snakeii

?

Bill L Seifert

Stock engine, not very, depends on the part of the country. I am fairly competitive in the midwest, of Memphis, St. Louis, but definitely not in the southeast. (Rd Atlanta, Daytona, etc. We were fastest 944 at Gingerman, but the BMW's blew us away. Building a 944S might help, but I have yet to see one. (I am building one this winter, so I'll see, and keep you all posted.) My record in 6 races this year, is two 1sts, one second, one third, one fourth, and one DNF. The fastest ones are from the NE (Milledge engines) But those engines are expensive.($15,000) A friend built an engine with the help of Memphis Motorworks, but it has not raced yet.

In Florida talk to Nort Northam at the Northam Collection (A high end used car lot in Orlando.) Phone number should be in the book.) He seems to be one or the fastest in Fla, and he is a real nice guy. He also rents cars.

Bill Seifert
1987 944 Race Car (ITS)

MJR911

There is a Broadfoot ITS car for sale that "looks" really competitive, for something like $8,000! Of course i've never seen the car, just read the writeup.

Is this a competitive car? .... can't beat the price i'd say, if the workmanship is on par.

http://hometown.aol.com/pcaracer/944ITScar.html

Bill L Seifert

I agree with MJR, the price seems right. You sure can't buy a decent car, and make it a race car for $8,000. Even at that, it would be totally uncompetitive. Also Broadfoot is another guy that knows what he is doing. Unlike Nort, I have never talked personally to Broadfoot, but I have seen him around for years, and he seems good. But, always check out any car you want to buy, even if the Pope is selling it.

Good luck

Bill Seifert
1987 944 Race Car

87924GT

Snakeii,
Where are you located in Fl? The best Porsche prep. in the Southeast is probably here in the Winter Park/Orlando area. Stratton Motorsports built and maintains Norts car which by the way is a 924S with GT Racing rear flares, 944 front fenders and a very stout running gear. I should know because I had Gary and Jason Stratton build one for me as my daily driver. My car has 7.5 & 9 X 17's all around with TurboS bars and Yellow adj. Konis. They threw their over 30 years of knowledge and a rollbar into my car and I could not be happier!!
Contact Gary (father) @ 407-421-1911 or Jay (son) @ 407-497-9944 and they will be very, very helpful. Pretty cool phone numbers, huh!
Regards,
Steve E
Tell them "ILEAN" gave you their numbers.

Geo

That thing is so illegal for ITS it isn't even funny. I've yet to see a Broadfoot ITS 944 that was legal.

Bill L Seifert

Geo Now you tell me. I should have known that last year. But with them finishing 18th in class and me 23rd, I guess it wouldn't have been worth the protest fee. Snakeii- see what kind of uphill battle you are going to have. You might want to think about moving up here (Tenn). We don't do too awfully bad, But Nort finished 6th in ITS at Daytona this last summer, so I guess there is hope, no matter how slim. Lotsa luck. By the way, I think Nort runs a regular 924S in some ITS races, I know one of his I ran against in 2002 was a Black 924S, not his car that mostly runs HSR events, the one talked about above.

Bill

MJR911

Geo,

How has he run such cars (Broadfoot) all these years? I have seen similar cars for sale by him numerous times, and assumed he's preparing them to the limit but not blatenly cheating.

I am unfimilar with SCCA, but why publically advertise such a car if its that illegal?

Geo

1) The turbo crank is illegal - only a stock 2.5l crank would be legal
2) The cam is illegal - only a stock cam is legal
3) The underdrive pulleys are illegal if the crank pulley has been changed to an aluminum pulley (I'll bet it has) - the crank pulley must be made from the same material as stock if it is changed
4) The billet alternator mount is illegal - this is not a performance advantage (except perhaps a reliability advantage), but only the factory A/C delete bracket is legal
5) The 968 oil filter bracket is illegal - only the stock 2.5l bracket would be legal
6) The turbo "S" halfshafts are illegal - only stock 2.5l 8v halfshafts would be legal on this car
7) The low mass flywheel is illegal - the flywheel may only be balanced with only enough material removed to balance
8) Rear coilovers are illegal - only the same type and number of springs in the stock location are legal, in this case only T-bars
9) Threaded body coilovers are illegal


This is just from what is listed, but most have a definite performance advantage over the legal components. Furthermore none of these could be considered grey areas.

I'm not trying to give Mr. Broadfoot a black eye. I've seen illegal Broadfoot cars for sale before and haven't said anything. In this case, since it was brought up here, I'd hate for someone to not only buy an illegal car, but one that would require considerable expenditure to make legal.

Bill L Seifert

Geo

I agree with most of what you said about the car. I did not read the sale thing on ebay. But, The bilet alt mount may be ok. But why the heck would they make one when the factory one is only $125, and works fine. I have had mine for 5 years, bought it from Brumos, and have had no problems. The 968 oil filter bracket may fall into where it says the location of the oil filter and accumulator are unrestricted. On the threaded body coilovers, it says in ITCS-14 para 3 that spacers including threaded units with adjustable spring seats, may be used with coil springs, provided the spacers are not permanently attached to the strut housing. Most of the units I have seen meet that criteria. I use stock stuff, because I orriginally set the car up for PCA. But they eventually oked the threaded spacers, but I had already built my car, and never changed it. Mine works ok, but I could use stiffer springs. The rest of the stuff, no question is illegal, if it can be proved, some would be easy to prove, some not so easy. But I agree with you, why take the chance.

Bill

Bill L Seifert

By the way, I went on ebay to see the specs on the car we are talking about, and I couldn't find it. Was it somewhere else besides with the 944's or has it already been sold, which would make it a moot point. Oh well, to snakeii, either move to a place where 944's are competitive, which by next year could be northern Alaska, or bring bushels, and bushels of money, or buy a competitive RX7 or BMW.

also, did you know the 1968-73 911T's and E's are okayed for that class. I know a guy with a 911T, and he was moderately competitive in the mid-west, I'll bet an E would do lots better, but I am not going to spend the money to find out. The only thing that bothers me about the 911's is that no rear spoiler is allowed.

Bill

Bill

snakeii

Wow, good information.

Bill, I give Nort a call.

87924GT, I am in North Florida, so I will also talk to Stratton.

I am not sure if I got ahead of myself or not with SCCA. Ideally I wanted a car that I could do some DE's and club racing, then the following year SCCA. It would be ideal to do that with the same car and not end up buying and selling. The 944 was attractive to the budget so I wondered how well it would compete in SCCA ITS.

But for a Porsche I guess it's either that or a 911 bumps me into GT territory?

Geo

Ah, you are most correct. I forgot about that.

But the ad specifically stated threaded body coilovers. These are the sort that are expressly forbidden, not to mention that rear coilovers on a 944 are also forbidden. Interestingly enough, a threaded body damper not used as a coilover is legal per the wording today. This makes them legal on the 944 since they are not used as coilovers.

Geo

Actually, there is an early 911 that has been classified for ITS as well. I'm not sure the specs are 100% correct yet however. It could be a very competitive car given the low weight.