Dr. G7

Spyerx was

Dr. G7

This discussion is interesting. When lamenting deprecation, cost of ownership etc, etc., one thing we are not addressing, why buy Porsche at all? A Toyota corolla will also get you from point A to Point B.

Buying Porsche is same reason why some of us have

MuschetteMech

do agree

ipse dixit

Go drive the Lucid Air.

It literally beats Porsche at ever metric that matters for a car or an EV.

The only thing that Porsche arguably has over the Lucid Air is dealer network.

But if you live close to a Lucid dealership, buying a Taycan over an Air is literally like this

daveo4porsche

my opinion after driving a Luicid is different than yours - I will not give Lucid any of my money…enjoy yours!

thebishman

As someone who values your opinion on BEVs, and as someone who really likes all that he’s read re: the Lucid Air, (although I live >500 miles from the nearest service centre so would never purchase/lease one until that changes), I’m interested in learning more of your negativity towards the car. If you have time to explain.

THEDOD

^^^

I recently spent some substantial time with a Lucid GT. I thought it was spectacular overall. Great range: spectacular speed from any metric. A luxury car feel.

Brainofjjj

I’ve also driven the Air and have a dealer location near me. I liked the car overall and feel like the Taycan 4S, which is all I’ve driven, steers better and looks better but looks are subjective. The Air is quicker for the price and leasing it pretty cheap. The interior is massive and feels luxurious.
That said I’m still hunting for a good deal on a 4S or GTS wagon but I’ll lease an Air within a few weeks if I don’t find one for a good price.

kort677

I am currently driving a Lucid Air GT and it is a fine driving and very comfortable car that has amazing range. that said the car drives like a big heavy sedan while the porsche has a more sporty, tighter feel.

the lucid is a great value but nothing can compare to the drive of a porsche

On_Your_Left

For me the Lucid is tempting on paper, but after a poor experience with a Tesla Model S, I've got too much scar tissue to deal with another brand new mfgr. A lot of the same issues I had with Tesla (poor build quality, under resourced service dept, etc) I am now hearing from friends who own Lucids......

Thus for me, Rivian, Lucid, etc are neat to look at but best kept out of one's own garage.

momo360

I am currently leasing a Lucid Air (have had it for 6 months), and I can without a doubt say the opposite is true. The Taycan is hands down the better car in every metric other than space management.

The Air EPA rating is BS, you can read on the forums, but my 400 mile variant averages about 270 miles in real life. DC Fast Charging takes 35 minutes to 80% which is almost twice as long as the Taycan. The infotainment is slow and glitchy, the car has issues with passive unlock with the keyfob and phone key. People are regularly stranded outside their cars waiting for it to unlock regularly. On top of that, the car rides big, the seats do not have good bolstering, and the Taycan blows the Lucid out of the water in driving dynamics. The only reason I ended up with the Lucid was because I needed a car with a more rear legroom/space, and I wanted a cheap lease. After my 18 month lease is up, I will be happy to dump that thing back to Lucid. It's nowhere near comparable to a Taycan.

There have been a lot of CPO Taycan GTS/Turbo cheap 12 month leases popping up that I would love to take if they are still around when my Lucid lease is up

