Mark Dreyer

I presume anyone on this forum would be familiar with the various options for upgrading systems in our cars. So perhaps the Griffith’s a/c upgrade doesn’t work as well for your LH as it did for my 89 3.2 Carrera? On the outside chance you aren’t familiar with this a/c upgrade I thought I’d throw it out there.

Edward

I have never heard/read this, ever. This is genuinely the first time I've heard this said of the 996. Perhaps because of the natural bias one sees in aircooled forums is the most natural reason. Not a criticism, mind you, just interested in your observations. By this point in time, I can only presume the typical issues (likely most all, well beyond the IMS) with the 996 have been sorted by owners??? If this is true, this could make the 996 a decent "bargain" in the P-car world. Just thinkin aloud is all.

Edward

Mark Dreyer

I owned a base 996 coupe a few years ago and this was my impression also. It was a perfect combination of modern cabin and old school driving characteristics. I loved that car! Who cares about the headlights or cheap interior? For those that are into the fun of driving, you can do a lot worse than a N/A 996.

paul_howey

I think the 996 is a fantastic and very underrated generation but I really don’t find any real similarities to LH 911’s.

IMHO, The 996 is much closer to 993 vs any other aircooled generation.

peterp

I don't really want to derail the thread by going into a 996 discussion beyond making the important point that the driving feel is a great (best in my opinion) alternative to a 911e. I'll make this one post responding to the points raised and suggest that a thread be opened in the 996 forum if anyone wants to discuss further. I often hear the 996 mentioned as "starter 911" -- to me, if you pick exactly the right options (extremely important), it's a "finisher 911 " as a super well-balanced, lightweight, simple sports car. My current 996 is a keeper for life simply because it brings me back to the early cars, but can be driven daily with ice-cold air, heated seats, etc .

The earliest 996.1's (99-00) had dual row IMS and are very robust. It was when Porsche increased the displacement from 3.4 to 3.6 at the same time it reduced the IMS bearing size with the 996.2. that IMS became problematic. Only the earliest 996.1's had dual-row IMS, they switched to single row later in the 3.4 run (around 2001-ish). There is a product called "The Solution" that prevents IMS issues, but not necessarily needed on the earliest cars.

Exactly. I actually like the headlights (fit with the more modern vibe of the 996, but obviously very different from the 911e!). Interior options make all the difference in the world -- the interior on my first 2001 996 felt cheap, my second 2000 996 had full leather, 3-spoke wheel, deviating carpet colors - totally different interior look and feel from the first.

The 996 is lighter than the 993 and 964 and that, combined with the power steering really brings it back to the light steering feel of the early cars, 17" wheels give it the right ride feel, and variocam gives it the peaky output very similar to the old cars.

paul_howey

This is definitely an interesting perspective but having both a decent amount of seat time and ownership experience within these generations, I can honestly say that I never thought a 996 felt like an early LH car. However, I have felt that way about 996 and 993. I’ll have to go and drive them back to back sometime.

Mark Dreyer

The 996 isn’t as raw as an early 911. It’s hard to describe but during my ownership experience it reminded me more of the older 911’s than it did the newer ones, both of which I’ve owned. It’s like a perfect blend of old and new.

Bill Verburg

[QUOTE=peterp;18344051...

The 996 is lighter than the 993 and 964 and that, combined with the power steering really brings it back to the light steering feel of the early cars, 17" wheels give it the right ride feel, and variocam gives it the peaky output very similar to the old cars.[/QUOTE]
What nonsense

996 curb wt is ~3100 -3200+/- GT3 a little liter ~300-3100#

993 curb weight is ~28-2900# RSCS a little lighter ~2800-2900#

964 ~2900-3100 # RS a little lighter ~2700-2800#

all per factory

peterp

Where are you getting your data? Those numbers are not correct, and the 996 GT3 is actually 142 lbs heavier than the standard 996.

Factory weights for Coupe/6-speed/2wd:

911 (1965-67) -> 2,381 lbs (-520 lbs) – 130 hp, 129 fl-lbs - 18.3 lbs/hp

911E (1969-71) -> 2,249 lbs (-652 lbs) – 155 hp (2.2) 140 hp (2.0) – 14.5 lbs/hp (2.2), 16.1 (2.0)

911E (1972-73) -> 2,370 lbs (-530 lbs) – 165 hp (2.4) – 14.3 lbs/hp

911S (1974-77) -> 2,425 lbs (-476 lbs) – 175 hp (2.7) – 13.8 lbs/hp

911 SC (1978-83) -> 2,557 lbs (-344 lbs) - 180 hp – 14.2 lbs/hp (1980-83 SC's heavier?)

3.2 Carrera 915 (1984-1986) -> 2,756 lbs (-145 lbs) – 207 hp, 192 ft-lb – 13.3 lbs/hp

3.2 Carrera G50 (1987-1989) -> 2,866 lbs (-35 lbs) – 217 hp, 195 ft-lb – 13.2 lbs/hp

964 (1989-1993) -> 3,031 lbs (+130 lbs) – 247 hp, 228 ft-lb – 12.3 lbs/hp

993 (1994-1998) -> 3,020 lbs (+119 lbs) – 272 hp, 243 fl-lb – 11.1 lbs/hp

996.1 (1998-2001) -> 2,901 lbs (reference) – 296 hp, 258 ft-lb – 9.8 lbs/hp

996.2 (2002-2004) -> 2,959 lbs (+58 lbs) – 320 hp, 273 ft-lb – 9.25 lbs/hp

997.1 (2005-2008) -> 3,075 lbs (+174 lbs) – 325 hp, 273 ft-lb – 9.46 lbs/hp

997.2 (2009-2012) -> 3,186 lbs (+285 lbs) – 345 hp, 287 ft-lb – 9.23 lbs/hp

jaeger86

Was there a difference in the weight of the ROW 3.2 and the USA 3.2?

peterp

These are US numbers, don't know of the difference for ROW models.

I updated the prior post to include the SC and LH models -- that's where there is really a very large difference in weight versus the newer 911s. Easy to see why nothing can duplicate the 911e -- excellent power in period and very light weight.

Spyerx

Real on scales weights:
My 71t: 2100 ish (haven’t weighed since efi conversion)
964 hot rod: 2650-ish
3.2 g50: 2875 (iirc)
997.1rs (modded a bit): 3060
All wet weights with call it 1/2 tank, no driver.

peterp

Impressive work in your 964 hot rod build thread! Do you know what the starting weight was before the reductions?

scotttocs

I have an '84 Targa, it has A/C, but I think it needs a yearly charge to blow cold. Never driven a LH, so can't give you any comparison, but I love/hate the 915 transmission. It's picky and unforgiving and feels amazing.

Jrtaylor9

901 trans is even worse