Does anyone know an acceptable alternative to PCA's IDS?
03-12-2010, 03:11 PM
#16
Drifting
Thread Starter
Charlie, if you've already got that much experience under your belt, why bother with PCA? The IDS will be a nice brush-up on some basics, but not very exciting beyond that, and I think you'll find the green group to be frustratingly-slow. If you really want to drive with PCA, see if you can bypass IDS and green and go straight to yellow, where at least you won't be constantly stuck behind 10 cars going 60 km/h. Even in my 72 with 135 hp, last time I drove green I was going nuts - luckily they moved me up to yellow that day, which was better, but still had quite a few really slow people too nervous to allow me to pass. Not that there's anything wrong with that - those guys need a place to drive where they're comfortable - that was me not so long ago. But I'm past that now and it sounds like you may be, too.
I definitely have no problem starting in green, and am even open to going to the IDS day (if I do manage to get in). I'm getting the sense that PCA administrators take a lot of flack from people who missed the cut on registration for these schools: maybe a lot of people get angry when they can't get in (which is not my situation). In any case, I'll wait and see.
03-12-2010, 03:15 PM
#17
Race Car
Seems to me they've been overloaded with people in green and yellow for years, yet under-loaded (is that a word?) in the upper skill levels. I've heard it said before that the instructor group is populated by people who like to drive on the newbies' dimes (because they only pay half reg fees if they're instructing). I find that to be a little pessimistic, but there does seem to be a significant problem with overloading in the lower ranks with no desire to do anything about it (like schedule green/yellow only DEs, or a few extra IDS's) despite the fact that they're revenue-generating events.
03-12-2010, 03:21 PM
#18
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03-12-2010, 03:54 PM
#19
Rennlist Member
Seems to me they've been overloaded with people in green and yellow for years, yet under-loaded (is that a word?) in the upper skill levels. I've heard it said before that the instructor group is populated by people who like to drive on the newbies' dimes (because they only pay half reg fees if they're instructing). I find that to be a little pessimistic, but there does seem to be a significant problem with overloading in the lower ranks with no desire to do anything about it (like schedule green/yellow only DEs, or a few extra IDS's) despite the fact that they're revenue-generating events.
if they run more isds then there would be more overload for green/yellow.
the instructors do not get paid, they do devote a good portion of their day to instructing students so they do get a discount on track fees. this system has worked for a number of years now and I can't think of a better system for the club (not that I have anything to do with planning how track days are run).
03-12-2010, 04:11 PM
#20
Race Car
My suggestion was doing green/yellow only DEs at tracks like TMP, instructors don't drive but are paid, but students aren't with an instructor 100% of the time. Maybe first sessions are always with instructor, then some solo time, then back and forth like that. Too dangerous at Mosport, but at a safer track I think it would work.
03-12-2010, 04:28 PM
#21
Drifting
Thread Starter
My suggestion was doing green/yellow only DEs at tracks like TMP, instructors don't drive but are paid, but students aren't with an instructor 100% of the time. Maybe first sessions are always with instructor, then some solo time, then back and forth like that. Too dangerous at Mosport, but at a safer track I think it would work.
Interesting idea, though.
03-12-2010, 04:50 PM
#22
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How about instructor who need to do a few hours driving?? and taking days off of work?? It worth it to go drive the track and instruct other between your session, and have a discount for your day.. but I'm sure many would'nt do it just to go instruct at the track and not drive :P
03-12-2010, 05:25 PM
#24
Race Car
So of these IDS options, can anyone recommend the best one to do some DE in my 260Z, preferably during the week......want to get some experience before I put the 993tt GQ on the track.
03-12-2010, 05:28 PM
#25
Drifting
Thread Starter
Ronnie, is going to Shannonville an option? If so, I know of one coming up, and there will likely be a couple of Zs there. PM me, if you're interested.
03-12-2010, 05:29 PM
#26
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i have a lot of respect for the instructors I've had at PCA DE's and I've learned something everytime. But seeing the way some of the students drive, you've got to have nerves of steel and a cast iron stomach. I don't think I ever want to be promoted to instructor, the discount to attend wouldn't be worth the fear and diapers I'd go through!
03-12-2010, 05:39 PM
#27
Race Car
There already are trade offs. I can only speak for UCR, not all of PCA, but I will tell you that there are plenty of good instructors, even some excellent, but there are just as many mediocre, and even a few terrible ones. I had one instructor spend the whole time critiquing my car and problems with it, basically playing a "my d!ck is bigger than yours" game. Next time I did a UCR day I specifically said "not him, or I won't come".
03-12-2010, 06:21 PM
#28
Burning Brakes
I was accepted into the Green PCA with the BMW Advanced Driver II training certificate fwiw...
I did 4 PCA days... and I wasn't able to move up a colour! I was told that I needed to be more tame with my car and my right foot before moving up to a faster league... The instructor was right btw.
I did 4 PCA days... and I wasn't able to move up a colour! I was told that I needed to be more tame with my car and my right foot before moving up to a faster league... The instructor was right btw.
03-13-2010, 12:19 AM
#29
Drifting
Thread Starter
I was accepted into the Green PCA with the BMW Advanced Driver II training certificate fwiw...
I did 4 PCA days... and I wasn't able to move up a colour! I was told that I needed to be more tame with my car and my right foot before moving up to a faster league... The instructor was right btw.
I did 4 PCA days... and I wasn't able to move up a colour! I was told that I needed to be more tame with my car and my right foot before moving up to a faster league... The instructor was right btw.
No matter what the outcome of the waiting list, I'm determined to spend 10 days on track this summer. I certainly hope that many of them can be DE days.
03-17-2010, 09:55 PM
#30
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Try Dexter AutoSport - good bunch of people, great instructors, never seems too crowded, and great enforcement of the very few sensible rules. BTW, I have no connection with this organization, but after failing to get a slot at PCA's IDS 3 years in a row I gave up, and Dexter was recommended. This'll be my third year with Dexter.