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First DE with Harness Setup

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Old 03-19-2017, 01:42 PM
  #1
Hella-Buggin'
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Default First DE with Harness Setup

Wow, why did I wait so long?
I installed a Brey Kraus Harness Bar and Schroth 6 Point System with a Hans device to my GT3 seat in my 997 for DE driving. What a difference. SO much more comfortable and in tune with what the car is doing.
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Old 03-19-2017, 02:08 PM
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Smart move.

And no more bruised knees trying to brace yourself through the corners!
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Old 03-19-2017, 02:21 PM
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+1

I've been telling some friends this for about a year. No longer guessing whether YOU are sliding across the seat or the car is moving.
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Old 03-19-2017, 07:07 PM
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I held off for this long due to the kids still using the rear seat. The Harness bar is easy enough to install for track days. I realize it doesn't offer the safety of a roll bar but at my level it's more a comfort and fatigue reducer than a safety measure. If you're on the fence.... jump.
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Old 03-19-2017, 07:15 PM
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Hang on a second. You only added a harness bar to get your 6 point harness attached?

No roll bar?
You said: "I realize it doesn't offer the safety of a roll bar"

Its not the safety of a roll bar that you are "skipping". this can get you killed.
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Old 03-19-2017, 07:22 PM
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Originally Posted by dan212 View Post
Hang on a second. You added a harness bar to get your 6 point harness attached?

No roll bar?

This is beyond dangerous. Most tracks or groups would not allow this.
You are correct. Isn't that the point of a harness bar?

The guy I bought it from had run every track in the area with every group in the area in the advanced level before going with a roll bar.
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Old 03-19-2017, 07:39 PM
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Harness Bars were popular some years ago before people knew better. Yes - there are some cars with roll hoops (like a boxster), but thats because they are convertibles. No "A" and "B" pillar. Its not the same.

I think most PCA regions forbid harness bars - with good reason.

Here is why:
In a rollover, the roll bar will hold the car up. Without a roll bar and your body tightly strapped in, its your head holding the car up. You are safer with a 3 point in the absence of a proper roll bar for this reason.

Yes, 'A' and 'B' pillars are stronger than 20 years ago: Thanks to federal standards for street cars. Still not not a substitute for a roll bar.

Yes - a full harness has many advantages. Getting killed because you don't have a roll bar isn't one of them.
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Old 03-19-2017, 07:44 PM
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What Dan is referring to is your lack of roll over protection as you are now firmly strapped in your seat upright by the harness. If your roof gets crushed, you die.

A harness should always be combined with a roll bar or (best) a cage for your own protection.
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Old 03-19-2017, 07:54 PM
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Believe me when I say I hear what you're saying and that was a factor in me doing nothing for a long time.

-M


Originally Posted by dan212 View Post
Harness Bars were popular some years ago before people knew better. Yes - there are some cars with roll hoops (like a boxster), but thats because they are convertibles. No "A" and "B" pillar. Its not the same.

I think most PCA regions forbid harness bars - with good reason.

Here is why:
In a rollover, the roll bar will hold the car up. Without a roll bar and your body tightly strapped in, its your head holding the car up. You are safer with a 3 point in the absence of a proper roll bar for this reason.

Yes, 'A' and 'B' pillars are stronger than 20 years ago: Thanks to federal standards. Still not not a substitute for a roll bar.

Yes - a full harness has many advantages. Getting killed because you don't have a roll bar isn't one of them.
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Old 03-19-2017, 09:05 PM
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Originally Posted by dan212 View Post

I think most PCA regions forbid harness bars - with good reason.
I know from experience that this is not true - most PCA regions in the northeast will allow properly installed/engineered harness bars (assuming the harness is also properly mounted and driver and instructor have comparable setups).

As for whether a harness/HANS/harness bar is safer than just the factory 3-point belts, it's been debated here many times before - and I believe the answer is not cut and dried.

In my view, if the car rolls over and lands in such a manner where the roof is meaningfully impacted inwards, I do not believe you can roll or duck away from the roof with a 3-point belt to avoid head injury (to prove the point - how quickly can you do a sit-up - then think about how quickly you could do that upside down in a rolling car...).

And more generally, in any accident short of a rollover, a properly anchored/placed harness will keep the driver safer than just 3-pt belts.
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Old 03-20-2017, 12:10 AM
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Originally Posted by dan212 View Post
In a rollover, the roll bar will hold the car up. Without a roll bar and your body tightly strapped in, its your head holding the car up. You are safer with a 3 point in the absence of a proper roll bar for this reason.
+1
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Old 03-20-2017, 01:42 AM
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Are you serious? A 6 point belt attatched to a harness bar is not safety. You need a roll bar to ensure safety. First comes the roll bar, then comes the 6 point harness, not the other way around. If you roll, which I've seen happen, your head will be crushed. The roof will crush. You also need a Hans device attached to your helmet to protect your neck. You do not skimp on safety.
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Old 03-20-2017, 08:28 AM
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I'd certainly echo the rollover comments. This is my car from a few years ago. We were wearing stock seat belts. My instructor was pushed toward the center of the car and had exceedingly minor injuries.

Originally Posted by Cuda911 View Post


​​​​​​​
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Old 03-20-2017, 09:03 AM
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As a compromise, G-Force makes a strap that helps hold you between the bolsters of your seat while wearing a 3 Point harness.

Amazon Amazon

Helped with the sliding and was cheap enough to buy and try.
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Old 03-20-2017, 09:52 AM
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Originally Posted by DTMiller
I'd certainly echo the rollover comments. This is my car from a few years ago. We were wearing stock seat belts. My instructor was pushed toward the center of the car and had exceedingly minor injuries.​​​​​​​
Wow, that's an ad for a roll bar if I've ever seen one.

I am going into my second year of DE. I just purchased a roll bar as well as seats and harnesses for my Cayman.

Wound you mind recounting how that incident happened?

Just curious
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