but not objectionably so(to me), I like it a lot. All comments from others have also been positive. There is no real resonance as with the B&B but it does get louder at ~2000. Normal conversation can be carried on at all times and the engine fan can often be heard above the exhaust.
The recordings were done with a laptop w/built in mic and are not representative of the sound heard in the cockpit. The laptop was placed on the floor ~3' behind the centerline of the car for both recordings. Some day I'll do it right.
The recordings were done with a laptop w/built in mic and are not representative of the sound heard in the cockpit. The laptop was placed on the floor ~3' behind the centerline of the car for both recordings. Some day I'll do it right.