rlets

Howdy! Looking for opinions on setup of my 944 track toy. I recently put spherical bearings up front and now have more front grip than rear. Sway bars are maxed out so I'm looking at two options: increasing front spring rate or staggering the tires.

Tires are currently 255s on 17x9 wheels front and back which I like for rotation. But there's lots of room in back and 245/275 on 8.5"/10" staggered wheels is an option.

Springs are 450 lb coilovers up front with 30mm torsion bars and 100 lb coilover helpers in back. I could remove the helpers or put stiffer springs up front. If the latter, what percentage increase is a good step? I have a lot of front bar I could take out.

Appreciate any thoughts.
Rich

KaiB

What/where is the car doing that you don't want it to do?

rlets

Oversteer! With the additional front grip from the monoballs, the car steps out in the rear under braking, turning and power. Sway bars are maxed so I need to adjust balance another way.

Rich

LuigiVampa

Once I went to a staggered setup on my 944T it drove much better and cured some oversteer I was experiencing. I also went from 16s to 18s. Much more expensive but the car handled much better.

mark kibort

absolutely start with getting a larger tire in the rear. 255 and 275 front to rear would be a good start!... you could actually squeeze a 275 on a 9"rim with out too much fuss and check out the change, but the best set up would be the 255 with the 275 on the rear on a 10" rim. the 10" rim can easily fit a 305 if you can make some room back there.

333pg333

Doesn't make sense to me. These cars have built in understeer. Going to a square setup has always been one of the first things to do to achieve decent balance. Especially in slow to medium corners. You can certainly run bigger wheels/tyres all round but going staggered seems a step backwards to me. If you have your rear sway bar on full, soften it off and this will almost certainly cure the rear stepping out. I ran 275 x 18" on 10" all round with success both on and off the track.

rlets

It's the first thing I did. But...

The rear bar is full soft and the front full stiff. So stiffer front springs? 10% stiffer? 20%?

Rich

KaiB

Hate to ask, but is your alignment really right?

All of this must be in order, and correctly so, before any other adjustment are made.

rlets

Good question, KaiB. And yes, alignment is fresh and spot on. Same shop and tech used these same settings at my prior alignment and the balance was great. I've just now finished installing a power steering rack and put in monoballs up front at the same time. No changes were done to the rear so it makes sense to have the added front grip.

Thanks for the thoughts to go with a bigger tire in the back. And good to hear another advocate of running square. I'm still torn...

Rich

onefastviking

So much potential with various variables here it's hard to say for sure.
However, new and correct alignment may be the correct answer as Kai suggested, since you changed from rubber bushings to Monoballs you are no longer getting any play or deflection from the front end (thus your better grip), this would require an alignment change for proper compensation.

Yes, tires, stagger, sways, and much more can also fix it, but look at what you've changed and the dynamics of it all.

Good luck and let us know how you fix it.

Horizontally Opposed Man

Fix the end that isn't working !

Matt Romanowski

How were the bushings? Was there a lot of friction in the front before (binding friction not bushing friction)? I've seen cars that had so much binding in the bushings that it starts to act like additional spring rate.

333pg333

I would agree. Need to do the Elephant PolyBronze and Racers Edge rear bearing/bushing replacement in my opinion. I think by just putting in over large rear tyres is masking the situation and a Band-Aid fix. These cars usually have push understeer so by trying to cure the rear breaking loose by more rubber won't help turn in for hairpins etc. Might be a way to go on a temp basis. You could play with springs too. But if you also have an issue under brakes then that would be something else to look at too.

rlm328

What are your tire pressures front and back? Hot and cold.

rlets

The bushings up front were pretty bad, noticeable resistance to movement. And the castor blocks were the old kind with the larger rubber bit. That's all RE spherical bearings now. The car already had RE spherical bearings in the rear control arms and poly bushings in the spring plates. That stuff was done a while back.

Rich