daveo4porsche

in no particular order

• I 100% dislike the styling - I really really don't want to drive a big ugly EV Buick
• I spent time in a "used" Lucid Air with 8000 miles on it - every thing in the cabin was "broken" - the motorized screen wouldn't come out, the rear shades didn't work, the windows barely worked - seat adjustments were spotty and non-functional - and I took me 8 minutes to get it unlocked with the key-fob
  • front frunk wouldn't close after several attempts
  • rear trunk wouldn't open - but then it did - and then it didn't
  • this experience with a used Lucid permanently tainted the product in my mind - there is no coming back from that for me personally
  • I mean the cabin was basically "everything is broken" mode
  • I can recognize the difference between "broken" because it was "abused" and broken cause it's flaky - I firmly believe this particular vehicle was not abused.
• co-workers have spent "months" waiting for basic parts with no ETA in sight
• I believe the engineering is world class - best in the industry right now in terms of pure EV drive train - efficiency and implementations - mechanically the Lucid is an impressive product - nothing but respect…
• the design is terrible - colors, textures, combinations of colors - and general attention to detail is not to my personal tastes - I'm biased, brainwashed, and head strong - but I'd do a BMW and it's style foopahs before I'd be caught dead in a Lucid air
• Lucid is a case study in the difference between "engineering" and "design" - the best companies mingle the two so seamlessly you believe both are the same - terrible companies demonstrate the two things are not the same - Lucid demonstrates with stark examples that engineering and design are not the same thing - and you can be good/excellent at one and still "fail" in the other category.
• the "good one" is the Saphire - world class stats - better styling $250k - oh my!!!
• I drove it - both on the street and some limited track time @ thunderhilll 2 mile - it's EV impressive but doesn't "knock" down the Taycan
• I expect depreciation on Lucid's product to make the Taycan depreciation look like investment grade ROI
• I don't do leases
• I have several former co-workers doing software for them - too much knowledge about how the sausage is made and insights into leadership and the Saudi's influence
  • they have the right "sorts" of people "doing software" - but they are handicapping them and not investing enough
  • they have "better" people than Porsche/VW/Audi doing their software - but fewer of them and lack resources - and they are looking to cut back rather than increase investment in this space
  • I lack faith of any follow through long term - and if they "lose/lay-off" their cloud people the car lacks resilience
  • we all know Porsche's software has room for improvement - but I don't doubt they are in it for the long haul (the android "piviot" in the Macan could show them a path forward) - I'm not sure what Lucid's "vision" for software is - and Tesla is "all in" and accelerating with perhaps "too much" software "vision"
  • their software "concerns" me - but I have lunch with people who work there - they do not paint a picture of "tech forward vision towards a grander future" - this in my experience is never a good sign.
• I'm not their target demographic - according to "inside" knowledge they are actively targeting the "over 50 crowd" with more money than Brains - and not for midlife crisis sporty, but rather lazy luxury
• it's a luxe-barge - not my thing
• Lucid does a lot of private testing at Thunderhill - I've seen them there a lot when I'm there (normally on the 2 mile circuit) - I got to watch them do testing several times over the past 3 years - fun to watch them running prototype around 2 mile circuit to develop the sapphire…they were benchmarking against 3 cars
  • Model 3 performance
  • Model S plaid
  • Taycan Turbo
  • they were doing head to head against the 3 cars with their own Tesla(s)/Porsche they owned/bought for testing - eventually they stopped bring the Tesla's - and only tested with the Taycan - they felt they had reached parity with the Tesla product (or beyond) but still had "a lot of work to do" (their words not mine) to be as good as the Porsche
  • I was never able to close the loop as to if they considered themselves "equal" to the Taycan TurboS - but it became their benchmark - and they were beating the hell out of both cars to develop the Lucid
  • Kudo's to them for doing that - and investing the time/effort and actually measuring and testing their progress - respect!!!
  • but we can all buy a Taycan right now - and that is the windmill they were tilting at…
• Taycan reminded me why I didn't want a sedan - _IF_ I was going to get a new Taycan - it would've been the CT/ST - but I'm pivoting to a Macan EV Turbo for the practicality aspect of my next EV
• I would do a Plaid before a Luicid (maybe not as Elon descends further into madness)
• I've already nurse-maided two new EV companies: Tesla & Porsche - I don't have it in me to do a 3rd (one of the reasons I'm not pivoting to Rivian, but there are others)
• there is probably more - but I go back to an ICE vehicle before I give any money to Lucid
• I lack faith that even th Saudis can save them…the Saudi's for example might lose interest in the North American market, they only need Lucid EV's for the rest of the world (not even China)
• I attended a speaking engagement where the CEO/founder was one of the speakers - I've been in tech world for 30+ years, EV's for 10+ years, and been fortunate to hear some of the smartest people I've ever encountered speak - this presentation will not go on that list.

I'm sure I'm missing something, but I have extreme bias, hate the look, limited hands on has never gone well for me, and it's not "my product", and I think the stats don't tell the whole story - if the stats told the whole story we should all be driving Model 3 performance models - but we all know the fallacy in that - but on paper the Model 3 vs. the Taycan - yeah …

not my product - and there are alternatives.

THEDOD

^^
i’ll add to my take the car I spent time in had 18,000 miles and still seemed brand new so it varies much from another who replied in the thread. All items/ controls in the car worked as expected. Was faster than the turbo from any metric and drive much smaller than the actual size of the car ( same size as Model S Tesla) the back seats are very nice and roomy.
car/ driver… everybody’s got their own taste and expectations. There are some who don’t like the Taycan styling/ feel . Different strokes

https://www.caranddriver.com/rankings/best-sedans/electric/luxury

thebishman

daveo4Porshe: thank you so much for your insights on the Lucid Air.

Interestingly, I actually really like the styling as it strikes me as very ‘Sci Fi’ in its design; and I’m a big Sci Fi fan! lol

I also believe that the EV drivetrain/battery tech that Lucid has developed has no peer currently, and I hope that the company can license that tech to more companies besides Aston Martin in order to help them survive.

Like you, I for the life of me cannot understand this fixation on having the rear seats/cabin being a markedly differing colour than the front portion, and that alone would be enough to give me pause in ordering an Air if I actually lived close enough to a Service centre to allay any fears re: minor irritating faults driving me nuts.

If the Sapphire was $125K and not $250K and if a Service centre wasn’t 500 miles from me, I’d seriously consider the car and they’d sell a lot more of them given its specs.

A part of me wonders why Apple, after spending $ billions on developing their own car only to abandon the whole project, wouldn’t consider buying Lucid which would kill two birds with one stone as it were and cost pocket change for Tim Cook.

I hope the Gravity will sell like hotcakes as I’d hate to see the company fail.

ipse dixit

I spent a solid 2 weeks in a Lucid Air Pure and it was a pleasure to drive. Rock solid, not a creak or rattle, and I easily got 400 miles on a full charge. The ride was compliant, but not floaty, and the steering was more communicative than a Taycan Turbo that I've driven.

As to software, it's just eons better than anything Porsche has to offer. It just works, and it's fast, like my iPhone fast. And it also still has physical switches for things I need.

Looks wise, yes, it's sort of evokes images of what a bastard love child between a Buick and a Camry might look like, but I think I think it looks better than a M3. The Taycan definitely looks better though.

But for something like 85k (with options), the Air Pure is a no-brainer for me if I am looking for a daily EV. This may not be the case if I didn't live close to a Lucid service center, however.

I am just glad we have more and more choice when it comes to EVs. For that, we are all winners.