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I think a good rule is to never respond to a first time poster when his question is ludicrous.
Well, ludicrous it may be, but I recognize the feeling, driven an M2 and M4, with lots of power and my first P drive was in a 265 HP Boxster (faster was not available at the moment). Was just giving a try, and the feeling of the 265 ponies in a mid-engine car was completely different.
Didn't buy the car, waited a week or 2 for a more powerful testdrive.
But in the end, the 265 hp would be enough to wipe the smile of an M2/M4 driver's face 😜
Sold my 981 GT4 a few months back (waiting for my PDK 718 GT4) and also have an F80 M3 ZCP...with the usual JB4 and intake mods.
There's is no comparison between the two cars, very different cars.....yes the M3 has lots of torque down low and is fast in a straight line but the GT4 felt superior and was a better, well balance package.
I really don't enjoy the M3 at the track as I did the GT4.....the suspension and steering on the GT4 is far superior and a joy.
Now if you are looking at numbers only then the GT4 may sound a bit "soft", which is not and does feel special with a N/A engine.
Power is overrated. Nowadays I find I drive my 207 hp G-body 911 more often than I do my GT4 on the street. It's more involving and I get to keep my driver's license past 2nd gear.
Power is overrated. Nowadays I find I drive my 207 hp G-body 911 more often than I do my GT4 on the street. It's more involving and I get to keep my driver's license past 2nd gear.
always wanted the CXX option for the "seat of your pants ometer" ...
I have my money down on a GT4 for European delivery this spring. This would be my first Porsche, nevertheless I've been a little worried that it might be underpowered. I drive now an M3 CS that is pretty aggressive with 450 HP and 445 lb/ft of torque. The reason I looked at the GT4 is that I'm looking for something lighter and more sporty for track use. Despite the very positive motor journalist reviews, I've noticed some people complaining that this new engine doesn't rev freely and is not that special. I also saw a video with a GT4 owner driving an M2 CS which he said seemed to have more power, I assume it's the torque from the turbo. To sum up, I wanted to buy a car with a special NA engine, and I'd rather buy a used GT3 if this GT4 engine is not that special and underpowered. Thoughts?
I have owned an F80 M3, F82 M4, and an F90 M5 Comp - there is nothing special about ANY of those engines. The M3/4 while fast (because they are underrated by a good bit) and have a lot of low torque, are lackluster on the top end of the rev range and generally don't do anything else well. The steering is awful, the sound is terrible, the ride quality is generations behind Porsche, and the overall quality is not there either.
The GT4 engine is flat out special and even better with the OPF deleted. It makes me smile, giggle, and generally feels not only more free to rev, but sounds great in a way no BMW ever has if you ask me. I prefer NA (or NA feeling) engines vs the spiky and relatively less predicable power of the M3/4. The GT4 also feels alive and special in every other facet as well - steering feel, the distance between the steering wheel and gearbox. Every aspect works in harmony and the cohesive package of everything is unmatched by any manufacturer in the industry from my POV. The other thing about Porsche is, you can use more of the power more of the time. Sure BMW underrated their cars like crazy, but Porsche overachieves for its rated HP.
Last edited by mr gregash; 10-22-2020 at 11:21 AM.
Since you seem concerned about hp/tq and not the GT4's superlative handling and sublime drive; then yes you will be disappointed.
I'd recommend you cross shop the 650 hp/tq LT4 7th gen corvette --- used now they're in the $60s. Get the Z07 track pack. Huge punch and lateral G limits.
I have my money down on a GT4 for European delivery this spring. This would be my first Porsche, nevertheless I've been a little worried that it might be underpowered. I drive now an M3 CS that is pretty aggressive with 450 HP and 445 lb/ft of torque. The reason I looked at the GT4 is that I'm looking for something lighter and more sporty for track use. Despite the very positive motor journalist reviews, I've noticed some people complaining that this new engine doesn't rev freely and is not that special. I also saw a video with a GT4 owner driving an M2 CS which he said seemed to have more power, I assume it's the torque from the turbo. To sum up, I wanted to buy a car with a special NA engine, and I'd rather buy a used GT3 if this GT4 engine is not that special and underpowered. Thoughts?
