Towing... can you feel a 500lb difference?
02-03-2017 | 12:51 PM
#16
Rennlist Member
Joined: Oct 2008
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Here is my towing setup... Trailer is 1350 dry, car is 3100. I am at 4,450 pounds. The Macan is rated for 5,600 pounds braked, 1,650 pounds unbraked. For this setup it is absolutely ideal. It is also rated for 4 Adults so factor in 1 driver at 150 pounds and I have plenty of overhead for gear. My tongue wait is 180 pounds with the car perfectly balanced on the axles so I am adding a custom tire rack that will sit below the Macan's roof line as well. I can tell you that I never lack for power, regardless of terrain/conditions. As ExMB mentioned though, that is a total consideration of myself, weight in vehicle, weight being towed and tongue weight together, not just weight of the trailer/car and maximum capacity...
Interestingly enough I did a trip to JPC to drop my car off for it's cage last week and sitting at 80 most of the way even up and down through the hills I got 15.2 MPG out of that Macan... AND it did a 1:39 on Thunderbolt... So yeah, it's capable lol.
Interestingly enough I did a trip to JPC to drop my car off for it's cage last week and sitting at 80 most of the way even up and down through the hills I got 15.2 MPG out of that Macan... AND it did a 1:39 on Thunderbolt... So yeah, it's capable lol.
I'm also
by your tongue weight as that seems very low for the amount of weight you are towing.
02-03-2017 | 01:10 PM
#17
Burning Brakes
Joined: Dec 2015
Posts: 1,068
Likes: 120
Interesting you mention the Macan's tow rating. In this thread they show a different number. Porsche tow spec
I'm also by your tongue weight as that seems very low for the amount of weight you are towing.
I'm also
by your tongue weight as that seems very low for the amount of weight you are towing.
Funny thing is I still carry the 4 pages of my manual that discusses weights and towing in the back of the truck. I printed them when I first started towing lol. I've towed from NJ to Watkins Glen, tow to NJMP repeatedly, brought it up through the hills to Stroudsburg last week and it was never once lacking for pulling or stopping power. Probably done 5k miles of towing with it so far. I usually carry myself and my gear, maybe 300 pounds in the truck so 4550 in the truck and 4450 on the trailer. Total weight is 9,000, over 1,600 under maximum combination... So if Towing max is really 4,400 I would be hard pressed to fit another 1,600 in the truck lol. I think the roof is 200 pounds max
Last edited by Paul Solk; 02-03-2017 at 02:37 PM.
02-03-2017 | 02:36 PM
#18
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Joined: Mar 2009
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You probably will feel it braking and at turn in, and then some amount of understeer at the apex. 
Seriously though, you will want to make sure you max-out your tongue weight, and in my experience with a short wheel base vehicle like the X5, if the ratio is under 10% it really makes things feel unstable. For that reason, I balance my loaded trailer so I am always at or slightly over the max tongue weight (within reason). If you are trying to pull a load that does not give you at last a 10% ratio, then you are definitely going to feel it at speed, lane changes, in the rain, or in the wind. I know in europe that ratio recommendation is very different (lower), which is, I'm assuming, part of the reason their tow ratings tend to be much higher than in the US.
The macan, cayenne, and x5 are not short on brakes or power, especially in the tricked out versions - it's the vehicle GVW that limits things -> the tongue capacity.
Seriously though, you will want to make sure you max-out your tongue weight, and in my experience with a short wheel base vehicle like the X5, if the ratio is under 10% it really makes things feel unstable. For that reason, I balance my loaded trailer so I am always at or slightly over the max tongue weight (within reason). If you are trying to pull a load that does not give you at last a 10% ratio, then you are definitely going to feel it at speed, lane changes, in the rain, or in the wind. I know in europe that ratio recommendation is very different (lower), which is, I'm assuming, part of the reason their tow ratings tend to be much higher than in the US.
The macan, cayenne, and x5 are not short on brakes or power, especially in the tricked out versions - it's the vehicle GVW that limits things -> the tongue capacity.
