R6XTERRA

subscribed.

I will be contacting Danny in the spring to do an appraisal on my 964. Finally have it ready for you.

Livio928

^^ save yourself the aggravation and pay for an independent appraisal ( I think about $250) from a certified appraisal and use that as the value of the vehicle. It needs to be done before any accident so that the insurance cannot back out after the fact. Send in the appraisal as use for determining your insurance rates. Only at that time will you have a true value and receive a true cost for the valuation of the vehicle. A proper evaluator will also use similar type of like models and mileage and condition to determine value so the insurance company has little leverage to low ball you in the event of a payout. That is how Hagerty and the old Silver Wheels plan in Ontario did it. Hard to dispute a certified evaluation on the value of your vehicle. The appraisal also lasts for at least 5 years as well but you may want to have it re-appraised if the model you are insuring is greatly increasing in value (964s, 993s 928s(? hopeful))

Livio928

Not so with the value rise. Ask a 964 owner what their car was worth even 3 years ago and ask them what it is worth now. The 996 is at the point where 928s were (are now?) a few years ago, however as the junkers and dogs are crushed or parted out and only the good examples survive, , they will increase in value. Wait another 5-10 years they will increase in value - happened with 356s, older 911s, 964s, 993s, (hopefully to the 928 soon or already on the way up) and eventually 996s will follow the same path. History tends to repeat itself.

I bought a 1968 Dodge Charger with a 2bbl 318 c.i. in 1984 for $500. It had Bucket seats and the centre console. I put in about $2.5k back then and sold it for $3.5k two years later. Now you can't touch one in decent shape for less than $25k which is not much difference in value than a 383c.i. Who would have thunk? (I knew I should have kept it. Doh!)

Turbodan

Livio; I am a vehicle appraiser. I belong to PAVE (www.trustpave.com) the only recognized association of vehicle evaluators in North America. I do give offer a rennlist discount.
Re 996s- an agreed value is very important as insurance companies are known to offer 12-15k for a 996 written off regardless of mods or condition. The other models which have gone up in recent years also benefit from a recent appraisal. Everything is great until it isn't or you need to negotiate with insurance companies.

ronnie993tt

Danny did a great job on my Z so I can recommend him. Hagerty did not require a re-appraisal to double my 19a value since it was less than 5 years old. They did however contact Wilhoit and Sloan and approved the bump right away.

Christien

I don't think that's really a fair comparison. Porsche built MANY more 996s than any other model - 175,000 996s vs. 68,000 993s, 62,000 964s, and going back to the 356, 78,000, and that was over a 15 year span.

There are just so many 996s out there, coupled with the fact that it was never one of the more desirable models, I agree that it'll be a very long time before their values start increasing.

ronnie993tt

+1 I bet they never will either unless the IMS and cylinder scoring issues make 'em rare! On the bright side this is a real cheap way to get folks that can't afford a new or air kooler Porsche into an iconic 911.

Pags993

^ agreed with maybe the exception of the 996 TT's that seem to be stable and increasing slightly after hitting bottom.

Torontoworker

Agree. I don't have a conflict of interest here as an appraiser - just a 996 owner. The $12K-$15k for 996's is not the norm - that is for bucket of bolts or super high mileage cars. I've had a car write down (deer) and State Farm gave me the mean avg between the high's and lows and then asked me for input (as in anything they missed). They based it upon mileage, condition and model options.

Avg prices for my 99 are only a little more then what I paid (five years ago) - which for 996 owners is pretty good. If I had a car that had a 5% return every year since I owned it - sure - I would look at agreed value. But I'm a realist. Unless 75% of 996's suddenly end up as pop cans - it will be decades before we reach even 964 values.

I'll say it again and someone prove me wrong: You cannot get something for nothing. I do agree with an appraisal if you own a car going up in value but I would combine that with a normal policy until or unless I could live up to the driving restrictions.

I asked specific use questions of the two major companies mentioned here and BOTH related to me that there were *restrictions*. One mentioned mileage the other didn't but all of them gave me examples of what types of driving they don't want you to do - the very same type of driving that I actually do.... They did not give me examples of how they would know what you're doing other then my suspicion that if you made a claim from Tail of the Dragon or Square One or a few thousand miles away the impression I got is that you would either be denied the claim or it would be your first and last claim under a Silver Wheels / Vintage policy - anywhere.

I look upon it like the 60 year old couple who fill out the Blue Cross form and don't really put down every aliment. They think they're good to go - that they are covered... until they make a claim. The company look carefully over this couples health records and bingo - claim denied. How much did they really save? We are talking about insurance companies right? An industry in Ontario that has never had a firm go under that writes auto polices. There is a reason for this...

I pay $100 a month and park my car for five months and pay $20 bucks for fire and theft for each of those five months. The net affect is $780 a year and I drive when and where I like without worry or fudging (I'm being kind) my driving use data.

CATA19

Is anyone insured through Echelon Insurance? A buddy of mine has his older vette insured by them through a broker. I just got a quote for $350 per year (through a broker) for my 99 996. Restrictions are nobody under 23 can drive the car, I can only do 5000 km a year, and I need an appraisal.

Anyone have any experience with them?

Turbodan

Echelon is a very good insurance company. They do the vintage insurance. Feel free to contact me if you would like a rennlist special price. Also be sure to use a PAVE member.

DRPM

Danny,
Pls PM if you know a PAVE or recommended appraiser in Montreal area.
I have one I used before and I'm interested to obtain a second opinion.
Thx
D

curtisr

Agreed. I want to be able to purchase a suitable policy without suppressing the truth. But perhaps things are looking up at Hegarty. I found this on their Canadian site:

Flexible Usage
Classic and collector cars were made to be driven. Whether you’re going to a show or just taking a cruise to the ice cream shop, you’re protected. If you have specific questions about your car or usage, please don’t hesitate to contact us.

Pags993

^ just make sure that same language is reflected in the policy fine print and in much more detail

Christien

Actually, the fine print contains none of these restrictions. My Hagerty Silver Wheels policy has no restrictions on use, other than to say "pleasure driving only". I've read it back to front.