Claims that the engine isn’t “free revving” or “less special” than the 981 GT4 engine are nonsense. The engine revs higher than the predecessor, produces more power up top, and is not shared with shared with high volume models (the way the 981 GT4 engine was a detuned 991.1 Carrera S engine).
The only thing the 9A1 powered cars did better than the new 4.0L was exhaust sound because of the lack of particulate filters and centre exit exhaust. However, that’s a property of the muffler rather than the engine, and the 4.0L engine sounds awesome with an aftermarket exhaust and particulate filter delete. Check out Soul’s new valved exhaust + over axle pipe demo video.
Now, it’s true that this car is no torque monster. If you floor it at 3000 RPM in third, you will be underwhelmed. On my 567 hp 664 lb.ft CL63 AMG, flooring it in third gear at low RPM would shove me back in my seat forcefully, but it doesn't on the Spyder. The GT4/Spyder are all about being in the 5000-8000 RPM range. First gear is violently fast, and takes you up to 80 km/h (50 mph). Second gear also feels strong above 4500 RPM, pulling with about 0.5G acceleration nearly all the way to redline (77-136 km/h). What’s exciting about the way it feels is that it’s still pulling hard at 120 km/h in second and has room to rev further.
However, compared to the two turbocharged AMGs I had before my Spyder, the Spyder lacks the violent shove of second or third gear at low RPM in those cars. With naturally aspirated high revving engines like this, you need to be willing to downshift to first when necessary and take second gear all the way to redline to get the most acceleration out of it.
Car and Driver got a 120 mph quarter mile trap speed for this car. That’s pretty respectable, and should be comparable to your M3. You just need to keep the revs up to get the power.
P.S. If you want maximum acceleration at street speeds, PDK would be better because the first three gears are around 10% shorter than the manual version. However, I've come to like the long second gear of the manual transmission for its versatility.
I'm coming from an Audi S5 with 430 AWHP and 415 AWTQ on a full tune and also exposed to my brother's M4 Competition with JB4 with over 500+ RWHP and 550 RWTQ. So I do understand where you're coming from... However nothing beats a high revving Naturally Aspirated engine with an excellent power to weight ratio. This vehicle puts a smile on my face and I still haven't completed my break-in period. This car is function + form with a perfect balance.
This video which was also mentioned above may change your perspective:
What's really sad is my wife's Model 3 Performance will wipe the smile off the face of most M series drivers in a stoplight GP up to and through 100mph
It doesn't mean it puts a larger smile on our faces than the 981 BGTS we just traded and expect of the 2021 Spyder PDK we have on order. POWER is but one measure of the overall driving experience. Driven in anger the GT4 will deliver the driving experience in spades. Can the same be said about a car bought for a HP number?
When I've been asked about why I don't have X or Y car but drive a Porsche that seems to cost so much more than it's competition. I can only reply with, "If you have ask you wouldn't understand". I don't say, "drive one then decide" because, quite honestly, no two people are guaranteed to experience the same things emotionally when they drive something.
What's really sad is my wife's car will wipe the smile off the face of virtually any M series driver in a stoplight GP up to and through 100mph
It doesn't mean it puts a larger smile on our faces than the 981 BGTS we just traded and expect of the 2021 Spyder PDK we have on order. POWER is but one measure of the overall driving experience. Driven in anger the GT4 will deliver the driving experience in spades. Can the same be said about a car bought for a HP number?
It's the next major advancment in the auto industry. You can't beat TQ from 0 RPM on up.
They are still 1-3 hero runs though, you drive it in anger from a stop light all the time or do a canyon run and your battery will go fast. The chassis dynamics and battery technology isn't there yet, but it will be in the future.
I consider them the equivalent of the 60's muscle cars, very one dimensional. Let's see what the Tesla Roaster does when released.
10-22-2020, 09:01 AM