02-03-2017 | 02:39 PM
#19
Racer
Joined: Jul 2015
Posts: 279
Likes: 7
The Highlander is built on a Camry frame so it has smaller "car size" brakes, axles, frame rails, etc. It also has a class III trailer hitch with a max tongue weight of 500 lbs.
Tongue weight should be 10-15% of loaded trailer weight (400-450 lbs in your case), so you are getting close to the limit with either trailer. Another problem will be the tail down, nose up attitude your Highlander will adopt with that much weight on the hitch, which adds another unsafe element to the equation.
Of course you can install a higher rated hitch, air bags, etc., to mitigate some of these problems, but you'll still be stuck with barely adequate brakes and axle and next to no reserves if anything bad happens. Your call.
Tongue weight should be 10-15% of loaded trailer weight (400-450 lbs in your case), so you are getting close to the limit with either trailer. Another problem will be the tail down, nose up attitude your Highlander will adopt with that much weight on the hitch, which adds another unsafe element to the equation.
Of course you can install a higher rated hitch, air bags, etc., to mitigate some of these problems, but you'll still be stuck with barely adequate brakes and axle and next to no reserves if anything bad happens. Your call.
02-03-2017 | 02:47 PM
#21
Burning Brakes
Joined: Dec 2015
Posts: 1,068
Likes: 120
You probably will feel it braking and at turn in, and then some amount of understeer at the apex.
Seriously though, you will want to make sure you max-out your tongue weight, and in my experience with a short wheel base vehicle like the X5, if the ratio is under 10% it really makes things feel unstable. For that reason, I balance my loaded trailer so I am always at or slightly over the max tongue weight (within reason). If you are trying to pull a load that does not give you at last a 10% ratio, then you are definitely going to feel it at speed, lane changes, in the rain, or in the wind. I know in europe that ratio recommendation is very different (lower), which is, I'm assuming, part of the reason their tow ratings tend to be much higher than in the US.
Seriously though, you will want to make sure you max-out your tongue weight, and in my experience with a short wheel base vehicle like the X5, if the ratio is under 10% it really makes things feel unstable. For that reason, I balance my loaded trailer so I am always at or slightly over the max tongue weight (within reason). If you are trying to pull a load that does not give you at last a 10% ratio, then you are definitely going to feel it at speed, lane changes, in the rain, or in the wind. I know in europe that ratio recommendation is very different (lower), which is, I'm assuming, part of the reason their tow ratings tend to be much higher than in the US.
02-03-2017 | 02:53 PM
#22
Thread Starter
Registered User
Joined: Nov 2003
Posts: 544
Likes: 2
From: racine, wisconsin
The Highlander is built on a Camry frame so it has smaller "car size" brakes, axles, frame rails, etc. It also has a class III trailer hitch with a max tongue weight of 500 lbs.
Tongue weight should be 10-15% of loaded trailer weight (400-450 lbs in your case), so you are getting close to the limit with either trailer. Another problem will be the tail down, nose up attitude your Highlander will adopt with that much weight on the hitch, which adds another unsafe element to the equation.
Of course you can install a higher rated hitch, air bags, etc., to mitigate some of these problems, but you'll still be stuck with barely adequate brakes and axle and next to no reserves if anything bad happens. Your call.
Tongue weight should be 10-15% of loaded trailer weight (400-450 lbs in your case), so you are getting close to the limit with either trailer. Another problem will be the tail down, nose up attitude your Highlander will adopt with that much weight on the hitch, which adds another unsafe element to the equation.
Of course you can install a higher rated hitch, air bags, etc., to mitigate some of these problems, but you'll still be stuck with barely adequate brakes and axle and next to no reserves if anything bad happens. Your call.
So with the trailex I would be at 3900lbs or so... Sounds better?
Not trying to be unsafe...
02-03-2017 | 03:54 PM
#23
Three Wheelin'
Joined: Nov 2004
Posts: 1,666
Likes: 174
From: Fremont, CA
Had some Culver's custard in Sarasota this week-- not as good as Kopps. Perhaps some Danish Kringle for SB pre-game brunch if they have it at TJ's...
Anyway,I have a Trailex enclosed and pull it with a 2100 pound car inside using my gen 1 Tundra. My trailer weighs about 1600 pounds.
I agree there are a lot of variables. But I cannot imagine a technical downside with a lighter trailer that is well made like the Trailex products. I am sure there are good experiences with Featherlite as well.
I bought my Trailex enclosed used in 2001. It was less than 5 years old when I bought it, and I expect I can get what I paid for it if I sell it.
Through the years I have had some questions and needed a few parts, and I have always had great support from Trailex-- specifically Carl Carbon. If he is still at Trailex, it may be good to try to speak to him directly with some of your questions. They are in OH which isn't that far away from Racine.
Trailex haas sponsored PCA Club Racing for a really long time, and I for one appreciate that greatly. And I have been very happy with my relatively light trailer.
Anyway,I have a Trailex enclosed and pull it with a 2100 pound car inside using my gen 1 Tundra. My trailer weighs about 1600 pounds.
I agree there are a lot of variables. But I cannot imagine a technical downside with a lighter trailer that is well made like the Trailex products. I am sure there are good experiences with Featherlite as well.
I bought my Trailex enclosed used in 2001. It was less than 5 years old when I bought it, and I expect I can get what I paid for it if I sell it.
Through the years I have had some questions and needed a few parts, and I have always had great support from Trailex-- specifically Carl Carbon. If he is still at Trailex, it may be good to try to speak to him directly with some of your questions. They are in OH which isn't that far away from Racine.
Trailex haas sponsored PCA Club Racing for a really long time, and I for one appreciate that greatly. And I have been very happy with my relatively light trailer.
02-03-2017 | 04:54 PM
#24
Thread Starter
Registered User
Joined: Nov 2003
Posts: 544
Likes: 2
From: racine, wisconsin
Ok, looks like I will just buy new.... Got the info from Trailex...
New trailer is $5300, shipping is $300, so $5600. Spare tire is $200...tire rack is $600 (will pass on that for now, can always add later).
I gotta say, given that info, scratching my head on why used ones go for $4500+, when brand new is only $1000 more with new tires, brakes, warranty, etc...
Used is used, no?
New trailer is $5300, shipping is $300, so $5600. Spare tire is $200...tire rack is $600 (will pass on that for now, can always add later).
I gotta say, given that info, scratching my head on why used ones go for $4500+, when brand new is only $1000 more with new tires, brakes, warranty, etc...
Used is used, no?
02-03-2017 | 05:08 PM
#25
Rennlist Member
Joined: Mar 2009
Posts: 5,661
Likes: 964
Ok, looks like I will just buy new.... Got the info from Trailex...
New trailer is $5300, shipping is $300, so $5600. Spare tire is $200...tire rack is $600 (will pass on that for now, can always add later).
I gotta say, given that info, scratching my head on why used ones go for $4500+, when brand new is only $1000 more with new tires, brakes, warranty, etc...
Used is used, no?
New trailer is $5300, shipping is $300, so $5600. Spare tire is $200...tire rack is $600 (will pass on that for now, can always add later).
I gotta say, given that info, scratching my head on why used ones go for $4500+, when brand new is only $1000 more with new tires, brakes, warranty, etc...
Used is used, no?
02-03-2017 | 05:28 PM
#26
Thread Starter
Registered User
Joined: Nov 2003
Posts: 544
Likes: 2
From: racine, wisconsin
02-03-2017 | 11:37 PM
#30
Burning Brakes
Joined: Sep 2002
Posts: 787
Likes: 11
From: Connecticut
Ok, looks like I will just buy new.... Got the info from Trailex...
New trailer is $5300, shipping is $300, so $5600. Spare tire is $200...tire rack is $600 (will pass on that for now, can always add later).
I gotta say, given that info, scratching my head on why used ones go for $4500+, when brand new is only $1000 more with new tires, brakes, warranty, etc...
Used is used, no?
New trailer is $5300, shipping is $300, so $5600. Spare tire is $200...tire rack is $600 (will pass on that for now, can always add later).
I gotta say, given that info, scratching my head on why used ones go for $4500+, when brand new is only $1000 more with new tires, brakes, warranty, etc...
Used is used, no?